Fascism and the Republican Party

Fogdog said:

The effect (if any) illegal immigrants have on wages is so small that it can't be reliably measured.

https://www.npr.org/2017/08/04/541321716/fact-check-have-low-skilled-immigrants-taken-american-jobs

But that's not why wages for blue collar workers have been held down for the past few decades. "Unscrupulous politicians" are using the issue of illegal immigrants as a scapegoat. We both know why wages for blue collar workers has not tracked the economic growth in the country. Or at least you did at one time.

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ttystikk said:

You seem to have trouble making the distinction between facts and how people perceive things. How people perceive things drives their beliefs and behavior, whether it's true or not.

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BudmanTX said:

MAGA and Repug won't, they have no desire to.....for them it's just a platform and a talking point. If (and i use "if" strongly here) they did immigration reform would have be passed a long time ago, and the thing dealing with immigration would have been fixed......but nooooo MAGA and the Repugs don't want that...all they wanna do is point fingers

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BudmanTX said:

keep in mind there is alot of blue collar people who don't want those jobs, they are look for something cushy and easy, meanwhile migrant in a sense are willing to get in that hole to dig a ditch, who are willing to go on a roof to fix it, who are willing to walk in a field to pick crops......the surprise is they are getting a nice wage to go with it, most get anywhere to 10 to 15 and hour, they get breaks etc etc.......

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CANON_Grow said:

I believe it is far more nefarious than just a talking point. It is a really effective tool they use to divide people with and get that tribal instinct to kick in.


This is a perfect example of what they will point to in their effort to divide groups that really should be aligned. There is no concern about contradicting themselves or not making sense, the only goal is divide and get tribal. They'll go to the blue collar folk and say this group here is calling you lazy and overpaid. Do that with everything and everyone, find one wedge issue and break them into a smaller group. Abortion, LGBTQ+ rights, indigenous history, BLM, Islam, climate change, etc, etc.

Create the wedge and let the groups attack each other. We saw it happen with Muslims and BLM. It's happening with environmental issues, oil/gas and coal workers, see the fairly recent the rail strike. They'll go to those workers and convince (even just a few) that everyone else is against them, that people are blaming them for climate change, that everyone else is trying to steal their food and housing.

They will keep twisting the narrative and eventually an Afro-Cuban is leading the proud boys, aligning with white nationalists and neo-Nazi's, and Kanye is praising Hitler. Really easy and unbelievably effective, divide and conquer.

***I trust you understand this is not directed at you @BudmanTX, in no way am I saying you are an issue or that I have a problem with you or what you said. It was just an example of how we get divided, and it turned into a bit of a rant. Apologies in advance if taken the wrong way.

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cannabineer said:

I can’t fault them. Looking at Wiki, your January average daily temp is 17.9.

This falls below the Minimum Tolerable Temperature of 25,
and flirts dangerously with the Minimum Survivable Temperature of 15,
at which coconut oil is rock-solid.

To a Pacific Islander, whose lifetime was spent in the narrow band of 24 to 32, and who have a word for 26 degrees that roughly translates as The Cold That Makes Nipples Unhappy, all y’all are a wayward sliver of Antarctica.

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Lucky Luke said:

Id happily live in the 27-40 band. 30+ is swimming weather.
But on the flip side i do enjoy a nice fire.

Back to migrant workers. Just pay them the min going rate. If they get the jobs its because the locals either don't want the jobs or their are not enough locals to fill all the jobs- win/win.

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cannabineer said:

“Going rate” is not the same as minimum wage. These folks are working and getting paid off-book.

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Lucky Luke said:

Should be same or more- more is good.
I've always had a good portion of my income off the books. Cash is king. Use it before we lose it.

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Skillcraft said:

All you have to do is look at El Paso to see what problems arise from illegal border crossings. It has become a humanitarian crisis not to mention that it is draining the budget in the Texas. Not all immigrants take advantage of public assistance programs but many do. Not all immigrants are criminals but some are. Although I would say it is a very small percentage. We cannot afford as a nation to allow everyone who wants to come here come. Especially not by the 100s of thousands. It is a shame that it has to come down to money but it does.

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Texas AG claims immigrants cost the state 'billions.' He's flat-out wrong.

Studies have repeatedly found that immigrants pay taxes and contribute heavily to the country’s revenue.

americanindependent.com

Fogdog said:

Nobody is talking about an open border so forget that bit about allowing everyone to come here.

The question was: What problem in Texas is so bad that a person should die if they attempt to cross the border? You made a lot of points. I'll address each one.

It has become a humanitarian crisis
Surely you aren't saying people should die on those death traps because illegal border crossings are creating a humanitarian crisis.

it is draining the budget in the Texas

Texas AG claims immigrants cost the state 'billions.' He's flat-out wrong.

Studies have repeatedly found that immigrants pay taxes and contribute heavily to the country’s revenue.

americanindependent.com

"A May 2020 cost-benefit assessment of undocumented immigrants in Texas by Rice University’s Baker Institute for Public Policy estimated that the revenue Texas received from undocumented immigrants was more than the benefits that the state provided them. In fiscal year 2018, the state’s net gain was around $420.9 million."

Most illegal immigrants came to the US to work and most do. Nearly all pay taxes and very few take advantage of social welfare programs. What you said right there was a lie fed to you by Texas Republicans. If "draining the budget" is your justification for those death traps then your justification is based on a lie.

Not all immigrants take advantage of public assistance programs but many do. Not all immigrants are criminals but some are. Although I would say it is a very small percentage
It is indeed true that a very small percentage of illegal immigrants commit crimes or take advantage of public assistance so I don't know how this justifies Abbot's death traps in the river.

We cannot afford as a nation to allow everyone who wants to come here come.
I don't disagree. No serious person is talking about establishing an open border with Mexico. I'm just saying that death traps on the border are an excessive use of force and there are nonlethal alternatives. I think we agree that state sanctioned murder is wrong and I don't see any distinction between a firing squad or deadly buoys in the river.

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Skillcraft said:

As far as the death traps Abbott installed I do not approve of them. My reasons may be different than yours but at least we agree. Not one life lost is acceptable at the border. When I say all lives matter to me I mean that. My grandkids are of black and Mexican descent. My in laws are from Mexico but they came here legally. It took them 6 years to be approved if my memory serves me. That is entirely too long. Now where we disagree is that you want to blame the barriers or the people who had them installed and I say some of the blame has to rest with the people who attempt to cross them.

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DIY-HP-LED said:

It seems outing domestic terrorists is enough to get them fired and generally ruin their lives. I figured citizens would be joining these groups with the intention of ratting them out, I mean are they ashamed of what they did and what they are? Being a racist asshole has consequences when good people find out they are an asshole. If you want to show up on the street to harass and make war on minorities with weapons, shields and masks to hide your identity, then suffer the consequences of war, including espionage. Every journalist in America would be subject to a lawsuit if they won the suit I suppose, because he was acting as a journalist when he PUBLISHED their names.

Don't they believe in what they are doing enough to do it with an open face? Do they think it is acceptable to their communities?

5 white nationalists sue Seattle man for allegedly leaking their identities

Five people affiliated with a white nationalist hate group are suing a Seattle-area man who they say infiltrated the group and disclosed their identities online, leading them to lose their jobs and face harassment.

apnews.com

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