Female Spliced to Male, Experimental

smokey de bear said:

SO yesterday I found 2 more males so i tried the same cut as the picture and wow what a difference, lot's of gooey contact green on green. I just cut an angled slit to the woody part and cut my clone stem on almost 20 degree angle so it would be flush to the male stem and point up. Then i scarified the back side of 20 degree so some goeyness would come out there too and make contact with the flap from the stem cut, this method allowed me to jam it in there nice barely used tape it was wedged pretty tight on it's own lol. Now I was thinking of this yesterday to speed up harvesting why no graft a bunch of female clones all up the stem an whatever spacing intervals you want, no more stretching lol if they do just graft another branch in between. and then switch to 12/12 right away so theoreticaly you would have one big female with lots of smaller clones all in the time of rooting or in our case the roots grafting as opposed to veggin em out.

My next experiment will be on a female after harvest, because I train em lots I get these nice fat stems in the end in the shape of a X I was wondering about putting a graft in each tip so it's like growing 4 in a pot. If all this becomes easy to do I can see myself continuously reusing roots, lol why grow em out when you can just attach the next on on to use the established system.

Click to expand...

Sounds like a plan....

Im gunna haftoo put my experiments on hold for a week or two... but after that..
Im gunna go full force, this is gunna be fun!!

Yea all together I bought 10 seeds, 6 grew out, 3 were male so it sounds pretty much right except for the only 6 sprouted I usually have a pretty good track record for sprouting stuff. But either way my room went from fullish to all experiments but 1 lol, hope they go because right now my male clones are going an not my females so I do not wanna have to go get more seeds cause I ran out of females lol damn room constraints.

ddimebag said:

perhaps you could use a few drops of molten candle wax to seal the slit on the stem? That would close it off from bacteria/fungi and prevent water loss...i don't think the brief heat will damage the cutting or the host plant...

Click to expand...

That is a kick ass idea and totally the right answer I do believe...paraffin wax...easy to get and safe...They use it on large indoor potted plants like small palms and such to restrict growth...they will essentially top the little tree and then cover the wound with paraffin so it has to form new branches...because a tree with just keep growing a branch from the cut place when you cut the top off...whereas MJ automatically grows out it's sides if you take the top...Anyway...paraffin wax awesome Idea! Hey dilly---try this for real!

Thedillestpickle said:

Nice one smokey, I didnt mention it before but I actually made a second attempt at grafting another cutting and it flopped over and clearly died within about 2 hours.... so if yours still looks as perky as that in 2 hours I'm sure you can expect the cutting to at least hold on for a few days. I like what you described about wedging the cutting between the two layers of of the plant, hopefully that works.

I think we now see how it really should be done, with those pictures. Armed with this info success should be inevitable. The harvested plant rootzone grafting is what I'm really interested in, hopefully someone has some almost ready for harvest plants and is willing to give this a try for us. Otherwise I'm expecting to my own harvest to be 15 weeks from now and I will make an effort at that time.

Unfortunately I have no more space for more experiments, I still have 8 extremely healthy clones that have been veggin along nicely for 2 weeks, and I don't know what to do with them.

Click to expand...

So, hopefully in a couple weeks I am feeling I might get to harvest...I would be interested in trying this...So I would take a clone as per the usual, but kinda slice the edges down to make a v? and then slide that V into a slice in the trunk of the freshly harvested roots...yes? Here is the issue I see...there is a good bit of flowering what not in my used soil...but with a big root system can a small clone handle all the nutes? I use organic soil with soil amendments, so I don't flush...I can't really...it doesn't work...only makes the issue worse...anyway...there is going to be a lot LOT of potassiuma nd phosphorous...cuz I add as much as I can the closer to harvest we get...

Missnu, my cutting never burned at all, but it didnt really live either so I can't say. That rootzone was in pretty high EC

I think you got it, just slice it like a V and try to make maximum contact with no air bubbles

I think I read somewhere to mix in 10% beeswax to 90 parafin. But I might just get some of that special glue

When i top or take clones from a plant and the stem is hollow..
I put a piece of painters tape on it so as to not allow Bacteria, etc.. inside...
Since this has no ill effect, i would assume that the wax wouldn't either...
Also on the rare occasion that a branch has broken off, i just duct tape it back on...
And i mean completely broken off with a bud on it and everything, and it heals perfectly...

But if you can get the Grafting Glue/ Tree Wound Compound i would at least try it..
I mean what better than something specially formulated for what your doing....

I use organic soil as well, and its pretty hot for the most part....
Ill let you know how my Graft to an established root zone is fairing in a few hours when i check it out....
Pics will be included....

So today I went to check on the three subjects and found a great observation that got my creative mind rolling and Im sure some of you will come up with more from this.

Ok so first my setup for the subjects is simple the old male pot with rootball and graft on then a squewer at the top to hold the key part of it up, one of those flimsy clear produce bag from the grocery store. I found that it fits perfectly around the container is large to creat a big dome and everytime I check on em I breath a lot of C02 into them kinda like you would breath into a bag if your hyperventilating. This I think has created a very moist, rich in C02 environment which has done nothing but wonderfull things.

You must understand that i used to think moisture and humidity is the devil, but now I understand that under the right steril enviroments it works wonders and does not rot your leaves.

Ok the BIG NEWS, after checking on them and they're looking fine, I noticed little white stubs all over the stem from dirt up to tip were i cut it even out of the tip little white hairs starting. These are new roots so basicly the subjects are air layering themselves withought dirt or anything but humidity and C02. This being said many new possibilities await for everyone, the simplest and logical when i transplant em into a bigger container this baby will all be buried and have beautiful new roots EVERYWHERE I put humidity. I'm also curious to see if the grafts themselves will produce roots from fan leave stems too and other stems heck even leaves if left long enough.

Another Idea I had and I think I will be trying is a hybrid soil/hydro system which consists of the old rootball being the the dirt as it is and I stock the dirt full of nutrients so it acts as my resevoir. Then i seal the moisture in the top half where these new air roots are forming so the moisture is always close to 100%, i know that high humidity is never 100% because that would be rain, humidity always has air attached to the water molecule. so as long as I change the air in there once in a while and breath on em they should be fine thus keeping the roots alive and using a combination of soiless and soil.

Another Idea I had was a double root system by traditionaly air layering the tip of the male stock and planting it in soil to have a double root, the roots in the middle will be air pruned once the dome is off. Or shove the tip in a rockwool cube and i just need to saturate the cube with nutrients to feed it and water the soil to give it water lol or have a drip on the rockwool so that your baby will never 100% dry out if you forget to water the soil.

I dunno I just keep getting more and more Ideas, let me know what you guys are thinking about this.

Ill try and post pics later, the wife is very against me posting pics, hell she dont even really like that I post on here she's super paranoid. As am I also but once in a while I put pics up for a bit then remove them.

Wow you got some ideas happening there, I like the idea of incorporating air layering. essentially your just rooting the clone, but at the same time its growing roots out into the moist rockwool, its also grafting to the stem of its host. Eventually you would remove the rockwool presumably cutting off the roots that have grown and let the graft grow directly from the rootstock. This sounds like it would ease the whole process much more.
Smokey did you ever worry that your breath could contaminate the inside of the humidity bag? I have heard of alot of peope using their breath for humidity but it always sounded like a good way to risk contamination

I dunno about my breath contaminating the inside, i wouldn't do it if I had a cold or just had a smoke but I guaranty you what comes out of my lungs unfortunately is cleaner then what goes in, I know my lungs filter a lot of crap in the air i feel it lol

smokey de bear said:

I dunno about my breath contaminating the inside, i wouldn't do it if I had a cold or just had a smoke but I guaranty you what comes out of my lungs unfortunately is cleaner then what goes in, I know my lungs filter a lot of crap in the air i feel it lol

Click to expand...

Hahaha I never thought of that before, It's probably true

I don't think you could give your plant a "cold" lol

the female part will talk the male part to death, and he can't even get away.........the horror

SFguy said:

THIS is common practice among viticulture/enologists (grapes) fusing a hearty grape vairty to a hearty root species to bring a grape that would not typically grow due to climate zonelimitations or soil issues, its the definition of a HYBRID, +REP FOR YOU PICKLE MAN

Click to expand...

Actually, it's the definition of a GRAFT -- frankensteining a plant, basically. A hybrid is something else entirely, and unique at the genetic level.

PraxicalExcercise said:

Actually, it's the definition of a GRAFT -- frankensteining a plant, basically. A hybrid is something else entirely, and unique at the genetic level.

Click to expand...

Grafting doesn't change the genetics of the plant. The rootstock remains strain A and the graft remains strain B. That is the advantage of the technique.

"Hybrid (biology): an offspring resulting from cross-breeding" Grafting does not create hybrids; interbreeding (crossing different strains) does.

I tried to make two grafts since this thread was started...one was female white rhino branch to male Tahoe OG male (died after a couple of days...probably my fault). The other was male Tahe OG branch to LSD female post-harvest stump (for practice). This one was done last tuesday, and is still very much alive, but i noticed a bit of fungus starting to form on the tape around the stump. I sprayed a bit of Cannacure on it...that stuff seems to be effective at killing mold, buds, etc...but my plant did not like it for some reason....white rhino got stunted for three weeks, now has sections where the internodes are so close together that you can't even count them. Also, it now has three tops instead of one for some reason...

Going to try grafting a female grapegod branch to the male tahoe og...and the white rhino too...

Yea Since Iv'e started I tried 3 and all 3 got hit with mold , so Imma just go by that grafting gum stuff cause I think it's the tape causing my issues and I heard that gum acts like an antiseptic and allows the wound to breath so it's like a bandage for plants I guess.

+rep for giving r a go

So, those Grapegod/ Tahoe OG and White Rhino/ Tahoe OG grafts are now done. I used a zip tie to keep pressure on the slit in the stem, paper towel strip soaked in water/rooting hormones (hopefully prevents mold and maybe helps it heal faster), and sandwich wrap to keep the grafted branches from drying out. This was done yesterday, and so far so good.

Also, i checked the Tahoe OG male branch to LSD female stump graft that had some mold yesterday, and I'm happy to say that the mold is now gone...Cannacure did the trick. Now just have to wait until the graft heals and the branch starts showing some growth...

ddimebag said:

So, those Grapegod/ Tahoe OG and White Rhino/ Tahoe OG grafts are now done. I used a zip tie to keep pressure on the slit in the stem, paper towel strip soaked in water/rooting hormones (hopefully prevents mold and maybe helps it heal faster), and sandwich wrap to keep the grafted branches from drying out. This was done yesterday, and so far so good.

Also, i checked the Tahoe OG male branch to LSD female stump graft that had some mold yesterday, and I'm happy to say that the mold is now gone...Cannacure did the trick. Now just have to wait until the graft heals and the branch starts showing some growth...

Click to expand...

This sounds promising
How big was the rootball your grafted to?

scroglodyte said:

the female part will talk the male part to death, and he can't even get away.........the horror

Click to expand...

Thats the funniest thing ive ever seen on this site!

PraxicalExcercise said:

Actually, it's the definition of a GRAFT -- frankensteining a plant, basically. A hybrid is something else entirely, and unique at the genetic level.

Click to expand...

look up "graft" in the dictionary.

what kind of graft did you use? i recently tried my first grafting attemp with cannabis... basically i used an apical wedge graft, but i did it further down the apical maristem so i could cut the V into where the stock separates from a maristem so i would have better cambial contact. i think MY failure came from improper aftercare. i plan to build an aeroponic cloner that has some hose misters coming off of it to help with the aftercare. basically ill put that in the bag that i use as the humidity dome. \

another thing to note is that my rootstock and scion were only about a quarter of an inch in diameter, i selected newer clones to make use if the IAA coarsing thru them, but maybe i should have tried hardier mothers?