First time Grow - 250w HPS - All advice appreciated - pictures

Ok so i've jumped straight in at the deep end for a newbie, i don't know much about growing but it seems to be going well. For total peace of mind i was wondering if someone could let me know how their looking from an expirenced eye? Any advice would be appreciated! Thank you.

The set up

- A 1m x 1m x 1.6m mylar lined grow tent
- 250w HPS lamp
- 4 plants in 10" pots (couldn't get square pots which would have been better for space)
- An 8" fan
- An extractor fan hooked up to a carbon filter

The Plants

The plants are from a female mother plant thats on 24/7 veg, tbh i don't know what strain they truelly are as all i was told is that they are "cheese" but to be honest here in England alot of different strains are described as cheese.

I got the cuttings at about 4" - 5" and they got repotted at 8" in to the 10" pots their in now. I wanted to re pot them early because i read somewhere that clones take more time to recover and grow again.

Each is a 1/4 perlite mix in good quality multi purpose compost.

It's strange but i have had these plants for for nearly 8 weeks now and they really haven't grown that much.. their at about 10" and have got extremely bushy.

Other things to know

-The PH level of the soil is 6.5 - 6.

-The Temp is usually between 21 - 26 Celcius (70 - 78F) but because of where the tent is it is weather permiting and sometimes goes to 30 celcius. This has led me to putting the extractor fan where it is in the pictures it just seem to keep it from going above 26 celcius.

-Unfortunately i haven't been able to grab a humidity sensor (don't flame me!)
its just i haven't had the time to pick one up but should get one form eBay come payday, so i don't know humidty levels.

- I've been watering once ever 3 days as they dry very fast under the HPS bulb as for nutes i 've been giving them a feed every other watering with no adverse effects.

-I got the nutes from a someone who grows for profit, he simply poured some of the nutes in to three different bottles for me for free! and told me what ratio to feed them in but his infomation was very vague something like 2mm of each in 7 litres of water. He didn't even tell me what it was i was feeding them. There is a picture attached of the nutes in their fruit juice bottles lol does anyone have any idea what they are? Either way the've done no damaged and i did notice a massive difference in colour and bushyness once i started using them.

-Innitially i had them on 18 on 6 off for light but then went to 24 on after re potting them to help with recovery then back to 18/6 after a week.

The bottom line

Anyway like i said this is only my first grow and to boot i got the clones for free so i won't be devistated if these were to die or yeild only a few buds as i believe you can only learn through trial and error and this won't be my only grow.

I've been doing research since and really as i'm not in it for the profit and just a personal bit to smoke i was thinking of putting these in to flower now at 10" and pick up some AF seeds for a quick turn around time on the next grow so i can try different strains.

What would you do? Thanks for reading, all advice appreciated, Noobish.

EDIT: in the pictures if they look droopy it because the picture was taken after cleaning the leaves with natural insectides, usually they are perky and pointing towards the light.

Can a mod move this to the right forum please as i don't seem to be getting replies here lol - maybe the newbie forum would be better.

Hey man nice little setup for sure.

I would expect at least an ounce per plant as long as you dont have any major hangups.

Good luck

Bushy is a good thing. With an even canopy more buds receive more light.
Rather than a tall plant with a nice main cola, but tiny side buds.
I think they look great.
Is your light moved up for pics, or is that how high you keep the light?
If that's where you keep your light, then the bushy plants are even
more impressive. BTW i grow 250w also.
If you're waiting to flower, i'd might suggest start tying the buds to try and keep
an over all even canopy. The main colas get tougher to keep tied down the older
they get. Side buds are much easier to move around and keep even with each other.
Well, that's how i get the most out of my 250 anyway.
Great job keep it up.
Peace

If all four make it to harvest, you never know
you could be looking on the plus side of 8oz dry.

The plants look pretty happy, but 10" for an 8-week clone seems a little on the short side (could be the strain tho). How far from the plant tops to you keep your light?

I have to agree for a 8 week clone thats not very big.... I'm using a 400 hps and 5 plants after 32ish days i went into flowering from seed! they were tall enough I have a post in indoor growing yesterday. I guess you could move your light a couple inches closer but I dont think thats the problem it should be ok where it is in the pics...I see the stalk is pretty thick maybe He needs bigger pots???? I'm using 5 gallon buckets myself I know the roots love to grow down ......

Thanks for the replies people, yeah i agree they do seem really short for 8 weeks, do you think this could be because the fan is on them directly? could also explain the thick stalks? The light height was only a few inches shorter before i took pictures as i did move it up to get in there, i keep it about 14" above tops.. the problem i was having with moving it closer was the heat this thing generates. If i were to deal with the heat build up, what height would be ideal for these?

As for bushyness once i started to feed them the mystery nutes they seem to have gone out of control with the bushyness, shame it didn't go out of control with the height first. IF i were to put these in to flower now would they naturally get taller?

Thick stalks, eh? Well that says something. Are they anything but green (red or purple), and/or is the stalk brittle? They might not be reacting well to the ph of the soil (you said as low as 6.0), or perhaps there's not enough oxygen at the roots-- although 25% perlite should not pose a problem on that front.

My guess is that there is something amiss with the soil, root rot or some sort of critter. Maybe having 4" plants in a 10" pot led to waterlogged soil and root-rot. If you are willing to check it out, I would take a look at the roots on one of the girls.

yeah i'm willing to lose the smallest one for the sake of aiding the others.. so yeah you could be on to something there. I'll do some investigating tomorrow hopefully with pictures but what would you suggest if it does appear to be rot? Bigger pots, fresh soil and fresh perlite?

As for PH level, use one of them electronic soil ph testers it's pretty basic but does give stronger acidity reading the further down i push the probes does this sound like the waters not draining properly and becoming stagnant?

i think if you had bigger buckets it would grow taller but i'm still kinda new myself. My last grow turned out bad but this one is going just fine.... Yeah i use a 400 hps and it builds up heat to in the small closet setup but i go in a couple times a day and spray them with a water bottle . that airs the room out and the heat leaves the room..... sometimes if i'm not going to be home i'll leave the door slightly cracked...yes im losing some of the light but at least it keeps them from stressing over heat.

noobish said:

yeah i'm willing to lose the smallest one for the sake of aiding the others.. so yeah you could be on to something there. I'll do some investigating tomorrow hopefully with pictures but what would you suggest if it does appear to be rot? Bigger pots, fresh soil and fresh perlite?

As for PH level, use one of them electronic soil ph testers it's pretty basic but does give stronger acidity reading the further down i push the probes does this sound like the waters not draining properly and becoming stagnant?

Click to expand...

Hopefully, you won't harm the plant by checking; it might be time for a transplant anyway. Considering it, since the leaves look so good, it is unlikely root rot (Pythium), but since you say the ph drops further as you probe down, it is possible that the soil has soured in the lower part of the pot, and the roots aren't growing into it. You have ruled out most issues I could think of outside of the soil.

I'm going to have a quick look at the root system on the smallest one in a minute and if that doesn't show any signs of rot then i'll just have to put it down to either the fan being on the plants directly for too long keeping them short and with thick stalks or another suggestion was the strain could also dictate how tall these get. either way i'll be back shortly to comment on the roots.

Well that was interesting, i found out a few things that further more justify that i'm a NOOOOB.. lol i just realised my pots don't even have drainage holes on them DOH! but as you can see it's seems to have had no adverse effects on the root system which is looking lovely. Pictures 1, 2 and 3 are better pictures of the smallest one close up, which over night seems to have grown an inch or it could be that all the leaves were soaking up all the light and were pointing upwards today.

The root system is all over the perlite base i have in the pots, so would you recommend a transplant then? Also if i were to flower these soon would you still recommend a transplant before hand?

noobish said:

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Well that was interesting, i found out a few things that further more justify that i'm a NOOOOB.. lol i just realised my pots don't even have drainage holes on them DOH! but as you can see it's seems to have had no adverse effects on the root system which is looking lovely. Pictures 1, 2 and 3 are better pictures of the smallest one close up, which over night seems to have grown an inch or it could be that all the leaves were soaking up all the light and were pointing upwards today.

The root system is all over the perlite base i have in the pots, so would you recommend a transplant then? Also if i were to flower these soon would you still recommend a transplant before hand?

Click to expand...

Those roots do look good. You must have a good sence of when and how much to water, or that lack of drainage could have caused some serious damage.

I would imagine that after a transplant you will get some rapid growth. It's a good idea to transplant before flowering, because the flowering process will double the size of your plants. Be sure to allow them a week after transplant before putting them on 12 hrs. so they can adjust to their new environment. It also gives you time to take some clones (if you haven't already).

You'll have some beautiful bud in no time.

just as i thought thought the roots cant go down any further wouldnt they just be getting bound up ?? and transplanting to a bigger pot would allow more growth I dont have any drainage holes in my buckets either i just water once a day and just enough to moisten the soil as soon as water looks like its building on the top of soil its more then enough..by the next morning the soil looks dry again so I rewater ...Its worked out ok this far Good job with the plants they have a healthy looking root system I dont think transplanting will hurt it much if at all....Keep us updated!

just 2 things from me i use a 250w mh and a 250w hps together with a uvb on the side
1. the most affective range for a 250w is 12 to 18 inches from plant tops
2. it looks like in pics that your fan is above height of light no good if so fan shold be between light and plant or on plant tops

that is all i see erryting else b lookn erie broda
peace out good luck 1 love

Search yahoo for a light chart
A 27,000 lumen 250w puts out 50,420 foot-candles at 5 inches
That drops to just over 4,900 foot-candles at 16 inches
The answer is as close as your enviroment will allow,
i.e. heat, leaf burn ect.

junior2k9 said:

just as i thought thought the roots cant go down any further wouldnt they just be getting bound up ?? and transplanting to a bigger pot would allow more growth I dont have any drainage holes in my buckets either i just water once a day and just enough to moisten the soil as soon as water looks like its building on the top of soil its more then enough..by the next morning the soil looks dry again so I rewater ...Its worked out ok this far Good job with the plants they have a healthy looking root system I dont think transplanting will hurt it much if at all....Keep us updated!

Click to expand...

Roots grow where the food is, and thats all over the pot, They don't just grow down.
Be careful watering like that you dont want dry spots.
It's better to make holes and water till you get some good runoff.

Thank you again for the response..

Yeah thats some good advice about letting there be some run off, if i had done that from the start i might have noticed the lack of drainage quicker. Personally my watering reigm is very similar to Juniors, on average it's about 200mil of water every 2 days with a feed every 3rd but i never water if its even slightly damp on top and it's never failed me.

Thanks for the light height info i think i'm gonna gradually pull the light to about 12" and move the fan down between the tops and the lamp like RichED said. My only concern was the fan being on the plants directly and stunting growth, thats why it's as high up as it is in the picture but i'll give it a go and see what happens hopefully it'll keep the heat off my girls.

My last comment is for NiteGazer... clones. To be honest I've done zero research on clones and it never crossed my mind to take some but i'm in two minds now and you've got me thinking... how long will it delay me starting flowering if i were to take clones? My overall plan was to flower these and grow a AF strain from seed.. i like the idea of going through the whole process of growing some delicious bud but saying that a friend wants to get a tent soon so if i were to grab some clones for him it would give him a running start and insure that he owes me blaze when his crop comes through. As for pots i'm always on the hunt for square pots, i honestly can't believe how hard it it is to find a pot that isn't round and big, my logic there is that square pots would make better use of the small space and give more volume for lovely soil. Maybe i'll have to give up and hunt the internet.

Either way these will be transplanted into bigger pots over the weekend with pictures online by monday for review lol..
I'll keep you informed, Peace out People..