First time grow, advice would be appreciated :-)

Hey all!

Iv finally decided to take the step in making my own grow! I seriously can't be bothered with all these dodgy dealers selling for over the odds prices for absolute shit! (Sorry for the swearing) lol.

Anyway so iv been looking into how to grow for weeks now and have come to the conclusion of the following items I will buy:
  • 1 x 2.4m x 1.2m x 2m BAY6 Grow Tent
  • 2 x 600w Lumen8 Dual Spectrum Lamp
  • 2 x Puma Reflector
  • 2 x 600w Puma Ballast
  • 1 x 150/300 Kaizen Filter
  • 1 x 150/6” VK Fan
  • 1 x 150/6" Intake Fan
  • 1 x 5m 150mm Aluminium Ducting
  • 1 x 4m 2 Core Cable
  • 3 x 150mm Jubilee clip
  • 2 x Rope Ratchet
  • 2 x Heavy Duty Timer
  • 1 x Plug
In regards to what nutrients I will be using:

Shogun samurai hydro nutrient.

Right, so is there anything I may have missed out?

Last question,, because it is my first grow, I'd love some advice on how to grow my first batch really good...any advice would be great!! :-)

Here's to smoking bud!
 

Doer

Well-Known Member
Coco is inert.

I use 16-16-16 Sea Grow, Veg and Bloom, with Ca/Mag and Silica. KISS

Dear OP. Gear does not grow. Nor do you. You and gear create an un-natrual environment that will produce what it can, based on your processes, spills, blunders, etc. So, you have it all, get growing! :)
 
Coco is inert.

I use 16-16-16 Sea Grow, Veg and Bloom, with Ca/Mag and Silica. KISS

Dear OP. Gear does not grow. Nor do you. You and gear create an un-natrual environment that will produce what it can, based on your processes, spills, blunders, etc. So, you have it all, get growing! :)
Thanks for your input buddy
Just a few questions if you don't mind :-)

The 16-16-16 sea grow that you use..is it all purpose?
http://www.plantsthatproduce.com/gm-seagrow-16-16-16-jar.html

The Ca,Mag & Silica that you use, is it all in one or separate? Could you kindly provide a link to a website so I can have a look?

Thank you! :-)
 

old shol4evr

Well-Known Member
you need to get you some meters to check and adjust your ppm/ec/ph and up and down ph for your grow but sounds like you got a plan i've grown with less than that
 
Th
you need to get you some meters to check and adjust your ppm/ec/ph and up and down ph for your grow but sounds like you got a plan i've grown with less than that
thanks buddy,

I'm a total newbie to all this, can you elaborate abit more on what a ppm and ec and ph is?

Thanks :-)
 

old shol4evr

Well-Known Member
your going to have to check your water and feed at least once to see were you stand on your parts per millon ppm,if you look the hanna ppm chart it will explain everything you need to no about the levels at the stages of your growth cycle ,no matter what you decide your going to grow in there are diffrent levels that you water or feed at .like for instance i grow in soil and i use ro water .soil grows require 5.8 to 6.8 ideal ph ,my plants seem to like a 6.5 ph . the ro water i use come out at 54 ppm and as you add all your nutrient and amendments it goes up ,depending on old your plants are you go by the chart to see what ppm you should feed ,when you check the ppm and it is more than what it is supposed to be you have to adjust by less nutrient or more as you do it more you get better and you will no how much you need ,i always document what i mix that way if i burn them a little i can back down on nutrient or vice versus .when you have every thing mixed up that is when you check and adjust your ph with up or down solutions.by documenting what you do ,the next run you do ,if the same strain you'll already have what they like ,or ballpark .not all strains are the same ,i have 4 that love the shit out of nutrient and 5 of another strain that are picky as hell ,keep this in mind less is best .now that iv'e given you some idea look up your hanna readings and you will see what i mean ,hey man i hope this helps you out but damned i'm stoned as hell and this has been a lot of typing lol no really good luck to you holler back if you need help and be assured there are a lot of people that can help you here.good luck
 

Doer

Well-Known Member
you need to get you some meters to check and adjust your ppm/ec/ph and up and down ph for your grow but sounds like you got a plan i've grown with less than that
I would not bother with a pH meter. Those things are notorious for crapping out. Just some test strips and a pH plan is what I use. Having crapped out so many, the only meter I can recommended is the Tri-meter for $200. Temp, pH, PPM. It is not portable, it has to plug in. And it has to be calibrated with special fluid. But, it works fine and lasts a long time.

OTH, a $40 ppm dip gauge is essential.
 
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Doer

Well-Known Member
pH Plan

What I mean here is we are after consistency?....NO

The plant manages it's pH. People don't get this but I have watched for months with sensor graphing on my laptop. I typically get a full POINT swing, in 24 hours. So, it is never really steady, even day to day, I cannot say when the peaks and valleys will be. But, pH is part of light cycle in bloom. But, in Veg, pH is more steady, but still drifts around. The plant is doing it.

So, you cannot chase it, you don't want to chase it and the plant itself is against that.

So, what I realize is I just want to set the starting condition in the middle of the range. If the roots are in water, the range is slightly lower than is a draining media. So for me the middle is about 6.1 -.2. When I was hydro, it was more like 5.9.

So, I began to think differently. What if I carefully test my feed portions until I get a mix that comes out the correct pH every time? BINGO. The more simple the better for long term success.

RO water for me, is about 6.4 pH. OK. I want to be a little bit acid at the end. So good start.

Now I measure the pH of 16-16-16 Sea Grow, my base feed, in RO water. Hmmm....not bad.
I check that across the PPM range I intend to use. 200-800ppm. OK, stable.

Now, after a full year of dicking around with NEWTS, I know I only need two main supplements.
I used to have a spreadsheet to keep track of 15 additives and now I hate the Dutch Hippies.

Go figure? :)

Cal/Mag and Silica. These, for me, were the pH muggers. It really depends on brand, I guess.
And how those brands work at various dilutions. But, I lucked out. Well RIU helped.

Sensai Silica Blast for Bloom (I use in Veg, also)
Bontanicare Cal/Mag (needed, most flower feed doesn't have enough)

These brands are stable across dilution, and scale with the pH of the water.

Now it is time for the dip strips, and pH experiments.

I got to mixing it up in 5 gal buckets.

4 gal RO
2? scoops of Sea Grow (depends of your ppm need)

Then after well mixed, you have to look at what 1 capful or tablespoon of Silica does to the PPM.
It is a heavy add. And what did that do to the pH? (raised it)

You need to look at the proportions. Silica goes in like it was a sponge. They love this. So. you don't need a lot.

OK, now Cal/Mag. Oh, this helps. So, I just get a ratio, I can't remember now. But, I think it was another capful of Cal/Mag or maybe 1.5 caps.

Measure again and figure out if that will do it in 5 gals. And yeah, I get 6.2 pH in 5 gals. Very even with the water almost.

Then my next great idea, with to mix up 10 gals of that and set the PPM for 3000 or I even went to 5000. What you are looking for here is even more simple.

I had 4 feed sources at 3 different PPM in 10 gal totes, and a 1 gal hand feeder for the 1st month.

So, I take a cup of 5000 ppm and put that in top up the reservoir and have 800 ppm feeder.
1/2 cup gets the 400 ppm bloom res and the 400 ppm Veg res.

A tablespoon in a gal of RO for the hand feed at 200ppm, is the concept. You have to measure. This is not a recipe since i am going from memory.
 

Doer

Well-Known Member
Last but not least is Crisis.

It is true that pH can change drastically. But, you didn't do that, and the plant didn't do that.

There is only one thing. Contamination. Root root, roots stuck in pumps, or something else we need to check and fix long before it gets to pH banging.
 
I believe you should seriously start with Promix if anything. If you haven't grown before. I would not do hydro or coco yet until you get some experience from Promix and dirt. I made the mistake of going all hydro and this is after I read a lot a lot of books. Still didn't turn out well.

From one honest grower to another. Start with Promix please. Just learn the basics first. Like Pinch, cropping, LST, Training, and SOG. Lets not forget about cloning.

I am not here to endorse promix. I here so you can have a decent grow and get something out of it. Without going nuts. There is a lot of things to learn in growing this plant. Its one of hardest to grow beside a orchids.

I do want you save and get something out it. It greatly discourages when it ends up failing. I have done G13 crossed with NYC Diesel. Came out really nice.

Once you get the basics I would tell you move on hydro and coco. The reason I say to start with PROMIX is

1. Saves you money
2. So you can practice technique
3. So in case it fails your not discourage on not retrying it.
4. To save you money so you get something and continue to grow.
 
@ Doer, I agree with your logic. pH meters are crap. If anything just get test strips 3$ for a booklet of them. Unless your growing a farm somewhere. You just need the test strips.

Doer don't agree that Promix is kind to beginners?
 
I believe you should seriously start with Promix if anything. If you haven't grown before. I would not do hydro or coco yet until you get some experience from Promix and dirt. I made the mistake of going all hydro and this is after I read a lot a lot of books. Still didn't turn out well.

From one honest grower to another. Start with Promix please. Just learn the basics first. Like Pinch, cropping, LST, Training, and SOG. Lets not forget about cloning.

I am not here to endorse promix. I here so you can have a decent grow and get something out of it. Without going nuts. There is a lot of things to learn in growing this plant. Its one of hardest to grow beside a orchids.

I do want you save and get something out it. It greatly discourages when it ends up failing. I have done G13 crossed with NYC Diesel. Came out really nice.

Once you get the basics I would tell you move on hydro and coco. The reason I say to start with PROMIX is

1. Saves you money
2. So you can practice technique
3. So in case it fails your not discourage on not retrying it.
4. To save you money so you get something and continue to grow.

Thanks buddy! I must say reading all of these replies in this thread is confusing me lol, as mentioned I am a newbie and I have no idea what some of the stuff is that is being mentioned.

Your correct in saying I want to save money, practice technique etc etc...I do t want to jump into the deep end straight away,, id like to practice the basics first and hopefully get a decent crop at the end which will want me to keep doing and doing and doing till I know I can move onto all the hard stuff like the hydrostatic and cocos.

Green arrow, if I PM you can you give me a sort of mini straight to the point guide in how to grow using your method of Promix? Or you can just write it down here with a reply and maybe others can view and voice there opinion on this. I'd also appreciate it so much as you defo understand where I am coming from lol

Thank you!!!!
 

Doer

Well-Known Member
@ Doer, I agree with your logic. pH meters are crap. If anything just get test strips 3$ for a booklet of them. Unless your growing a farm somewhere. You just need the test strips.

Doer don't agree that Promix is kind to beginners?
No one told me! No one told me! I can say that, but now, you did say. :)

So, I don't know. Guys are weird. All about status. Just ask a lady grower and you will get a much more simple concept, I think.

But, the point about status is us Alpha male wannabes, start with hydro and fail. So, if you want to bruise your status ego, then by all means, start with hydro. :)

But, if you are just trying to grow, at all, something like Promix may have better results for some.

But, for me, I like to tinker....for self status. Promix will have self control issues. You cannot water or feed very much. So, when I tried potting soil type mixes, I failed. I over did it.

Coco and hydroton, means I cannot do that. It all flows though each day. And a good root ball seems to feed on what it wants. So, a bit heavy on the PPM that week, doesn't hurt them. I can measure the run off and adjust.

And then there is the learning curve. I need a good reproducible system, with constant yield. And just me, I want to control variables. So, it is a two tracked Learning process. But, it all goes together. Learn the plant and learn the system and learn the plant in your system that is bound by your location, stealth and funds.

And there is nothing wrong with experiments. I experiments for 2 years before I found my ticket.

So, start Promix, try to clone, also, plan an auto feeding system, spill water everywhere. Such fun.
 
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mr sunshine

Well-Known Member
Coco is inert.

I use 16-16-16 Sea Grow, Veg and Bloom, with Ca/Mag and Silica. KISS

Dear OP. Gear does not grow. Nor do you. You and gear create an un-natrual environment that will produce what it can, based on your processes, spills, blunders, etc. So, you have it all, get growing! :)
Sea grow.. isn't that the cheap maxsea? Big ass bags and shit? Is it like an American something usa brand?
 

old shol4evr

Well-Known Member
No one told me! No one told me! I can say that, but now, you did say. :)

So, I don't know. Guys are weird. All about status. Just ask a lady grower and you will get a much more simple concept, I think.

But, the point about status is us Alpha male wannabes, start with hydro and fail. So, if you want to bruise your status ego, then by all means, start with hydro. :)

But, if you are just trying to grow, at all, something like Promix may have better results for some.

But, for me, I like to tinker....for self status. Promix will have self control issues. You cannot water or feed very much. So, when I tried potting soil type mixes, I failed. I over did it.

Coco and hydroton, means I cannot do that. It all flows though each day. And a good root ball seems to feed on what it wants. So, a bit heavy on the PPM that week, doesn't hurt them. I can measure the run off and adjust.

And then there is the learning curve. I need a good reproducible system, with constant yield. And just me, I want to control variables. So, it is a two tracked Learning process. But, it all goes together. Learn the plant and learn the system and learn the plant in your system that is bound by your location, stealth and funds.

And there is nothing wrong with experiments. I experiments for 2 years before I found my ticket.

So, start Promix, try to clone, also, plan an auto feeding system, spill water everywhere. Such fun.
so what is it going to be with you ,you say there is no need for ppm meters then you qoute that you do need one ,whats it going to be,
 

old shol4evr

Well-Known Member
man just go with 1:1:1 pro mix and ffof and perlite it is that simple ,get you some clone tek and feed them 2 ml clonetek till they get first set of full leaves then hit them with the nutrients at 1/4 strength less is best ,when you start feeding them you will no if it is to much you will get slight burn on tips and just back down on them a little, people make this shit so damned confusing by trying to but a bunch of fucking sceince behind the shit ,i dont no why .the only reason i use the promix is for the soil drainage ,i assure you can do the whole grow with fox farm . to prove my point on this science shit ,i stumbled in my grow room 2 days ago and broke a big top off my plant and man was i pissed ,took the top and threw it in a pot in my storage closet ,completly forgot about it .was doing a little cleaning 5 hrs later and remembered the top and said what the hell and took that top clipped off the lower leaves and dipped in some clone tek and took a 1 gallon pot put a hole in it dripped some of the clonetek in there ,took 2 sticks stood the stem up and put a led lamp 12 in from the plant and guess what yesterday morning the fucker was not only standing on its own but the leaves were as perky as a hot womans nipples on a cold day .now with a wilted plant laying in the dark for 4 or 5 hours science would tell you it was dead and couldnt make it but it not only did but still is .man just do what ever works best for your budget and weed out the bull shit .hope this helps you out bro good luck with the grow and let the force be with you ,,peace im on some good herb right now so take it any way you see fit
 
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