GH Flora Nova Bloom in DWC - continual problems

Ontario Hydro

Active Member
Hello all. I've been using Flora Nova Bloom for DWC plants for about 6 months now...Nothing but continual problems.

The first issues I attributed to my old bottle of Flora Nova turning sour on me (it was 2 years old and was maybe stored outside for too long).

I'm now on a second, new bottle. However, I am continually running into problems. The Flora Nova continually sinks to the bottom of my DWC tub - even after a vigorous shaking. Also, the plants just don't seem to be growing. Any new roots quickly rot, and the plants don't seem to be happy at all. They tend to perk-up when I give them straight water with no nutes; so it's not an issue with temp, pH etc.

I've read several posts online regarding GE's Flora Nova. There seems to be quite a polarity...either people love it, or they have problems like me.

Having said that, I would like to ask if anyone else has experience/problems with Flora Nova Veg/Bloom in DWC?

Thanks
 

hampster

Member
Well ummm it sounds like you've got root-rot...?

Pythium, do a search. Some says it's curable, others not... In my experience it just might be to manage, but since it is systemic, it will follow the clones, and are NOT curable.

Good luck.
 

Serapis

Well-Known Member
If your nutes are sinking to the bottom, something is seriously wrong. You are shaking the piss out of that bottle before pouring out nutes, right? It should come out thick and dark brown and easily dissolve into water.
 

Ontario Hydro

Active Member
Yeah, root rot is prevalent. They just go brown and fall off. Sometimes H2O2 helps, sometimes it doesn't. Part of me thinks it keeps the root-rot at bay, but that the H2O2 also kills the Flora Nova's beneficial bacteria.

Yeah, I give a fairly vigorous shaking of the bottle. Like 30 seconds. Still, it seems to always sink to the bottom. Seems to me like the beneficial bacteria kinda just dies and isn't able to keep itself suspended anymore.

All I know is that I think I'm done with Flora Nova for DWC. It's worked excellent in soiless grows in the past. But for DWC, can't say that I'd ever vouch for it.
 

hampster

Member
Well, as I said, root-rot is systemic and incurable. You'll need to do a kill-off, sterilization routine, and go from seed again to get rid of it...

In my experience.

And h2o2 and organics with beneficial bacteria does not mix well, no.
 

Ontario Hydro

Active Member
Hmm, root-rot systemic and incurable. I've always known it was bad, but never fully realized how bad. I would usually just change the water and hope for the best. I guess
I'll just try to salvage a clone, then get rid of the plant.

Thanks, Hampster. I'll use a fresh clone from a healthy plant (not my dying DWC one), and give it a go. Sterilized materials, clean bucket etc. Maybe my disdain for using Flora Nova in hydro will change.
 

hampster

Member
There's much controversy around the "incurable" part, I'll copy a couple of other posts of mine below to help enlighten you some more on the subject. If you take clones from infected but seemingly healthy mothers, it WILL follow the clones and be the cause of outbreaks in flower. Pay attention to what I say about the life-cycle of the disease, and the effects of plant and pathogen strains, and why all of this leads to confusion and controversy:

"Yeah, your plants has been severely overwatered, and that can cause root-rot, ie. pythium, if going on for too long.

Pythium root-rot is systemic and chronic, like plant aids, and will hurt your yields and success. It is mostly dormant in the vegetative stage and will allow for clones from the infected mother to root and grow seemingly normal, but the outbreaks starts in flower, and denies the plant the chance to reach it's full potential.

A couple of great diagnostic tools is to examine the root-tips CLOSELY. If they're well-defined and pointy in vegging plants you are ok, but if the outermost 0,5-1 mm are kinda mushy, you've got it. And in bloom you can check the run-off when watering/reservoir in hydro if you suspect an outbreak. If it's severely acidic and constantly wants to drop, it's a pretty sure sign of rot.

And again, root-rot is systemic, chronic, and follows the clones. System and pythium/plant-strain dependent, you can manage it with some success for prolonged periods, but you will not be able to rid your plants of it once you've got it, and it will to a degree hurt your yields.

Unless you do a complete kill-off and sterilization routine of your equipment of course, and start over from seeds again.

So.

AVOID overwatering at all costs - use 1/3 perlite in your mix to make sure it will not get waterlogged. The perlite will also help "supercharge" your plants, due to the excellent rate of gas exchange you achieve for the roots. Expect to water twice a day.

And if you DO get a case of overwatering, drain as best as you can ASAP, and repot into a larger pot with dry medium to help dry up the wet soil and aerate the roots again.

Pythium is almost inevitable for uninformed fresh growers to catch, and it can fuck up the whole experience for a LONG time due to it's systemic/chronic nature, and veg-dormant/bloom-triggered life-cycle.

Just a heads up, good luck with your grows man!"




"Well, for diagnosing it in veg you need to inspect the root tips CLOSELY. Sharp and well defined equals ok, mushy equals systemic rot in most cases. Tips only in veg, the rest looks just fine...

And there are a number of ways to keep it partially under control to save crops, depending on your system and available remedies, and your personal preferences. Search, here and in Google.

Remember that different strains has different tolerances to it, and it even differs between the individual plants in the same strain due to genetic diversity. There are also a multitude of pythium strains and sub-strains, with different capabilities for persistence and devastation.

And also, some claims that it is curable, and some claims that it is not...

I argue, based on mine and others experience and scientific litterature, that in the majority of cases it is NOT. But confusion in this matter easily arises from the fact that it has a veg-dormant/bloom-active life cycle, and some plants are more resistant and some pythium strains milder. And finally, the individual growers varying success in suppressing it with the applicated treatments or "cures" or implemented "preventative measures", may in some cases lead him to believe that it is cured, when infact the outbreaks are only effectively prevented .

Just make sure to keep it the fuck out of your plants in the first place, which is relatively easy with some basic knowledge, experiencence, and sound gardening practices.

And yes, pythium is everpresent in soil and water as dormant spores, and WILL activate and attack plants that are susceptible to it due to moisture stress, low O2 and/or other factors. Then, with ONE sick plant in your room, it will most likely spread to the others as aggressive, live, active pathogens with a very high disease-pressure. As opposed to the dormant, everpresent low-disease-pressure spores before given a chance to take hold...

Good luck."

https://www.rollitup.org/marijuana-plant-problems/402641-over-watering-issue-solved-5.html#post5269939


And a little more info:

Many plant-pathogens have evolved to trigger their outbreaks when the plants hormonal system changes into bloom-mode. The reason for this is that it is in the pathogens best interest to let the plants reach a large biomass to spread from once it's dead. And it's also in the pathogens interest to let the plants manage to drop some seeds, ensuring hosts for the spores to infect next season too.

If your genetics is of a high value to you Ontario, and the strains of both pythium and plants are of a nature that makes it possible to live with it for awhile, you should perhaps look into other methods than DWC, and other nutes too?

Read up on pythium and make up your own mind, there's lots of controversy around it. But I attribute that to general ignorance and confusion, and "cure"-peddling nute and pesticide companies...

Good luck.
 

Ontario Hydro

Active Member
Jeez. I thought I was quite an experienced grower, but I guess my greenthumb was only really limited to growing in soil. When I tried my hand at DWC I really messed things up from the get-go (mainly when I tried to transfer an outdoor potted soil plant into an indoor DWC setup). Instead of fixing my errors and starting anew, I would continually try to heal the plant and hope the root rot would go away. Never once thought that it was such a systemic disease.

Recently my cuttings have been dying without rooting. I now realize that it's because healthy cuttings were put alongside diseased ones, and I've been exacerbating the whole, chronic situation. Now I'll actually heed and understand growers' warnings about keeping a sterile indoor environment.

I'm not through with DWC yet. I'll give it another go.

Thanks again, Hampster.
 

H2grOw

Active Member
I have used GH bloom and grow for my DWC for 3 grows and have not had any issues. Irollfatties might be on to something with the air pump. If you are not getting enough oxygen in the water, the roots can drown. I do get a little residue at the bottom of my res, but I have always assumed it was from my hygroton. I never have any visible residue in my mixing container.
 

H2grOw

Active Member
I don't doubt that some of the residue is undisolved nutes, but they don't amount to much. I use a high pressure nozzle on my hose when mixing, so they dissolve very well. It also gets lots of oxygen into the water.
 
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