Grow Room Floorplans. Here to help.

phxrocks said:

Did some improvements to my room. 12' x 14' x 8' sealed. 6 1000 phantoms over 2 x 18 site 3 gallon bucket systems. The dual zone mini split and Co2 are the recent upgrades. Hoods do not have air moving through them anymore. Temp hasn't been over 81F since I dimmed the ballasts to 750.
3 strains on day 28 of flower.
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Can you move the ballasts out of the bloom room? Might drop another 2F in there. Good stuff though. Cheers.

@ firsttime..........first things first, get your power off the floor.

Sencha said:

@ firsttime..........first things first, get your power off the floor.

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Ok got it. Now what lol

The 1g per watt rule of thumb.. Conceits of how much veg?

jared118 said:

The 1g per watt rule of thumb.. Conceits of how much veg?

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its hard to get 1g per watt with most strain and systems, its more like 1/2 gram a watt
with a good yielding plants, most will be happy with 10-12 oz's in a basic setup under a 600hps,



ok sog you could get 1g per watt with a lot of strains but a lot of growers do not want 20 + plants under a 600w hps,
laws and time taken for a large amount of cutting from mother plants or seedlings costing a lot and long time to root

jared118 said:

The 1g per watt rule of thumb.. Conceits of how much veg?

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more veg time will increases yield
i found topping and lust increase my canopy size and the extra veg time increase the root mass and in turn increased yield
but some strain do not like topping and lst

i veg for 6-8 weeks and they are more like bushes than a plant
my 4 plants under 2 600w hps could do with more space, room size 2.4m x 1m
i am in 1st week or flower

Yo Phillip, hoping you could help me out. You always seem to have good pointers and I know you have used advanced Nutes a bunch. I posted a question on the forms here and switched my girls into flower 4 days ago and was hoping you could take a look at a couple pics I posted and see what you think it could be. I took pic with the lights on but tomorrow morn I will take a couple when they shut off.
Any pointers would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks bro
link below is my post
https://www.rollitup.org/marijuana-plant-problems/525452-3-days-into-flower-need.html

I am curious about light rail movers. I am looking at two unfinished closets off of a bedroom over the garage. Ventilation will be easy using direct vent into the attic. The door to the veg area can be left open 24/7. That said, I am hesitant about using 600w or 1000w HPS because of heat searching aircraft. I can use a lot of 250w CFL and 2 T5 or T8 to veg.

So back to the light rail mover. My plan is to grow 6 plants at a time....veg for 5 weeks and flower the remainder of the time. When I begin flowering I'll plant 6 more. If I overcome my fear of aircraft what do you think about 600w HPS on a mover with rachet system in the flower room? Augmenting with 250 CFL of both colors is easy. I could also use a heavy duty light mover and put 2 250w CFL on the mover instead, but it's not as effective.
Any ideas?
Thanks in advance!!

I'll get you some room dementions and a pic or too which should help. I'm in no hurry and want to do it right the first time.

Sencha said:

Can you move the ballasts out of the bloom room? Might drop another 2F in there. Good stuff though. Cheers.

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It would be difficult to move them outside. 2 degrees would help though,
Thanks

Brother Numsi said:

I am curious about light rail movers. I am looking at two unfinished closets off of a bedroom over the garage. Ventilation will be easy using direct vent into the attic. The door to the veg area can be left open 24/7. That said, I am hesitant about using 600w or 1000w HPS because of heat searching aircraft. I can use a lot of 250w CFL and 2 T5 or T8 to veg.

So back to the light rail mover. My plan is to grow 6 plants at a time....veg for 5 weeks and flower the remainder of the time. When I begin flowering I'll plant 6 more. If I overcome my fear of aircraft what do you think about 600w HPS on a mover with rachet system in the flower room? Augmenting with 250 CFL of both colors is easy. I could also use a heavy duty light mover and put 2 250w CFL on the mover instead, but it's not as effective.
Any ideas?
Thanks in advance!!

I'll get you some room dementions and a pic or too which should help. I'm in no hurry and want to do it right the first time.

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adding 500w of cfl's will actually produce as much heat in your room as a 600w light. actually more if that 600w is air cooled and especially if it's exhausted out of the room.

light movers are not good as a primamry lighting source in flower. trying to cover twice the space with half the lighting is not the idea. light movers are made for supplemental and veg lighting. not flower.

nuglets said:

adding 500w of cfl's will actually produce as much heat in your room as a 600w light. actually more if that 600w is air cooled and especially if it's exhausted out of the room.

light movers are not good as a primamry lighting source in flower. trying to cover twice the space with half the lighting is not the idea. light movers are made for supplemental and veg lighting. not flower.

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I appreciate your thoughts, but isn't heat, heat? If I remove the heat from the room and send it into the attic won't a heat signature show up there, too? Also, if a mover is used to cover a larger area with more light, how does a plant differentiate between a slow moving light during veg vs flower? I'm a newbie, but logical. Why isn't a moving light OK as a primary source during flowering? The mover is somewhat mimicking the movement of the Sun and if it does a cycle every 20 minutes the coverage is pretty good. I could always hang 2 400w lights on a mover or 2 600w lights, and yes, they'd be air-cooled. Also, I think the cops are also using devices to pick up the "hum" of the lights here.
Thanks again in advance.

Brother Numsi said:

I appreciate your thoughts, but isn't heat, heat? If I remove the heat from the room and send it into the attic won't a heat signature show up there, too? Also, if a mover is used to cover a larger area with more light, how does a plant differentiate between a slow moving light during veg vs flower? I'm a newbie, but logical. Why isn't a moving light OK as a primary source during flowering? The mover is somewhat mimicking the movement of the Sun and if it does a cycle every 20 minutes the coverage is pretty good. I could always hang 2 400w lights on a mover or 2 600w lights, and yes, they'd be air-cooled. Also, I think the cops are also using devices to pick up the "hum" of the lights here.
Thanks again in advance.

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heat is heat. but air cooled reflectors are a lot easier to exhaust the heat from. the idea is to get the heat out of your room as quickly as possible before it dissipates. the longer it stays in your room the more your room cooling equipment has to work and the more electricity you use. i don't know where you live or why you are worried about your heat signature but even in the uk where they do flir flyovers i still think putting the exhaust from 1200w into your attic is little to nothing to be worried about.

vegging plants don't require as much light as flowering plants. especially if they are on a 24/0 cycle. when you have flowering plants on 12/12 they need as much light as possible during those 12 hours. having a light mover that only casts directly light on your plants half the time and then is on the other side of the grow the other half of the time will only lead to lower yields. the idea is to have direct light over your plants at all times in flower. if you had a mover for supplemental broader spectrum lighting that was in addition to direct lighting then yes that would be great. also, using a mover to move several lights in rotation so that the plants were always receiving direct light just from different angles would be great as well. using a light rail to make a 600w bulb cover an 8' length is just going to hurt your yield and density.

Hi Nug,
I got this reply from a horticulturalist:
"
"You can actually grow with a light mover during vegetative and bloom grow cycles. The issue really is how much light do the plants want/need. If the plants are light loving they would do better under two 600w HPS lamps instead of one which is moving. Unless of course heat becomes and issue with multiple lights in which case you would need to vent the room and or run an AC to maintain optimum temperature and humidity. Generally however one 600w HPS lamp with cover a 6.5'x6.5' area and on a rail can cover the additional 6 ft length with sufficient light to grow almost anything. Only sun loving plants would really produce higher yields with the additional light. Hope this helps. Please let us know if we can assist with anything else."

I find that to be a bit non-commital on his part. Again we are looking at 6 plants and I am in my learning mode i.e. trying not to spend money needlessly.
I can always use a 1000w on a mover or 2 600w's not moving. I live in a rather warm climate from May to October. I suppose the heat in an attic may not be that noticeable. Any thoughts on the HPS hum?
Thanks.

Brother Numsi said:

Hi Nug,
I got this reply from a horticulturalist:
"
"You can actually grow with a light mover during vegetative and bloom grow cycles. The issue really is how much light do the plants want/need. If the plants are light loving they would do better under two 600w HPS lamps instead of one which is moving. Unless of course heat becomes and issue with multiple lights in which case you would need to vent the room and or run an AC to maintain optimum temperature and humidity. Generally however one 600w HPS lamp with cover a 6.5'x6.5' area and on a rail can cover the additional 6 ft length with sufficient light to grow almost anything. Only sun loving plants would really produce higher yields with the additional light. Hope this helps. Please let us know if we can assist with anything else."

I find that to be a bit non-commital on his part. Again we are looking at 6 plants and I am in my learning mode i.e. trying not to spend money needlessly.
I can always use a 1000w on a mover or 2 600w's not moving. I live in a rather warm climate from May to October. I suppose the heat in an attic may not be that noticeable. Any thoughts on the HPS hum?
Thanks.

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hey man, most of those guys aren't growing mj. i don't think you'll find too many growers that will tell you that a 600w light will cover 6.5' squared. not even close. it's more like 4' and that is even pushing it a little. there are a ton of light tests that have been done on the well known bulb companies and they all pretty much say that is the norm. you will get light out to 6.5' but what you are looking for is optimal footcandles which is between 5,000 and 10,000. that is the sweetspot for mj. i guess you could do 6.5' but you would need to rotate the plants from the outside to the inside everyday to make up for the diminished footcandles on the outside parameter of your light pattern.

honestly bro i really don't see exhausting 2 1200w to your attic as being a problem. plenty of people actually heat their attics because they are in use or because it reduces heating needs during the winter. in the summer the added few degrees of exhausting those lights into the attic will be so minimal i really don't think it will eb a problem. exhausting the lights outside through a single port would be a much more conspicuos way to go as you would be exhausting a heat signature into the open air.

if you do a light mover you aren't going to get the same yield as consistent lighting. if you want to evenly distribute light over the plants then give them a 90 degree turn every other day. all a lightmover is going to do is reduce your yield because your plants will not be getting optimal lighting for the entire light cycle.

i've never heard of hps hum? lights don't hum, ballasts do as far as i know. i think if you insulate your room though this shouldn't be a problem. plus if you are running 2 600w ballasts inside of a house i can't see how the police can detect the hum. maybe via frequency meters. i'm not really sure though. if you are still concerned about heat maybe run a single ballast on a flip. half the crop for 12 hours and then the other half for 12 hours. you would only need 1 ballast and a flip box. or you could just do 2 ballast (flip boxes cost about 65% of a ballast). would cost a little more in construction, ducting, and an extra fan probably.

nuglets said:

heat is heat. but air cooled reflectors are a lot easier to exhaust the heat from. the idea is to get the heat out of your room as quickly as possible before it dissipates. the longer it stays in your room the more your room cooling equipment has to work and the more electricity you use. i don't know where you live or why you are worried about your heat signature but even in the uk where they do flir flyovers i still think putting the exhaust from 1200w into your attic is little to nothing to be worried about.

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Nug,
What do you think of two of these?
http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/gavita-pro-600-se-complete-electronic-fixture-p-3820.html

Good or waste of funds? (No hum and need to find a lower price) Also, for veg, T5 or T8...leaning toward T8HO with CFL side lights. I'd likely use CFL on the sides with the HPS, too. Opinion?
Thanks.

Brother Numsi said:

Nug,
What do you think of two of these?
http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/gavita-pro-600-se-complete-electronic-fixture-p-3820.html

Good or waste of funds? (No hum and need to find a lower price) Also, for veg, T5 or T8...leaning toward T8HO with CFL side lights. I'd likely use CFL on the sides with the HPS, too. Opinion?
Thanks.

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those gavita ballasts are GREAT. the only problem i see is that they are not designed to be air cooled. so you will have to compensate for the extra heat in the room with your cooling system. intake/exhaust fans may not be enough and you may have to get an a/c unit. i think the ballasts on those actually run very cool as well but the heat is exhausted from them into the room too. check around or maybe call them cause i believe the recommend using special bulbs with their ballasts. not sure though, think it mught be a philips bulb. also, think the ballast only runs 240v. not sure if that is an issue for you.

if you can run a 240v line to your room then look at these(http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/lumatek-600w-240v-dimmable-dual-electronic-ballasts-p-2109.html). basically it's a dimmable dual ballast from lumatek. powers 2 bulbs for the price of 1 ballast basically. they only run on 240v though so you would need to bring a 240v outlet (nema-15r) into your room.

you won't need any side lights in veg. vegging plants don't benefit for supplemental lighting like flowering plants do. the whole reason for side lighting is because your overhead lighting does not have the penetration to reach the lower canopy. since you aren't growing 3-4' plants in veg you really don't need any side lighting. i would get a T5HO system and not a T8. T5's come in 2-16 bulbs fixtures. not sure how many plants you are doing but anything from 6-12 bulbs should be just fine. if anything, mix a little bloom spectrum in with your T5's. for example, if you have an 8 bulb fixture, use 5 veg spectrum bulbs and 3 bloom spectrum bulbs. one of these is what you want (http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/quantum-t5-badboy-grow-lights-c-321_952.html). they make cheaper models as well. Sun Blaze, Hydrofarm, etc... all are a little cheaper than the Quantum model. just make sure it is a 4' model and bulbs and not a 2' model.

if you are going to use supplemental CFL's in your flower room then they don't need to be high wattage. make them 40-75w bulbs. also, make them veg spectrum (6500k) as this will give you a broader spectrum in flower which means healthier plants and better yields.

nuglets said:

those gavita ballasts are GREAT. the only problem i see is that they are not designed to be air cooled. so you will have to compensate for the extra heat in the room with your cooling system. intake/exhaust fans may not be enough and you may have to get an a/c unit. i think the ballasts on those actually run very cool as well but the heat is exhausted from them into the room too. check around or maybe call them cause i believe the recommend using special bulbs with their ballasts. not sure though, think it mught be a philips bulb. also, think the ballast only runs 240v. not sure if that is an issue for you.

if you can run a 240v line to your room then look at these(http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/lumatek-600w-240v-dimmable-dual-electronic-ballasts-p-2109.html). basically it's a dimmable dual ballast from lumatek. powers 2 bulbs for the price of 1 ballast basically. they only run on 240v though so you would need to bring a 240v outlet (nema-15r) into your room.

you won't need any side lights in veg. vegging plants don't benefit for supplemental lighting like flowering plants do. the whole reason for side lighting is because your overhead lighting does not have the penetration to reach the lower canopy. since you aren't growing 3-4' plants in veg you really don't need any side lighting. i would get a T5HO system and not a T8. T5's come in 2-16 bulbs fixtures. not sure how many plants you are doing but anything from 6-12 bulbs should be just fine. if anything, mix a little bloom spectrum in with your T5's. for example, if you have an 8 bulb fixture, use 5 veg spectrum bulbs and 3 bloom spectrum bulbs. one of these is what you want (http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/quantum-t5-badboy-grow-lights-c-321_952.html). they make cheaper models as well. Sun Blaze, Hydrofarm, etc... all are a little cheaper than the Quantum model. just make sure it is a 4' model and bulbs and not a 2' model.

if you are going to use supplemental CFL's in your flower room then they don't need to be high wattage. make them 40-75w bulbs. also, make them veg spectrum (6500k) as this will give you a broader spectrum in flower which means healthier plants and better yields.

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Nug,
I am fortunate that I have a very friendly electrician who will wire whatever is needed., so running a pair of 240v lines if needed is no problem. I see one is needed for that ballast and that's no problem as well as buying bulbs and reflectors. The guy can also do the fan/vent/duct work.

To answer your question it will be 6 plants with 5-6 weeks of veg I believe. Based on that I think we'd need two T5HO 8 bulb systems...6 plants under one to start and then use two when they grow up. I can do something similar for venting in the veg room simple to aid in circulation.

What's your opinion on CO2...needed or a waste? Whatever the electrician does will be mounted up high to keep all cords off the floor. We will use eye hooks and string to keep the girls stretching and straight. We'll be careful with climate control...nutrients will be an entirely different issue.

Anything else you can think of? You have been a great help. I am not going to choose wisely when it come what to grow since the grow times will differ a bit. It will probably be GrapeGod and Kali Mist, although I have other seeds I can use.
Thanks again.

Nug,
Just doing research:
Need 2 of these..... http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/quantum-badboy-t5-4ft-lamp-grow-light-p-3353.html
Need 1 of these... http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/quantum-2900k-t5-fluorescent-grow-lamp-8pack-p-3516.html
Need 1 of these... http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/quantum-6500k-t5-fluorescent-grow-lamp-8pack-p-3518.html
Need 1 of these... http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/lumatek-600w-240v-dimmable-dual-electronic-ballasts-p-2109.html
Need 2 of these... http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/hydrofarm-da6ac-daystar-air-cool-reflector-p-2114.html
Need 1 of these... http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/orca-grow-film-54-50ft-roll-p-3714.html
Maybe need 1 of these...or duct tape... http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/orca-grow-film-seam-tape-3x75ft-p-3716.html

Just a preliminary list for a possible set up. I can actually be at their store later this month to pick it all up LOL The total is about $1,046 (without negotiating) to set up the lighting for both rooms. Wiring and climate control will be extra.

Brother Numsi said:

Nug,
I am fortunate that I have a very friendly electrician who will wire whatever is needed., so running a pair of 240v lines if needed is no problem. I see one is needed for that ballast and that's no problem as well as buying bulbs and reflectors. The guy can also do the fan/vent/duct work.

To answer your question it will be 6 plants with 5-6 weeks of veg I believe. Based on that I think we'd need two T5HO 8 bulb systems...6 plants under one to start and then use two when they grow up. I can do something similar for venting in the veg room simple to aid in circulation.

What's your opinion on CO2...needed or a waste? Whatever the electrician does will be mounted up high to keep all cords off the floor. We will use eye hooks and string to keep the girls stretching and straight. We'll be careful with climate control...nutrients will be an entirely different issue.

Anything else you can think of? You have been a great help. I am not going to choose wisely when it come what to grow since the grow times will differ a bit. It will probably be GrapeGod and Kali Mist, although I have other seeds I can use.
Thanks again.

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you definitely won't need 2 T5's bro. that 8 lamp unit is 4' long and 2' wide. that is plenty for 6 plant. trust me. you are only vegging them for 5-6 weeks. that's a 3 gallon pot probably. 3 gallon pots are like 8" wide. you can fit 6 in a row under 4' of T5. if you are gonna be LST'ing them or any other type of training and expect them to be really bushy and short then i would get the 12 lamp one that Quantum makes. that will be more than enough and probably save you some money as well.

i would do a few grows first before adding Co2. it's only a 12v plug for the controller and/or generator so no need to worry about that. i always say when you can go a whole grow with no major plant issues then it's time to add Co2. for your plants to take advantage of increased Co2 levels (1100-1800ppm) then they need to be in peak condition. if not then you are just wasting it. get a crop or two under your belt and if all goes well and you have the nutes and system dialed in then get Co2. also, no need for Co2 in veg.

Brother Numsi said:

Nug,
Just doing research:
Need 2 of these..... http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/quantum-badboy-t5-4ft-lamp-grow-light-p-3353.html
Need 1 of these... http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/quantum-2900k-t5-fluorescent-grow-lamp-8pack-p-3516.html
Need 1 of these... http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/quantum-6500k-t5-fluorescent-grow-lamp-8pack-p-3518.html
Need 1 of these... http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/lumatek-600w-240v-dimmable-dual-electronic-ballasts-p-2109.html
Need 2 of these... http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/hydrofarm-da6ac-daystar-air-cool-reflector-p-2114.html
Need 1 of these... http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/orca-grow-film-54-50ft-roll-p-3714.html
Maybe need 1 of these...or duct tape... http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/orca-grow-film-seam-tape-3x75ft-p-3716.html

Just a preliminary list for a possible set up. I can actually be at their store later this month to pick it all up LOL The total is about $1,046 (without negotiating) to set up the lighting for both rooms. Wiring and climate control will be extra.

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i'd get rid of the Orca film. that shit is a bitch to hang and really expensive. go to home depot or online and get a roll of duct insulation wrap. something like this (http://www.ecofoil.com/Applications/Residential-Insulation/R-8-HVAC-Duct-Wrap-Insulation). a lot easier to hang; cheaper; and better insulation than Orca. also will reduce your heat signature if you are worried about that. if you live in the U.S. you shouldn't be though.

what are you gonna do for bulbs? i recommend the hortilux eye super hps bulbs. little more expensive but they are top quality and have extra blue in the spectrum.

get a few digital thermometer/hygrometers that have probes. 1 for each room. you keep the probe on the plant canopy and the thermostat set to outdoor. that way you will know the temps on your plants at all times. they also have a high/low setting so when you are gone you can check when you get back to make sure temps weren't going wacky.

what about inline fans? i recommend CAN HO fans. the 6" one is great. plus CAN is one of the few companies that actually hit their rated CFM's. most inline fans advertise high CFM's but come nowhere close. also, use insulated ducting. will help reduce noise, odor leak, and heat leak as well.

let me know what you're gonna do about nutes. i can probably help.