L.E.D lighting

Thats very intersesting.
I think that new thread would be splendid, (for the handfull interested in how things actually work, and enjoy the discussion).
I was intending building my new Lamps comprising of just red and blue, but due to your input and some more researching, I'm now revising my thoughts somewhat, and am now contemplating around 70% red 640 nm (the spread around the centre frquency is supposedly 30nm either side, and when driven at the higher currents the centre frequencyrises slightly too, so thatshould give me a nice big hump at or around the main colour, although it would be nice to be able to get them at 660nm too and combine them). 5-9% Blue 465 470 nm, (same half spread spectrum), and I'm now considering the rest should be a white LED, (one plus is they are a higher lumen output, than coloured), and they mainly produce Blue and then re emit the rest of the spectrum from phosphor exitation, so its mainly a sharp blue hump with a gentle humped spread, of the rest to combine and give white, although some also use 3 RGB LEDs, but I THINK the phosphor type are more eficient and cheaper.
Although I intend using them originally with HID lighting, the Holy Grail is obviously going fully LED.
Imagine if the electriciy usage were only a 1/3 -1/2 as with HID, (I know there is silly talk about using 10 and 20% the power, but I realy thinks this IS total BS, at least for a good few years) .
With power going up the way it is AGAIN, I don't know what you lot outside the UK are paying for it per Kwatt/H, but its already GOT ridiculous here, and its supposedly going up another, get this 60% in the next 18 moon, the days of even reasonably priced power are over for good poeple.

Toodle pip

Leds did work for me on my mother plant now have 3 clones ready to bloom this time i will try 250 hps .

Ok, to squash all the mis-information on LED's, I would like to submit a study that was conducted by 4 Universities, Harvard, University of Iowa, University of Southern Illinois - Carbondale, and University of California - Berkley. The grants for the study came from the USDA. The stipulations were quite strict and all schools used the same exact equipment, built by University of Iowa. Each University grew 4 plants, 2 under HO LED's and 2 under HPS. Then Harvard published the study.

If you read this, and all of this, you will understand that LED's DO WORK AND DO WORK GOOD. However please keep in mind that these fixtures were very expensive to make, about $900 per fixture.

THE STUDY: Published by Harvard...

We report on a high-power solid-state lighting facility (fixture) for cultivation of greenhouse vegetables and on the results of the study of control of photosynthetic activity and growth morphology of radish and lettuce imposed by variation of the spectral composition of illumination. Experimental lighting modules (useful area of 0.22 m2) were designed based on 4 types of high-power light-emitting diodes (LEDs) with emission peaked in red at the wavelengths of 660 nm and 640 nm (predominantly absorbed by chlorophyll a and b for photosynthesis, respectively), in blue at 455 nm (phototropic function), and in far-red at 735 nm (important for photomorphology). Morphological characteristics, chlorophyll and phytohormone concentrations in radish and lettuce grown in phytotron chambers under lighting with different spectral composition of the LED-based illuminator and under illumination by high pressure sodium lamps with an equivalent photosynthetic photon flux density were compared. A well-balanced solid-state lighting was found to enhance production of green mass and to ensure healthy morphogenesis of plants compared to those grown using conventional lighting. We observed that the plant morphology and concentrations of morphologically active phytohormones is strongly affected by the spectral composition of light in the red region. Commercial application of the LED-based illumination for large-scale plant cultivation is discussed. This technology is favorable from the point of view of energy consumption, controllable growth, and food safety but is hindered by high cost of the LEDs. Large scale manufacturing of high-power red AlInGaP-based LEDs emitting at 650 nm and a further decrease of the photon price for the LEDs emitting in the vicinity of the absorption peak of chlorophylls have to be achieved to promote horticulture applications.

furcifer said:

Ok, to squash all the mis-information on LED's,
<snip>
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Well, the plants that you stated are for the veg stage only. What we need to know is how the perform in the flowering stage. Big difference here. In my own experiments, LEDs did OK in the veg stage but are very poor performing in the flowering stage. 5mm arrays simply don't have the photon flux density for good budding.

The abstract did not address the fact that pot budded out under LEDs tend to take longer to ripen compared to HPS (not that a university study would).

We are primarily interested in how LEDs perform in growing pot. Pot takes more light that other flowering crops like tomato. Every attempt shown in various forums of flowering pot with LEDs have been rather poor compared to HPS.

BTW, I more than just read these studies, I actually grow with LEDs both 5mm arrays and high power. At this point of technology they are a very poor choice for the typical pot grower.

It seems to me that there is another side to LED's that offsets their ineffectiveness.

Some people {like me} don't have the luxury of a large grow area, or the extra cash for all the additional equipment neccesary for an enclosed HPS system. I.e. Squirrel fans, carbon scrubbers etc.

I know that I grew some respectable smoke for less than 200bux in a cabinet in a relatively high traffic area. True the Nuggz were small, but I got enough weight to offset the cost of the setup.

So as you trash LED's please keep in mind that some folks are limited in just what we can do as far as grow areas. I think that what people are asking is if they WILL work, not what is better HPS/CFL/Led etc.

We all must agree that 1000w of HPS is god, but we cant all afford it (cost/energy use/ space / heat / smell)

AlaskanGreenMan said:

It seems to me that there is another side to LED's that offsets their ineffectiveness.

Some people {like me} don't have the luxury of a large grow area, or the extra cash for all the additional equipment neccesary for an enclosed HPS system. I.e. Squirrel fans, carbon scrubbers etc.

I know that I grew some respectable smoke for less than 200bux in a cabinet in a relatively high traffic area. True the Nuggz were small, but I got enough weight to offset the cost of the setup.

So as you trash LED's please keep in mind that some folks are limited in just what we can do as far as grow areas. I think that what people are asking is if they WILL work, not what is better HPS/CFL/Led etc.

We all must agree that 1000w of HPS is god, but we cant all afford it (cost/energy use/ space / heat / smell)

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LED lighting is much more expensive per watt than any other type of lighting. If you can't afford HPS then you can't afford LEDs.

Because LEDs have a lower electrical efficiency than other types of lighting, LED lighting will produce more heat per watt compared to CFL or HPS (no way around thermodynamics). All high power LED lamps have heat sinks and usually fans built in to keep them from burning up.

Buds grown under LEDs tend to take about 2 weeks longer to ripen. Buds grown under LEDs tend to be small and lacking density.

In short, at the present stage of technology, LEDs are about the worst choice for flowering. CFLs did better than LEDs in my side by side testing over an 18 month period with a variety of plants.

Don't waste our time on here 40acres! People come here to help each other! Don't put up pictures of bogus-ass basil or spinach or whatever the fuck your pictures are with the leds. If you want to grow basil go to a gardening forum!

thats great!! Your grow rooms kinda small.....lol!!!! psssst....those are beeeutiful l..e..d..s...@@@@@!!!!!

why are there so many haters on leds? I thought this was an openminded forum to share on. I use them and they are my choice. I can afford them and i love my set up. Hps isnt a bad light....neither are cfl's or metal halide. I have...have to use the leds.....for space and heat considerations and for discretion. I sleep at night....i do. couldnt do that with some of the other choices. The other great thing to remember is the lack of electrical usage. when growing discreetly.....its key. Read how the law uses YOUR ELECTRIC BILL to use against you for causefro a warrantable search. My light draws 90 watts....hmmmm....similiar to a light bulb. Thermal imaging......can see a room full of hot hps or mh.......but has a hard time discerning the heat from leds as anything more than....a household lightbulb.
All things considered.....if I had an area to use hps......i would.....with my leds.......especially if I didnt have to worry about kids or neighbors and potential fire issues. Leds are the best choice for supplemental lighting with HPS and should be promoted as a welcomed compliment to hps.....not a competitor....??? right??? We're here to find the best possible ways to grow...and help others who dont know any better to do the same. Hows everyone going to feel if led research blows the tops off the grow light industry........it'll be a huge "back-pedal-fest" haha! im just saying.....i love my fellow brothers for their choices....we're all in this together!! peace!!!!

hoffjgusmc said:

Don't waste our time on here 40acres! People come here to help each other! Don't put up pictures of bogus-ass basil or spinach or whatever the fuck your pictures are with the leds. If you want to grow basil go to a gardening forum!

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Ummmmm, this is a gardening forum

do i smell spam?? fuck these assholes, LED sucks ass it's not even worth the effort for additional lighting, use a cfl a,d get a whole lot more. HID is the way to go, and some sunsystems Ive seen cheaper than led systems.. so wtf? fuck thease shitty ass posts, and fuck 420toker and alaskan asshole, why turn a newb away? why mislead them so they have bad feeling about growing? why the fuck would you hurt our movement? fucking drink draino you bitches or pm i'll fly you to nm and stab in the throat.

normlpothead said:

Ummmmm, this is a gardening forum

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I know dude... but lets be honest how many tomato plants do you see on here? To post pictures of vegetables on here and claiming its weed is just lame! I looked up leds expecting to find useful information and the first posts that I see are pics some 15 year old cut and pasted on here. Thats not helpful to anyone. Yes, I guess you could call this a gardening forum technically... but if we don't police our own on here the forum will be full of misinformation!

i tried leds for a minute, it was sad to watch the plants straggle their way toward one single blue led over another on the light array. rofl. So i went out and bought a 400 wat hid and i am a lot happier.

hoffjgusmc said:

I know dude... but lets be honest how many tomato plants do you see on here? To post pictures of vegetables on here and claiming its weed is just lame! I looked up leds expecting to find useful information and the first posts that I see are pics some 15 year old cut and pasted on here. Thats not helpful to anyone. Yes, I guess you could call this a gardening forum technically... but if we don't police our own on here the forum will be full of misinformation!

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Didn't realize he was claiming tomatoes for weed... ROFL

I was just saying that because this is a (marijuana) gardening forum, didn't mean to piss you off, I agree completely about the misinformation. I was just thinking rephrasing to;

this is a marijuana or cannabis forum, if you want to grow vegetables go to the general gardening section... (Growing anything but marijuana)

I didn't see that post, but if he grew tomatoes with LEDs it does have some relevance in this thread...

igrowwithleds said:

why are there so many haters on leds? I thought this was an openminded forum to share on. I use them and they are my choice. I can afford them and i love my set up. Hps isnt a bad light....neither are cfl's or metal halide. I have...have to use the leds.....for space and heat considerations and for discretion. I sleep at night....i do. couldnt do that with some of the other choices. The other great thing to remember is the lack of electrical usage. when growing discreetly.....its key. Read how the law uses YOUR ELECTRIC BILL to use against you for causefro a warrantable search. My light draws 90 watts....hmmmm....similiar to a light bulb. Thermal imaging......can see a room full of hot hps or mh.......but has a hard time discerning the heat from leds as anything more than....a household lightbulb.
All things considered.....if I had an area to use hps......i would.....with my leds.......especially if I didnt have to worry about kids or neighbors and potential fire issues. Leds are the best choice for supplemental lighting with HPS and should be promoted as a welcomed compliment to hps.....not a competitor....??? right??? We're here to find the best possible ways to grow...and help others who dont know any better to do the same. Hows everyone going to feel if led research blows the tops off the grow light industry........it'll be a huge "back-pedal-fest" haha! im just saying.....i love my fellow brothers for their choices....we're all in this together!! peace!!!!

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Bah! A HPS needs no supplement. LEDs are nothing but an expensive gimick at this stage of technology. High power LEDs are much less efficient than HPS watt for watt. Watt for watt LEDs put out more heat than HPS.

Why the hate? Because plenty of us have wasted our money on them and don't want other people to fall for the LED scam. They are a complete joke for budding.

Well, we do live in an age of technology and I STILL haven't seen any real pics of a full LED grow. Is there anyone out there with proof??

into week three of flowering. Fist Time Grow ever. GH Hydro farm with two of those 12 inch square 10mm let lights.

GH Nutes
Using kool Bloom also now

Seems like it is working???

Ok guys, heres the latest. The buds are growing, very crystally and hard. Smell awesome. My light is the 40 watt Glow Panel w 10mm LEDs. Thought it said Grow but old tired eyes mislead me. It is a Glow Panel. $140 job made in china.

I moved the light a little further cause the 2" proximity was singing the little white hairs. Raised it to around 4-5" and the buds grew taller this week. That could be as a result of the maturity too.??

Using Gh Products in a GH hydro bucket with kool bloom being used in flowering.

I tried the t5 flourescents early on but the closet temp got too hot so this is why I am trying to make the LEds work. I mounted the T5 Fixture in my garage. Nice Light. I am sure not the same as I could do with HPS but I just don"t have the space.

this has been fun guys.

Glow Panel 40 watt w 10mm LEDs
GH Hydro bucket
GH nute and cool bloom
Starting week 8 of flowering
First time grow in a 17" x 24" space

Back to the topic at hand. Does any body who isn't full of shit have anything good to say about LEDs, or are they bunk?