LED DIY : Making of a "DJ SET "-style grow led light .
- Thread starter stardustsailor
- Start date
stardustsailor
Well-Known Member
Yes it is high for solder paste ...
Still within the limits of led's soldering pattern ...
Within ?
No ,exactly ! at liquid limit that Osram has set ...
Anyway ,it has no lead and has 1% more silver instead ,for hardness...(and corrosion resistance) ..And copper 0.5 % ...
Thus the higher melting point ...
Thing is ,that this paste is making soldering a bit more difficult ...
While with the edsyn cr44 ,soldering is going to be a lot more easier ,and maybe done at a tad lower temps ,than 245°C peak ...
(Since solder is liquid ,already from 183 °C ...) ....
Anyway ..I think is doable ...
Just a bit more difficult ...
This one has Sn62Pb36Ag2 ..
Same alloy ,~same melting point ....
http://www.termopasty.pl/pg_438_356_3_36_3_easy_print_sn62pb36ag2.html
Still within the limits of led's soldering pattern ...
Within ?
No ,exactly ! at liquid limit that Osram has set ...
Anyway ,it has no lead and has 1% more silver instead ,for hardness...(and corrosion resistance) ..And copper 0.5 % ...
Thus the higher melting point ...
Thing is ,that this paste is making soldering a bit more difficult ...
While with the edsyn cr44 ,soldering is going to be a lot more easier ,and maybe done at a tad lower temps ,than 245°C peak ...
(Since solder is liquid ,already from 183 °C ...) ....
Anyway ..I think is doable ...
Just a bit more difficult ...
This one has Sn62Pb36Ag2 ..
Same alloy ,~same melting point ....
http://www.termopasty.pl/pg_438_356_3_36_3_easy_print_sn62pb36ag2.html
stardustsailor
Well-Known Member
Well ....
Look the recommended profiles for each alloy combo ...
....View attachment 2517144
Which one fits best with the one Osram,suggests for SSLs ?
P.s. ....
Longer preheating and smoother temp rising for the SnAgCu .....
Longer and smoother everything ....
8 mins (at max ) from 25° to 245°....
Look the recommended profiles for each alloy combo ...
....View attachment 2517144Which one fits best with the one Osram,suggests for SSLs ?
P.s. ....
Longer preheating and smoother temp rising for the SnAgCu .....
Longer and smoother everything ....
8 mins (at max ) from 25° to 245°....
stardustsailor
Well-Known Member
Kitchen will then ...
(Don't an iron get warm enough ? above 200 ° C ?Or no ...? Dunno ..Never ironed my clothes ,in my life ...
(Don't an iron get warm enough ? above 200 ° C ?Or no ...? Dunno ..Never ironed my clothes ,in my life ...
stardustsailor
Well-Known Member
....
..
"AEG hot plate reflow solder machine"
Cooks also coffee ,bakes cakes ,chicken ,roast-beef ,ect ..
Literally speaking ....
(Directly switched at max position "9" it took about 25'-35' sec to reach 249°C ....
At "1" it takes ages to rise temp ... )
.."AEG hot plate reflow solder machine"
Cooks also coffee ,bakes cakes ,chicken ,roast-beef ,ect ..
Literally speaking ....
(Directly switched at max position "9" it took about 25'-35' sec to reach 249°C ....
At "1" it takes ages to rise temp ... )
guod
Well-Known Member
did you this link, i posted
http://ideal-spectrum-led.com/epages/box21231.sf/en_US/?ObjectPath=/Shops/box21231/Categories/"Moteurs de lumière - MCPCB multiLED"
nice modules, estimated 40 x 36mm, 8 to 14W
http://ideal-spectrum-led.com/epages/box21231.sf/en_US/?ObjectPath=/Shops/box21231/Categories/"Moteurs de lumière - MCPCB multiLED"
nice modules, estimated 40 x 36mm, 8 to 14W
stardustsailor
Well-Known Member
Summary of Oslon SSL soldering profile ....
1 ) Preheat Stage
In this stage all materials (pcb-solder paste-leds ) are slowly preheated ,from 25°C (T ambient ) to ~145-150°C (T soaking ) .
Recommended ramping is 2 °C / sec (which is rel. easy achievable with kitchen oven ) ..
Max Ramp ratio : 3 °C/sec
Duration of preheat : ~ 60 sec (1 min )
2) Soaking Stage
Materials are now heated in higher temps...
From ~150°C (Tsmin) to ~200°C (Tsmax) ..
min soak tim : 60 sec -- max soak time 120 sec
(Recommended : 0.5°C /sec - for ~90-100 secs .
After ~180° Ramp ratio goes back to 2°C/sec ...)
3 )Bathing Stage -Liquid Stage
Pre-solder liquid stage :
Stage that solder liquifies.Bonding is not done yet .
~40 sec above 217°C ramping to peak (~ 245°C)
4) Soldering stage
Total time above 217 ° = 80 sec ( ! max 100 sec ! )
Total soldering time in <245°C & >240°C : 20 sec (10 min -30 max)
Max peak temp :260 °C ( for less than 1 sec ,I guess ...)
5)Cooling stage :
Post soldering liquid stage :40 sec ( 245 => 217 )
Cooling down to 100° , not faster than 6°C/sec ...(3°/sec recommended )
.....
Needs some training ,for sure....
In the test I did, from 23 up to 249 in 25-30 sec ,neither solder had melted (no soaking-no paste form )
and pcb was bended/skewed quite a bit ....(no material pre-heat...)
And cooling was done rather rapidly ....
But .....
It is doable .
1 ) Preheat Stage
In this stage all materials (pcb-solder paste-leds ) are slowly preheated ,from 25°C (T ambient ) to ~145-150°C (T soaking ) .
Recommended ramping is 2 °C / sec (which is rel. easy achievable with kitchen oven ) ..
Max Ramp ratio : 3 °C/sec
Duration of preheat : ~ 60 sec (1 min )
2) Soaking Stage
Materials are now heated in higher temps...
From ~150°C (Tsmin) to ~200°C (Tsmax) ..
min soak tim : 60 sec -- max soak time 120 sec
(Recommended : 0.5°C /sec - for ~90-100 secs .
After ~180° Ramp ratio goes back to 2°C/sec ...)
3 )Bathing Stage -Liquid Stage
Pre-solder liquid stage :
Stage that solder liquifies.Bonding is not done yet .
~40 sec above 217°C ramping to peak (~ 245°C)
4) Soldering stage
Total time above 217 ° = 80 sec ( ! max 100 sec ! )
Total soldering time in <245°C & >240°C : 20 sec (10 min -30 max)
Max peak temp :260 °C ( for less than 1 sec ,I guess ...)
5)Cooling stage :
Post soldering liquid stage :40 sec ( 245 => 217 )
Cooling down to 100° , not faster than 6°C/sec ...(3°/sec recommended )
.....
Needs some training ,for sure....
In the test I did, from 23 up to 249 in 25-30 sec ,neither solder had melted (no soaking-no paste form )
and pcb was bended/skewed quite a bit ....(no material pre-heat...)
And cooling was done rather rapidly ....
But .....
It is doable .
stardustsailor
Well-Known Member
Yeap nice modules ,wrong choice of leds ....
And neither the ability to choose the right ones ..
(prices though,are quite nice for the modules ...)
stardustsailor
Well-Known Member
....I think this is going to be better than them ....
And i really think that those pcb surface copper pours ,
are going to make cooling way more efficient .
(heat spread .Increase conduction to/with Pcb ,thus with heatsink underneath ..
And increase heat to air convection,of heat directly from led slug ,due to large surface of copper
...Like an extra-thin-copper-single-fin heatsink.. )...
also it is just a " square wave line " of copper that has to go off ..
A small fine,soft quality brush ,will do wonders in etching ....
Almost a...Piece of cake !
stardustsailor
Well-Known Member
Now...
I'm thinking something ....
I bought a b/w laser printer ( Samsung for ~ 50€ ) and it has a resolution of 1200x 1200 Dots per inch ....
That is ....1200 dots / 254 mm = ~ 4.7 dots per mm printing capability .....
So printer can print a circuit with a "raster " of ~ 0,212 mm ...
(Normal FR4 pcbs,with standard electronic parts raster of 2.54 mm ,means that they need just 100 dots/inch printing
resolution ...
For tiny Oslons SSL mcpcb and SMD pcb designing , 1200 dpi ,seems the minimum limit of printing resolution .... )
Shhhi....
I've worked the mcpcb of leds with a raster of 0,05 mm ..
All this work useless ...
Have to do it all over again within printers capabilities ....
Crucial !!!! : Oslon power pads ,are 0.35 mm far from central thermal slug ........ .55mm thick ,both ....
Also pads have to be re-designed with that printers max raster .....
Shit !
I'm thinking something ....
I bought a b/w laser printer ( Samsung for ~ 50€ ) and it has a resolution of 1200x 1200 Dots per inch ....
That is ....1200 dots / 254 mm = ~ 4.7 dots per mm printing capability .....
So printer can print a circuit with a "raster " of ~ 0,212 mm ...
(Normal FR4 pcbs,with standard electronic parts raster of 2.54 mm ,means that they need just 100 dots/inch printing
resolution ...
For tiny Oslons SSL mcpcb and SMD pcb designing , 1200 dpi ,seems the minimum limit of printing resolution .... )
Shhhi....
I've worked the mcpcb of leds with a raster of 0,05 mm ..
All this work useless ...
Have to do it all over again within printers capabilities ....
Crucial !!!! : Oslon power pads ,are 0.35 mm far from central thermal slug ........ .55mm thick ,both ....
Also pads have to be re-designed with that printers max raster .....
Shit !
stardustsailor
Well-Known Member
Best led growing spectrum ever ...
(My humble opinion...)
Even with ordinary 8mm HiPwr leds ..
...
With Oslons SSLs ,spectrum is even ("way" ,actually..) better ...
(My humble opinion...)
Even with ordinary 8mm HiPwr leds ..
...With Oslons SSLs ,spectrum is even ("way" ,actually..) better ...
bicit
Well-Known Member
What website is that?
guod
Well-Known Member
guod
Well-Known Member
That is ....1200 dots / 254 mm = ~ 4.7 dots per mm printing capability .....
inch = 25,4 mm >> 47 dots per mm
the resolution is fine enough for this job.
finding the right paper for the toner-transfer is the problem. the i-net is full of infos on this.
http://www.opencircuits.com/Toner_Transfer
http://thomaspfeifer.net/platinen_aetzen.htm
inch = 25,4 mm >> 47 dots per mm
the resolution is fine enough for this job.
finding the right paper for the toner-transfer is the problem. the i-net is full of infos on this.
http://www.opencircuits.com/Toner_Transfer
http://thomaspfeifer.net/platinen_aetzen.htm
SnotBoogie
Well-Known Member
My clothes iron hits 207 C on max setting.
Used the EDSYN cr44 on Guod's reccommendation. It was a super silky job (TY guod, if i didnt say already... )
If you are doing a "home job" i would definitely consider the oslon temperature recommendations pessimistically! hitting the limit they set cant be healthy, right?
I've also wondered if the flat plate of the iron, being heated by a coil, has an irregular temerature output across its' surface...
Used the EDSYN cr44 on Guod's reccommendation. It was a super silky job (TY guod, if i didnt say already... )
If you are doing a "home job" i would definitely consider the oslon temperature recommendations pessimistically! hitting the limit they set cant be healthy, right?
I've also wondered if the flat plate of the iron, being heated by a coil, has an irregular temerature output across its' surface...
stardustsailor
Well-Known Member
Ok ,you might be right about that "religion" thing ...
But still ,brother ,personally I think that even for flowering ,
reds over 60% ,are not such a good idea ...
Ok ...
To be exact ,reds over 60% ,in low overall powers (like 1-2 of these boxes ? ) ,
actually can do wonders ...
But as ,the overall power of light increases ,then reds should decrease ,leaving space ,for some other wls ,to join the party (of photosynthesis...)
...
Yeap ,having only one or two of these lights in a grow ,
then probably reds can be more in % and actually contributing to bigger yields ...
But ...
Adding more light to the grow ,then reds % should drop ....
( photorespiration-photoinhibition wiil occur - really in shortwhile , if otherwise... )
...
Thing is to achieve ,an ...how should I put it ...."modular or all-around " spectrum ....
A spectrum that works fine (maybe not at best ) at vegging ,flowering ,low powers ,high powers ,ect ....
For sure adding more reds ,light gets "inclined" more as a "flowering light ".....
But then ,one sets also a limit for overall light power ..
Up to x umol/sec ...
...
...
Say look at HPS ...
With reds way lower than 60 % ,they still flower ..
But they do that (at their best) ,when 400 W ,600 W or 1000 W ...
At low powers (70-150-250 ) ,their yield difference with i.e. CFLs diminish ....
At that power (electrical / light ) levels ,CFLs -most of times -yield more than HID do ....
...
And finally ,say ,that still you wanted to have more reds ...
Then the most logical thing to do is to have all or most of red wls ,increased at approx same levels ...
Not just the area 620-640 or 640-660 ....(ok, those are the most basic ones ,at reds ..)
....
55%-60% of power in the area 600-690 nm,is more than enough ...
Just because plants " like " more the red wls(-"like" or "obligated " to utilise ? -) ,it does not mean automatically ,that supplying more red light ,one will force them to flower more ...
Or even, that is the best way to support a- possible- heavy flowering ,induced by other factors (chemical,ect ) ...
...
Anyway ..
As you ,already know ..
Religions are complex things ....