Led Users Unite!

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jdizzle22

Well-Known Member
Zman1080 said:
i guess this might be a typical question from many,

How can i figure out the math on how many watts LED = how many sq foot coverage with LED, such as,
250w LED equivalent to 800 hps(?) can cover what? 6x6 at 24 inch height? or am i completely wrong? correct me please.

Anyone who have more detailed knowledge about LED feel free to mail me as to help me figure out what id be needing if iwere to grow soon.
such as if i was to want a LED coverage for say, 9ftx5ft would i need perhaps, 2x 250w blackstar LED? positioned at what height/width for optimal coverage.
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Uhhh well a 250w blackstar should run about 135-140w which at best would cover a 2ftx2ft space. With those units I would go with 6-8 250w blackstars on light movers.

Me personally I would try to go with either 6 GLH 290w or 4 500w light movers won't make as big a difference as with blackstar because these really run at the wattage of their name, The core light concentration area of each does very well with 3x3 or 4x4. For a space your size and you really want to fill in everything but just enough room to walk around the edge ;) If you went with the 4 500w (they really run 500w not half that like a "500w" blackstar as they call it would) you could always slap whatever CFL or tube lighting you had between the LED lights that way they don't go to waste (or you don't have to sell em). Either way I would if growing plants naturally with no training to grow them no more than 3 or 4 feet (you can keep em 8-12 in away in flower and they will do great things 3-4 feet past that).
 
kush groove

kush groove

Active Member
DemontauruS said:
I have a fresh question related to LED's. Im running (2) 357Magnum LEDs in a 5' x 2' space - growing 10 Bubblicious Ice F. autos -2 mystery gender white widows - theyre growing in EcoGrowers, 6" pots, hydroton medium topped with a tiny bit of cocotek mylar surround... Very light nutes (1/2 dosage for amt of water), dept store filtered water. The temp above the plants is steady between 72-82 degrees F, and I have the containers chilled to 18.5 C (65-67 celcius). Im growing germinated seeds directly into the hydroton with the help of a tiny but of cocotek around the seedling base. Theyve grown their first set of true leaves, but the first three days all of this ran - the nutrient / water rose to near 76-78 degrees. I looked inside the EcoGrowers and smelled mold / mildew. Found white mildew starting to spread on the cocotek liners. Pulled one small runt seedling and found a slight bit of white fuzz on the root - put him back.

Now the fluids are cool again, and the system is running again as per norm. But my question is this. Will the reduced temp reduce, retard, or kill this mildw / mold? I dont know what else to do. PH's are all good, light is nice, temps are good, water got a crumb or to of cocotek in it - how can I avoid this mildew / mold problem? Any ideas? I dont want to lose these babies. I havent seen squat on EcoGrowers around here. The magnum357LEDs sem to kick serious as btw. Any help would be SO APPRECIATED.

Thanks all.
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your problem is probably organic nutes...........in hydro stay away from organic nutes
 
Zman1080

Zman1080

Member
how does that work if 300w LED is equalvent to 1000 hps? yet having 2 blackstar 250w leds will only get 270w?
when i see somewhere that a 180w LED can cover 3x3 space.. that a 600w can cover 12 sq ft (appx 4x3)
 
Hudsonvalley82

Hudsonvalley82

Well-Known Member
generally a 180W LED can cover 2x2 feet at most. A believe it is advertised as such. 240W is the max draw on the doides, it's sold as 80 3W led diodes. However those diodes are running at 50% wattage *or thereabouts. Therefore it only draws about 133W.

On the equivalence ratings, LED manufacturers are comparing their models to equivalent HID models. I don't think a 300W LED will replace a 1000W HPS. I'd say that a 300W unit (drawing only 180W or so) will replace a 400W HID. Now if it is an actual 300W draw (LED manufacturers advertise both on actual draw and diode ratings) then I'd say you can use that in place of about a 600W HID unit.

Light footprints from LED depend largely on Lens angles and the units actual size. From 300W - 600W units from blackstar the footprints are all the same, just at difference intensities and penetration capabilities. A lot of LED manufacturers grossly over estimate their units effective lighting area, thats one thing the blackstar gets pretty close.

ISIS, 357 Magnum, and Spectra LED units are all pretty good units as well if you are looking into them. For a reference, ISIS advertises the diode ratings, 357 Magnum advertises both their diode rating (357W) and their actual draw (180W), and Spectra advertises strictly on actual draw.

Zman1080 said:
how does that work if 300w LED is equalvent to 1000 hps? yet having 2 blackstar 250w leds will only get 270w?
when i see somewhere that a 180w LED can cover 3x3 space.. that a 600w can cover 12 sq ft (appx 4x3)
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J

jdizzle22

Well-Known Member
Zman1080 said:
how does that work if 300w LED is equalvent to 1000 hps? yet having 2 blackstar 250w leds will only get 270w?
when i see somewhere that a 180w LED can cover 3x3 space.. that a 600w can cover 12 sq ft (appx 4x3)
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The our LED is = to #wHID is almost always total crap. I've never seen an LED grow that gave someone 3-4x as much as they would have gotten with as many watts in HID (and that is going by the true wattage not the total diode max. People will say their 300w LED (which probably only runs about 160-180w) is as good as a 1000w HID (they use various tricks about efficiency to make it sound right). When trying to calculate how many LED watts you will need to replace HID watts I would multiply the HID watts by .6 - .8 (depending on the light maker and things like angle lens). The best LED might produce as much as 20-30% more per watt than HID (esp if HID is going say fewer 1000k bulbs instead of many 400s) under the best circumstances (not 400%-500% better like 95% of LED companies claim (the extra 400% they tack on mostly comes from them misleading about the wattage). Oh and no matter how strong the panel is I would avoid growing plants vertically more than 3-4ft without any training.

a 240/250w Blackstar should only really be as good as maybe 180-200w of HID (because while LED can do better than HID, the blackstars tend to run little more than half the power rating their name implies). That is also a trick companies use to make their lights seem cheaper than the good ones that come from great companies and don't mislead about the wattage. One should never pay more than $3 per watt actually pulled from electrical socket, one should always aim for 3w or a mix of 3w and 2w diodes, one should try to avoid 120 lens angles and stick with below that (60-90 seems best for most), oh and I believe its good to go for full spectrum panels (11-12 seems to be the most most do ;) )
 
kush groove

kush groove

Active Member
jdizzle22 said:
The our LED is = to #wHID is almost always total crap. I've never seen an LED grow that gave someone 3-4x as much as they would have gotten with as many watts in HID (and that is going by the true wattage not the total diode max. People will say their 300w LED (which probably only runs about 160-180w) is as good as a 1000w HID (they use various tricks about efficiency to make it sound right). When trying to calculate how many LED watts you will need to replace HID watts I would multiply the HID watts by .6 - .8 (depending on the light maker and things like angle lens). The best LED might produce as much as 20-30% more per watt than HID (esp if HID is going say fewer 1000k bulbs instead of many 400s) under the best circumstances (not 400%-500% better like 95% of LED companies claim (the extra 400% they tack on mostly comes from them misleading about the wattage). Oh and no matter how strong the panel is I would avoid growing plants vertically more than 3-4ft without any training.

a 240/250w Blackstar should only really be as good as maybe 180-200w of HID (because while LED can do better than HID, the blackstars tend to run little more than half the power rating their name implies). That is also a trick companies use to make their lights seem cheaper than the good ones that come from great companies and don't mislead about the wattage. One should never pay more than $3 per watt actually pulled from electrical socket, one should always aim for 3w or a mix of 3w and 2w diodes, one should try to avoid 120 lens angles and stick with below that (60-90 seems best for most), oh and I believe its good to go for full spectrum panels (11-12 seems to be the most most do ;) )
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another quote from the bible:

By tailoring the lights diodes' light spectrum to plant requirements, LEDs can be more efficient PAR producers. HPS lamps deliver more total light per watt of input, but LEDs are twice as efficient in PAR light per watt as HPS. That means that a 200w LED lamp can be substituted for a 400w HPS, and the 300w LED lamps can be substituted for 600w HPS lamps. The first generation of LED lamps did not emit an intense-enough light to support either active vegetative or flowering, but modern fixtures, which use higher-capacity diodes, have solved those early problems.

Higher quality systems use mostly red light along with some blue. Just as with any other product, manufacturers standards differ. A few manufacturers add the green light NASA has shown to be effective with plants, and amber is also sometimes added. Most manufacturers include a few white light emitters in their unit. These diodes actually emit a combination of red, green, and blue spectrums, which combine to appear white. White lights help to both supply useful wavelengths for the plants and the soften the eerie purple color generated by the combination of red and blue light. Luckily, the spectrum range is usually wider than the band that is guaranteed for each emitter.
 

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J

jdizzle22

Well-Known Member
kush groove said:
another quote from the bible:

By tailoring the lights diodes' light spectrum to plant requirements, LEDs can be more efficient PAR producers. HPS lamps deliver more total light per watt of input, but LEDs are twice as efficient in PAR light per watt as HPS. That means that a 200w LED lamp can be substituted for a 400w HPS, and the 300w LED lamps can be substituted for 600w HPS lamps. The first generation of LED lamps did not emit an intense-enough light to support either active vegetative or flowering, but modern fixtures, which use higher-capacity diodes, have solved those early problems.

Higher quality systems use mostly red light along with some blue. Just as with any other product, manufacturers standards differ. A few manufacturers add the green light NASA has shown to be effective with plant, and amber is also sometimes added. Most manufacturers include a few white light emitters in their unit. These diodes actually emit a combination of red, green, and blue spectrums, which combine to appear white. White lights help to both supply useful wavelengths for the plants and the soften the eerie purple color generated by the combination of red and blue light. Luckily, the spectrum range is usually wider than the band that is guaranteed for each emitter.
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I think I can see most of those colors on my panel, its supposed to be 12 colors/spectrumwavelengths or whatever they're called. Its a bit difficult to see in this pic, but you can make out a bunch of different ones (I'll try and find a mode that gets a better pic). I have definitely noticed all of those red and orange, blue, green, white, and even some that I can't see the light it produces o_O
1.jpgS7301834.jpg

Its really tough, I noticed though looking up close even without the lights on you can see the diodes are differen't colors although some are hard to distinguish (and others really easy). Its really tough getting pics with this cam, best I could do.

S7302085.jpgS7302091.jpgS7302088.jpgS7302094.jpg
 
N

ninjagaiden

Well-Known Member
you boys should see what the LED guys are growing over at 420mag, finally seeing buds match up to their HPS equivalents...well close at least
 
J

jdizzle22

Well-Known Member
ninjagaiden said:
you boys should see what the LED guys are growing over at 420mag, finally seeing buds match up to their HPS equivalents...well close at least
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Yeah I think half of them got kicked from that sites forums, but thats where every completed LED grow journal I've read came from (all the IrishBoy, SettingSun, and several others that all grew with GLH Spectra LEDs)

You have any links to some good ones you can pm me? I'm not sure its ok to post them in here?
 
dunit

dunit

Active Member
jdizzle22 said:
Yeah I think half of them got kicked from that sites forums, but thats where every completed LED grow journal I've read came from (all the IrishBoy, SettingSun, and several others that all grew with GLH Spectra LEDs)

You have any links to some good ones you can pm me? I'm not sure its ok to post them in here?
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Yup. Irish got booted (GLH Spectra), so did I (Magnums), Supergravy (GLH Blackstar side by side). Really dunno what's going on over their but aparently the anti-LED police are in full effect.....
 
B

BudBaby

Active Member
I thought i would post a picture of my seedlings which are under my 140 watt veg light off richard on ebay, he custom makes these lights and finds the best led bulb in each wavelength from the best suppliers at the time.

The little seedling i put in the cabs on monday, the others have had 15 days. Not sure how well they are going because its my first grow and i have nothing to compare them too.

These are all Big Buddah Blue Cheese.
 

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TshirtNinja

TshirtNinja

Well-Known Member
Yes gentlemen it has gotten rather hateful over here at RIU........ I honestly moved my journals elsewhere because of the hate on both led's and autoflower strains. If you are either and would like to have your journal actually looked at and not talked smack about pm me for the new forum. It's an autoflower startup forum and is making headway now with many grows and now the breeders take direct questions so that you can fine tune your setup with there experience.
 
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BudBaby

Active Member
Personally i dont get what all the fuss is about. I posted on a thread a week or so back about my LED lights and within minutes i had replies basicaly saying my lights were chinese and were rubbish. this was posted without anyone knowing who i got my lights off and what quality they were. I also got "i bet my plants will be bigger with my hps" bullshit.

Personaly i dont care about what other people yeild or use tbh, i care about my needs and what i will yeild. I genuinely dont get why people who have never used an LED light hate them so much. I mean its like going to a bar and having a go at someone who is drinking a different beer to yourself, telling them there beer is so much better lol. I really cant see any logic in it.
 
Al Dente

Al Dente

Member
I saw that... just posted a response. I got the same kind of knee-jerk ignorant reaction when I mentioned I was using urine as a nute. People act like I've personally attacked them just for saying I'm using it.
 
B

BlazedMonkey

Well-Known Member
I hear you guys when i talk about using the spleens of children people get angry and say im a bad grower. ;-)

But really those same people will switch the LED when they are cheaper, more efficient, provide more power, dont explode when you touch them with water :lol: , and you can customize the spectrum.

Look at the new LED tech they are coming out GE already made a bulb that will surpass HPS when it hits the commercial market. Haters gonna hate though.
 
Al Dente

Al Dente

Member
BlazedMonkey said:
I hear you guys when i talk about using the spleens of children people get angry and say im a bad grower.
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Well you are a bad grower. Do you have any idea how much industrial processed junk food ppl feed their kids, that shit accumulates in the organs, do you really want that in your grow? I wouldn't even feed that to my dog.
 
Bad Karma

Bad Karma

Well-Known Member
BudBaby said:
I posted on a thread a week or so back about my LED lights and within minutes i had replies basicaly saying my lights were chinese and were rubbish. this was posted without anyone knowing who i got my lights off and what quality they were. I also got "i bet my plants will be bigger with my hps" bullshit.
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I guarantee that everyone who says those things in your thread has penis size issues.
I'm betting they're about 4" at full capacity (if they're lucky), falling far short of being able to satisfy their lovers.
So now they have to try to fuck with people on the internet, because no ones fucking them in real life.
 
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