Lesson #1 in parenting in Virginia

too larry said:

Separated at birth and adopted at that time. This was years ago, because I had an ongoing fuss my my Mamma about it. She was in the 75/25 nurture/nature camp, while I think it is 75/25 nature/nurture.

But you are right about how much negative effects things like that can have. In this study, everyone was in stable homes. No way to tell about incest, and the like, because the vast majority of it doesn't get reported.

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Raised in similar culture? How far apart? Raised in stable families? Perhaps you could post a link to one of the studies you cite?

Sure, genetics are a strong influence, all other things being equal. My interactions with twins raised in the same family showed me that there were large differences between them and that's in the most closely matching situation.

Just using myself as an example, I broke my leg in a really serious accident when 12. Was hospitalized for a month and a half and spent an entire summer in a wheelchair. It took me years before I stopped walking with a limp and still can't run very well. The personal strength gained from dealing with pain and adversity, being "the other" who used a cane I experienced as a 13-YO kid made me what I am in many ways. I wouldn't change the facts of my life and don't see my experience as a negative at all, I just can't believe that this event didn't have more than the 25% factor you cite. You are saying that genetics drives everything?

Kids from Syria are coming into camps with PTSD. They will have a very different life compared to what they would have had if the civil war there hadn't broken up their community.

I don't buy it. So, I'd like to at least see some of the information you cite to get a better feel of where you are coming from. Hopefully you don't feel disrespected, we've had good interactions and I'm not picking a fight, I just have a very hard time with "When the sperm and egg meet, you are pretty much who you are going to be." line. Or even the 75/25 rule if we don't control for environment and allow for wide disparity in experiences.

Fogdog said:

Raised in similar culture? How far apart? Raised in stable families? Perhaps you could post a link to one of the studies you cite?

Sure, genetics are a strong influence, all other things being equal. My interactions with twins raised in the same family showed me that there were large differences between them and that's in the most closely matching situation.

Just using myself as an example, I broke my leg in a really serious accident when 12. Was hospitalized for a month and a half and spent an entire summer in a wheelchair. It took me years before I stopped walking with a limp and still can't run very well. The personal strength and adversity, being "the other" who used a cane I experienced made me what I am in many ways. I wouldn't change the facts of my life and don't see my experience as a negative at all, I just can't beleive that this event didn't have more than the 25% factor you cite. You are saying that genetics drives everything?

Kids from Syria are coming into camps with PTSD. They will have a very different life compared to what they would have had if the civil war there hadn't broken up their community.

I don't buy it. So, I'd like to at least see some of the information you cite to get a better feel of where you are coming from. Hopefully you don't feel disrespected, we've had good interactions and I'm not picking a fight, I just have a very hard time with "When the sperm and egg meet, you are pretty much who you are going to be." line. Or even the 75/25 rule if we don't control for environment and allow for wide disparity in experiences.

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I'm not saying genetics is everything, but it does provide the canvas your life is painted on. And I'm not trying to change anyone's minds either. That is just my opinion from what I have heard and seen.

Here is a story about it on NPR from 2007. Lots of others, just Google twins separated at birth studies.

https://www.npr.org/2007/10/25/15629096/identical-strangers-explore-nature-vs-nurture

too larry said:

I'm not saying genetics is everything, but it does provide the canvas your life is painted on. And I'm not trying to change anyone's minds either. That is just my opinion from what I have heard and seen.

Here is a story about it on NPR from 2007. Lots of others, just Google twins separated at birth studies.

https://www.npr.org/2007/10/25/15629096/identical-strangers-explore-nature-vs-nurture

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You are right. Genetics plays an important role in who we become. I would say genetics set the upper bound for who we can be. I would also say we really have no idea how high that bound is even for the average person.

So does the circumstances of family and experiences we encounter while growing up.

I love to cook. The ingredients determine how good a dish can be. After that, the dish can be splendid or fail depending on the cook.

too larry said:

Studies of twins separated at birth show that much of what we do in live is heavy influenced by genetics. Not saying it's everything, but it is a big part.

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Yes true, also some completely isolated species in separate environments have evolved almost exactly the same. How ever it heavily comes down to the environments being within a similar range. For example, elephants don't have much hair and big ears to deal with heat. Woolly mammoths had smaller ears and ofc more hair to deal with cold.

If the twins are in different country's and/or rich/poor it is almost impossible they will have more in common than not, it's just interesting when it happens, as opposed to say a long lost drug dealer and prostitute.

zeddd said:

@Flowki you mentioned “dangerous soft left” that’s a bit weird for an English bloke, I’ve only ever heard Neo Nazis talk like this, do you celebrate 4/20 (1889)?

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You should expand who you converse with in real life if you've only ever heard that from a neo nazi... because you clearly lack diversity, ironically.

Flowki said:

You should expand who you converse with in real life if you've only ever heard that from a neo nazi... because you clearly lack diversity, ironically.

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So you are sympathetic to Neo Nazis? Is that why you speak like them?

zeddd said:

So you are sympathetic to Neo Nazis? Is that why you speak like them?

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How far left exactly?.

Fogdog said:

You are right. Genetics plays an important role in who we become. I would say genetics set the upper bound for who we can be.

So does the circumstances of family and experiences we encounter while growing up.

I love to cook. The ingredients determine how good a dish can be. After that, the dish can be splendid or fail depending on the cook.

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I agree great ingredients and good technique make the dish, either can be ruined with a heavy hand.

Flowki said:

How far left exactly?.

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I don’t vote so couldn’t give a shit about the UK political dialectic. We live in a monarchy not a democracy. Fuk them

zeddd said:

I don’t vote so couldn’t give a shit about the UK political dialectic. We live in a monarchy not a democracy. Fuk them

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It certainly isn't democracy at it's best but you make it sound like a dictatorship. So like you, I am exempt from any label so long as I don't vote?. Interesting logic.. like suggesting it's only adultery if you enjoy it.

Fogdog said:

You are right. Genetics plays an important role in who we become. I would say genetics set the upper bound for who we can be. I would also say we really have no idea how high that bound is even for the average person.

So does the circumstances of family and experiences we encounter while growing up.

I love to cook. The ingredients determine how good a dish can be. After that, the dish can be splendid or fail depending on the cook.

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This is a mark for your side of the ledger.

Driving into work today I was listening to Tech Nation on NPR. The program is about how Adverse Childhood Events can effect you DNA and eventually your health. If you look at the strands of DNA like shoelaces, the little protector on the end, kind of like the plastic tip on your laces, will wear off and your actual data storing DNA can degrade. But they have also shown that it can be reversed with basic human contact and a stable home.

They don't have the podcast loaded yet, but here is the site. It is worth a listen.

https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/technation