Living Soil Help

LilT211

LilT211

Well-Known Member
So I’m trying to get as close to a water only soil as possible. Haven’t had the best game plan from the door on this one. To start I have 30 gals of promix as my base. I have more but I only need 28 total gallons for my flowering run. I added Jobes AP 444 @ 33g/g. Blood and blood meal @ 1oz/gal and alfalfa meal @ .025oz/gal. I also added 12lbs of ewc. I have compost but I’m unsure of how much to use. Is this mix too hot, what should I add because I feel like something is missing. First time building soil without an outline so yeah take it easy if I’m way off base.
Thanks for the help in advance.
 
Canada_420

Canada_420

Well-Known Member
LilT211 said:
So I’m trying to get as close to a water only soil as possible. Haven’t had the best game plan from the door on this one. To start I have 30 gals of promix as my base. I have more but I only need 28 total gallons for my flowering run. I added Jobes AP 444 @ 33g/g. Blood and blood meal @ 1oz/gal and alfalfa meal @ .025oz/gal. I also added 12lbs of ewc. I have compost but I’m unsure of how much to use. Is this mix too hot, what should I add because I feel like something is missing. First time building soil without an outline so yeah take it easy if I’m way off base.
Thanks for the help in advance.
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Quite a bit of N in that mix. I'd suggest cooking it for a good while because it will likely be hot as you mentioned. Building your own soil is really a preference thing but id add more P & K inputs like Kelp meal, High P guano, langbeinite, insect frass. Also some rock dusts glacial, basalt etc. Also that mix could really use some extra perlite imo. There's so many options but your N seems quite high.
 
GrassBurner

GrassBurner

Well-Known Member
Before going any farther,, Id run down to Lowes/Home Depot and pick up a little rapitest soil kit. Get an idea of where you're at in regards to npk. Was the recommended application rate for the Jobe's 33 grams per gallon?
After you test the soil, you can adjust from there. If your mix tests too hot, use some of your extra promix to dilute it. I don't think Oyster Shell flour and some kelp meal would hurt anything.
I use lava rocks and perlite for aeration. I would definitely add more aeration, you want it to be about 30% of your total volume. I believe some people run up to 40%.
Lots of recipes out there. You can check out Coots mix for an excellent starting point. Good Luck
 
LilT211

LilT211

Well-Known Member
Canada_420 said:
Quite a bit of N in that mix. I'd suggest cooking it for a good while because it will likely be hot as you mentioned. Building your own soil is really a preference thing but id add more P & K inputs like Kelp meal, High P guano, langbeinite, insect frass. Also some rock dusts glacial, basalt etc. Also that mix could really use some extra perlite imo. There's so many options but your N seems quite high.
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Yeah really wasn’t thinking too much. Just got tired of waiting for my beans and went to the store. The extra perlite will be ordered from Amazon or another source. I did see kelp meal and guanos in the store. Do you have a recommended rate for guano and kelp meal? The other things you mentioned weren’t available at HD/Lowe’s in my area. I’m nervous about the N being high. Don’t want to burn the ladies before they even get going.
 
LilT211

LilT211

Well-Known Member
GrassBurner said:
Before going any farther,, Id run down to Lowes/Home Depot and pick up a little rapitest soil kit. Get an idea of where you're at in regards to npk. Was the recommended application rate for the Jobe's 33 grams per gallon?
After you test the soil, you can adjust from there. If your mix tests too hot, use some of your extra promix to dilute it. I don't think Oyster Shell flour and some kelp meal would hurt anything.
I use lava rocks and perlite for aeration. I would definitely add more aeration, you want it to be about 30% of your total volume. I believe some people run up to 40%.
Lots of recipes out there. You can check out Coots mix for an excellent starting point. Good Luck
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Thanks for replying. The rapid test will work wonders. Didn’t even think about that. So use to bottles and ml and all that jazz. This building soil is different.
As for the Jobe’s I took the tablespoon weight of it and converted it to grams for the batch. I think that may be the only thing I’ve done right so far. I’m sold on the kelp meal, do you have a recommendation on rates? The oyster shell flour is going to have to be a online purchase, first time hearing about it. The perlite should be here soon. How long do you think I should”cook” this before it’s ok for the plants?
 
Canada_420

Canada_420

Well-Known Member
LilT211 said:
Yeah really wasn’t thinking too much. Just got tired of waiting for my beans and went to the store. The extra perlite will be ordered from Amazon or another source. I did see kelp meal and guanos in the store. Do you have a recommended rate for guano and kelp meal? The other things you mentioned weren’t available at HD/Lowe’s in my area. I’m nervous about the N being high. Don’t want to burn the ladies before they even get going.
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1/4 - 1/3 of the recomended amount labelled on the container because you already have the jobes. Again cook it well so you wont get that N burn.

Also kelp meal is hard to overdo. U can use it full strength

Honestly though sinxe its a flowering mix id get more base and dilute the N a bit and add more p k. Too much n in flower is no fun. But that's just me.
 
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LilT211

LilT211

Well-Known Member
Canada_420 said:
1/4 - 1/3 of the recomended amount labelled on the container because you already have the jobes. Again cook it well so you wont get that N burn.

Also kelp meal is hard to overdo. U can use it full strength

Honestly though sinxe its a flowering mix id get more base and dilute the N a bit and add more p k. Too much n in flower is no fun. But that's just me.
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Great advice. So guys do you think I will be better off adding another 30 gals of unamended soil for a total of sixty gals? The only thing I would be adding is perlite, kelp meal and oyster flour if I can get my hands on it? Hope this makes sense.
 
Fatleg77

Fatleg77

Well-Known Member
I don't think people understand that in a proper organic living soil you have all the NPK the plants ever want at any point in their life cycle.They only uptake what they want as opposed to being force-fed salt-based nutrients where they have no choice but to accept it. I plant my seeds directly into 5 gallon pots with fully amended soil that will carry them 30 to 45 days before it needs re-amending. When you begin re using soil grow after grow it gets better and better and the plants respond with alot of enthusiasm. Once you cultivate a real living organic soil it is very easy to grow very healthy plants that can fully Express their genetics without ever being hindered because all the nutrients in the soil are there like a buffet and they can have it whenever they want.Sorry for the rant..hope that helps you! Do yourself a favor and watch every video from mr. Canucks grow on YouTube he does an excellent job up teaching you how to do it it's the way I follow and I've had nothing but absolute success since I started
 
LilT211

LilT211

Well-Known Member
Fatleg77 said:
I don't think people understand that in a proper organic living soil you have all the NPK the plants ever want at any point in their life cycle.They only uptake what they want as opposed to being force-fed salt-based nutrients where they have no choice but to accept it. I plant my seeds directly into 5 gallon pots with fully amended soil that will carry them 30 to 45 days before it needs re-amending. When you begin re using soil grow after grow it gets better and better and the plants respond with alot of enthusiasm. Once you cultivate a real living organic soil it is very easy to grow very healthy plants that can fully Express their genetics without ever being hindered because all the nutrients in the soil are there like a buffet and they can have it whenever they want.Sorry for the rant..hope that helps you! Do yourself a favor and watch every video from mr. Canucks grow on YouTube he does an excellent job up teaching you how to do it it's the way I follow and I've had nothing but absolute success since I started
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I dig Mr. Canucks channel. He inspired me to go the Gaia Green route. Too bad the shipping was more than the products to get it here in the US.
I understand the buffet vs force fed theories. The only thing I wonder is how would they burn? I just have heard the soil is too ‘hot’ never understood why.
 
Canada_420

Canada_420

Well-Known Member
LilT211 said:
I dig Mr. Canucks channel. He inspired me to go the Gaia Green route. Too bad the shipping was more than the products to get it here in the US.
I understand the buffet vs force fed theories. The only thing I wonder is how would they burn? I just have heard the soil is too ‘hot’ never understood why.
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Gaia green is good stuff. I use it mixed in with my homemade. I get it locally but im in Canada obviously.

To simply put it the plants absorb more N than they can process. Creating the burn
 
GrassBurner

GrassBurner

Well-Known Member
An organic living soil still has to be ammended. You can put your ammendments into a worm bin, and add those castings back into your soil.. If you just keep using it without adding anything back in, you'll run out eventually.
Ive been using Dr Earth the last couple grows, and it's been incredible. I hear it's pretty close to the GG?
I started with a coots mix soil. Peat, lava rock, perlite, compost, worm castings, dry ammendments and minerals. After each run, all my soil gets taken outside, where I dump it back into my fresh soil pile. I turn the old soil into the new, then take out what I need for the next run. That soil gets reammended for the next run. I use Dr Earth Homegrown at 1/4 strength for veg. I add a little agsil, big 6 micronutrients, malted barley, and water that in lightly with humic acid. Put the plants in, and just water until I flip to flower. Scratched in Dr Earth Flower Girl, and lightly watered that in when I flipped this time. Depending on how many males/females I get, and how many plants end up in each container, I might top dress and scratch in at 1/4 strength one more time around week 3 or 4.
 
Fatleg77

Fatleg77

Well-Known Member
GrassBurner said:
An organic living soil still has to be ammended. You can put your ammendments into a worm bin, and add those castings back into your soil.. If you just keep using it without adding anything back in, you'll run out eventually.
Ive been using Dr Earth the last couple grows, and it's been incredible. I hear it's pretty close to the GG?
I started with a coots mix soil. Peat, lava rock, perlite, compost, worm castings, dry ammendments and minerals. After each run, all my soil gets taken outside, where I dump it back into my fresh soil pile. I turn the old soil into the new, then take out what I need for the next run. That soil gets reammended for the next run. I use Dr Earth Homegrown at 1/4 strength for veg. I add a little agsil, big 6 micronutrients, malted barley, and water that in lightly with humic acid. Put the plants in, and just water until I flip to flower. Scratched in Dr Earth Flower Girl, and lightly watered that in when I flipped this time. Depending on how many males/females I get, and how many plants end up in each container, I might top dress and scratch in at 1/4 strength one more time around week 3 or 4.
Click to expand...
Yes absolutely still has to be amended and re amended as you grow along.
 
GrassBurner

GrassBurner

Well-Known Member
I'm getting close to using/reusing this soil for about a year now. @Northwood, how long you been reusing your soil?
I keep a compost pile next to my soil pile. Sometimes I'll put a light layer of fresh compost over my soil and mix it in. I put in a bunch of oak leaves last fall, and all my trimmings/rootballs/plant leftovers get put into the compost pile.
I'm gonna build a worm bin this year. If you make your own castings, and your own compost, you'll have an incredible soil.
 
N

Northwood

Well-Known Member
GrassBurner said:
@Northwood, how long you been reusing your soil?
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It will be 3 years soon for growing in undisturbed soil in the current bed/pot. But most of the soil in my current setup comes from the recycle bins I had a no-till going on before that for 3 years. When I first started my current setup I emptied each of the 4 bins out in one piece into the empty bed so not to disturb the soil, still with full skeletons of my last grow in them, and then added enough new soil mix to fill in the gaps.
 
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