My plant died:(

Hi everyone,

I transplanted a big plant into a larger pot, and it just died, it looks like overwatering, but it looks like it completely drowned.

Perhaps the roots wernt in the extra medium I added, so they drowned in the new medium as the new medium was wet.

Can anyone suggest a better way to transplant? Water after transplant to avoid this infuture? growing in coco perlite 50/50.

Thanks!

Not sure if this allowed, remind for future reference if it isn't.

https://www.leafly.com/news/growing/how-and-when-to-transplant-cannabis-plants

This link is pretty useful right here, pretty much has answers to common FAQS about transplanting. I always suggest adding a diverse colony of microbes to your medium as well. (Great White, Plus-C, Myco Madness, Root Rally, Myco Apply, there are tons on the market.) Anti-Shock nutrients can be watered in as well if applicable. (Vitamin B1, etc.)

Yeah, water after transplanting

TrillDank said:

Not sure if this allowed, remind for future reference if it isn't.

https://www.leafly.com/news/growing/how-and-when-to-transplant-cannabis-plants

This link is pretty useful right here, pretty much has answers to common FAQS about transplanting. I always suggest adding a diverse colony of microbes to your medium as well. (Great White, Plus-C, Myco Madness, Root Rally, Myco Apply, there are tons on the market.) Anti-Shock nutrients can be watered in as well if applicable. (Vitamin B1, etc.)

Click to expand...

Linking is fine

Porky101 said:

Hi everyone,

I transplanted a big plant into a larger pot, and it just died, it looks like overwatering, but it looks like it completely drowned.

Perhaps the roots wernt in the extra medium I added, so they drowned in the new medium as the new medium was wet.

Can anyone suggest a better way to transplant? Water after transplant to avoid this infuture? growing in coco perlite 50/50.

Thanks!

Click to expand...

Stop growing in coco.

Porky101 said:

Hi everyone,

I transplanted a big plant into a larger pot, and it just died, it looks like overwatering, but it looks like it completely drowned.

Perhaps the roots wernt in the extra medium I added, so they drowned in the new medium as the new medium was wet.

Can anyone suggest a better way to transplant? Water after transplant to avoid this infuture? growing in coco perlite 50/50.

Thanks!

Click to expand...

You had to damage those roots somehow is my guess.

I'll take a guess and say you let the medium dry out before transplanting?

It's pretty hard to over water coco, unless it's a small plant with no root system. If that is the case you want it to dry out some between watering to get the root mass big enough for multi-feeds.

Da2ra said:

I'll take a guess and say you let the medium dry out before transplanting?

It's pretty hard to over water coco, unless it's a small plant with no root system. If that is the case you want it to dry out some between watering to get the root mass big enough for multi-feeds.

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No, it never dried out. The rootzone was fully saturated. It definitly died from over watering. I never even saw it coming, usually they droop before, this thing died real fast, asif you chopped all the roots off.

Should I water with plain water or let it dry out completely?

You never let coco dry out completely, that's why I asked.

Water with nutrients every watering as well.

When the plant is small you let the coco dry out some but not completely. You want to encourage root growth until the plant can actually handle watering 2-5 times per day. If you start multi-feeds too soon the root zone will be stunted and you won't get the benefits of coco. Oversized root zone in a small container is where coco really shines! I've had 1.5 gallon containers (coco) outperforming 5 gallon containers (in soil) when done right.

The problem with this is if you miss a day of watering because of power outage you could lose your plants in less than a day.

Da2ra said:

You never let coco dry out completely, that's why I asked.

Water with nutrients every watering as well.

When the plant is small you let the coco dry out some but not completely. You want to encourage root growth until the plant can actually handle watering 2-5 times per day. If you start multi-feeds too soon the root zone will be stunted and you won't get the benefits of coco. Oversized root zone in a small container is where coco really shines! I've had 1.5 gallon containers (coco) outperforming 5 gallon containers (in soil) when done right.

The problem with this is if you miss a day of watering because of power outage you could lose your plants in less than a day.

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Watering 2-5 times per day? Sounds tedious. Why not just let the medium dry out a bit and water every couple days? This would promote root growth throughout the entire grow and prevent root ball no?

You should be growing in soil if you want to water the plant every couple of days. My system is automated so I'm not hand watering 5 times per day if that's what you're thinking.

In coco you don't need as much medium as soil. So you can grow the same size plant in a 1 gallon of coco as you could in 3 gallon of soil. The root system should be complete by the time you put the plant into flowering. You could use a bigger pot and water every couple of days but then you aren't really benefiting from the coco and should probably just be using soil.

Da2ra said:

You should be growing in soil if you want to water the plant every couple of days. My system is automated so I'm not hand watering 5 times per day if that's what you're thinking.

In coco you don't need as much medium as soil. So you can grow the same size plant in a 1 gallon of coco as you could in 3 gallon of soil. The root system should be complete by the time you put the plant into flowering. You could use a bigger pot and water every couple of days but then you aren't really benefiting from the coco and should probably just be using soil.

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Ah I see, that makes more sense then. The coco vs soil stuff is very interesting and I could see how watering more frequently could keep the roots small. But, doesn't the plant require bigger roots as it grows? It's gonna need more nutrients as it gets bigger so that's why the roots grow no? I think the amount of space for the roots to grow would have a great effect on the overall growth. It's just my personal opinion so I wonder if I've been wrong this whole time haha. I'm growing in a 2x4 tent so I was considering buying two 15 gallon pots. If you're right then I should just buy coco and keep the 5 gallon pots.

Da2ra said:

You never let coco dry out completely, that's why I asked.

Water with nutrients every watering as well.

When the plant is small you let the coco dry out some but not completely. You want to encourage root growth until the plant can actually handle watering 2-5 times per day. If you start multi-feeds too soon the root zone will be stunted and you won't get the benefits of coco. Oversized root zone in a small container is where coco really shines! I've had 1.5 gallon containers (coco) outperforming 5 gallon containers (in soil) when done right.

The problem with this is if you miss a day of watering because of power outage you could lose your plants in less than a day.

Click to expand...

Yep, I have noticed this affect aswell.

That is exactly why my plants died, I water around 3x per day because usually the root mass is pretty big. I let it get rootbound before connecting it to my automatic watering system.

Lesson learned.

Medicated Bonsai said:

Ah I see, that makes more sense then. The coco vs soil stuff is very interesting and I could see how watering more frequently could keep the roots small. But, doesn't the plant require bigger roots as it grows? It's gonna need more nutrients as it gets bigger so that's why the roots grow no? I think the amount of space for the roots to grow would have a great effect on the overall growth. It's just my personal opinion so I wonder if I've been wrong this whole time haha. I'm growing in a 2x4 tent so I was considering buying two 15 gallon pots. If you're right then I should just buy coco and keep the 5 gallon pots.

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In coco -the more you water, the more oxygen you're supplying your root system. More oxygen=more nutrient uptake. That's why you can get away with using smaller pots.

Coco is less forgiving than soil though. You will see your mistakes in feeding within hours at times, where as soil would take a few days before you realized you over/under fed.

Watering until you get runoff is also a must as salt can build up quite fast. The amount of nutrients you will run through is quite a bit more than if you were to be growing in soil.

5 gallon is a bit much for that size space as well. I use 7 gallon containers and you couldn't even fit one of my plants in that tent.

I also wouldn't start seedlings in coco. I've seen quite a few reports of people losing seedlings. Mostly from over watering but you still may be better off using starter packs like peat pellets when starting out.

I wouldn't really recommend coco to newcomers though. It's best to learn the ropes on a soil grow. Less hassle with ph and ppm readings and constantly mixing up nutrients, so you can focus your energy on other fun things like lst/training.

Da2ra said:

In coco -the more you water, the more oxygen you're supplying your root system. More oxygen=more nutrient uptake. That's why you can get away with using smaller pots.

Coco is less forgiving than soil though. You will see your mistakes in feeding within hours at times, where as soil would take a few days before you realized you over/under fed.

Watering until you get runoff is also a must as salt can build up quite fast. The amount of nutrients you will run through is quite a bit more than if you were to be growing in soil.

5 gallon is a bit much for that size space as well. I use 7 gallon containers and you couldn't even fit one of my plants in that tent.

I also wouldn't start seedlings in coco. I've seen quite a few reports of people losing seedlings. Mostly from over watering but you still may be better off using starter packs like peat pellets when starting out.

I wouldn't really recommend coco to newcomers though. It's best to learn the ropes on a soil grow. Less hassle with ph and ppm readings and constantly mixing up nutrients, so you can focus your energy on other fun things like lst/training.

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True. It is frustrating the different grades of coco. Some coco you cannot over water. The coco that killed my plants is super fine, the finest coco I have ever seen, as if someone put the coco in a grinder before. Coco generally cannot be over watered but certain grades of coco makes over watering almost a given. I have decided I will no longer use coco only, I will mix vermiclute and perlite and I will be left with 30-40% coco. The more I water them the faster the growth, having more aeration has only proven to better results.


I have been growing in coco for over ten years, and I am still learning. This latest plant death I would say was a combination of very fine coco, high temps (88F) resulting in the plant transpiring less leading too overwatering and overwatering on my side aswell.

Vermiculite will only exasperate your efforts to avoid over watering / depriving your roots of oxygen. Vermiculite retains moisture more than it aerates. I would think with a 50/50 mix of coco / perlite that you would have had some serious drainage...perhaps too much? At any rate you obviously know the plant is dead and you know how it occurred, so a lesson learned and perhaps some new information has been passed on to others in the process.

CannaCountry said:

Vermiculite will only exasperate your efforts to avoid over watering / depriving your roots of oxygen. Vermiculite retains moisture more than it aerates. I would think with a 50/50 mix of coco / perlite that you would have had some serious drainage...perhaps too much? At any rate you obviously know the plant is dead and you know how it occurred, so a lesson learned and perhaps some new information has been passed on to others in the process.

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I thought vermiculite holds less water than coco?

I can give an example:

WIth the coco I am using currently that killed my plants (very fine coco). If I fill a 1 gallon pot full and then water it so the medium is fully saturated, then let it drain for 5 minutes then weigh the pot, the weight is 5LBS (less the weight of the pot and coco).

If I fill the same 1 gallon pot full of vermiculite, saturate the medium fully, let it drain and then weigh it, the weight is 3LBS.

So it would seem the vermiculite holds the least water after drainage?\



A few of my plants havent died, but I planted them in this horribad coco. What should I do...water them very very slowly? allowing them to dry out and let them get fully rootbound? I can see they not doing as good as the others in my more airy mixes.

I totally follow your example and it makes sense, but what weighs more, a Gallon of dry vermiculite or a Gallon of dry Coco, and how does one determine the amount of moisture in both prior to starting the experiment? Without starting at the same base number the end number isn't going to mean anything. Follow me? Never the less, it's not so much about the amount of water your medium is holding as much as it is the amount of O2 it holds in relation to said water.

As to what to do; I'd just try to see the plants through. Coco is actually pretty easy to deal with, at least for me. You haven't given any details on your nutrients or feed schedule so I can't comment much further. I'm not sure why you'd need to water your plants "very very slowly", but if that is what it takes to get them fed properly, so be it. I can't help but think in a 50 / 50 mix you should have excellent drainage...but whatever you do, don't let your coco dry out, it's going to cause you issues with your plants.

CannaCountry said:

I totally follow your example and it makes sense, but what weighs more, a Gallon of dry vermiculite or a Gallon of dry Coco, and how does one determine the amount of moisture in both prior to starting the experiment? Without starting at the same base number the end number isn't going to mean anything. Follow me? Never the less, it's not so much about the amount of water your medium is holding as much as it is the amount of O2 it holds in relation to said water.

As to what to do; I'd just try to see the plants through. Coco is actually pretty easy to deal with, at least for me. You haven't given any details on your nutrients or feed schedule so I can't comment much further. I'm not sure why you'd need to water your plants "very very slowly", but if that is what it takes to get them fed properly, so be it. I can't help but think in a 50 / 50 mix you should have excellent drainage...but whatever you do, don't let your coco dry out, it's going to cause you issues with your plants.

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Ye I follow you,

I dont fully agree with your example that it depends on the o2 holding of the medium. Remember empty spaces is filled with air (and o2). What I am saying is, the vermiculite I use is pretty course, so when I fill a pot up with it, there are plenty of air pockets or spaces that there is simply nothing, just air. Coco seems to be movable in the pot and fills in all the empty spaces with coco.

So if your entire pot was 1L capacity empty, and you fill it with coco, you will displace 99% of the air with coco. With course Vermiculite, you will displace only 80% of the air. So even *IF* the vermiculite has less o2 holding capacity, it is made up for the fact that each vermiculite piece has a pocket of air around it with zero water holding capacity. I believe these little air gaps are crucial to a healthy root system. Coco has the potential for the particles to "band together" while vermiculite seems to always stay aerated around each particle due to the shape,size etc. After typing this, I am going to grow a plant in pure vermiculite, I will make a journal.

50/50 is misleading. Perlite is big, the coco ultra fine. The perlite isent even helping because the coco is so clumpy it is suffocating the perlite aswell. this coco is bad, really bad!

I have lots of plants, I usually just water them and they drink it all up. This batch of coco killed off a few, then I immediately stopped watering the others in this coco. The coco, even when pretty dry, is almost solid, roots would struggle to push through it, this coco is so fine, it is like powder. Coco is super easy to work with, I love coco. I have never come accross such bad quality coco before! The plants already potted in it, I am going to let them droop before adding more water, this stuff is almost like clay after getting wet. Amazing how even coco somehow someone can screw up. This has been a good lesson for me, I will do quality control inspections on my coco infuture...never had this before. Lucky none of my flowering plants got hit with the new stuff as they stay in their pots for atleast two weeks before, so my smaller plants were scouts in a sense!

Thanks for the reply and the more than civil conversation. It sounds as though you know what you're doing and how you want to go about it. I'd be interested in following a 100% vermiculite grow, so if you take that on, I'll certainly follow. Out of curiosity, can you name the brand of coco you used on this run that you're not happy with? It may save others from this same road in the future.

Either method works, regular waterings or dry wet cycles.... as long as you are consistent and only adjusting as and when the plant grows.

For transplants always transplant into moist soil, not wet... do not water after transplanting, let their roots do their thing.