Nitrogen Deficiency? - Growing in greenhouse.

Hi ppl, new to the forums and new to growing. Sorry about the long post but this will take some explaining.

First let me point out that i started this grow on a whim, and i never meant to take this seriously. A friend of mine had a feminised seed lying around which we decided to plant in a pot and stick it in my mums greenhouse, "just to see"... For this reason, i hadnt been paying much attention to the plants progress, but as iv watched her grow, iv become quite attached to my new friend and have started to take an interest in her wellbeing. alas, she appears to be sick.

-the plant is about 3 months old
-Planted in a fairly large pot (15-20 litres?)
-planted in mircale grow soil
-Watered using regular tap water, every other day.
-pH unknown
-plant is quite large now, comes up to my chest, very bushy

about 3 weeks ago we added a handful of miracle-gro all purpose plant food.
the balls, not the soluble stuff. (http://www.dobbies.com/Miracle-Gro-Slow-Release-All-Purpose-Plant-Food-1kg-Jar/pid-240295). a couple of days later i noticed the tips of the lower leaves started to turn yellow and after a week or so, the lowest fan leaves, and a few smaller leaver had turned completely yellow/white.

i worried that i had overfed the plant and so removed the top layer of soil collecting all of the food balls and continued to water as usual, hoping to flush the soil within a week or so.

the yellow/whiting of leaves has continued to spread up the plant since then and i have lost 2 more fan leaves and a few more smaller leaves, and the leaves above those are showing signs of yellowing at the tips. The top of the plant appears a healthy lush green and is still continuing to grow.

so the problem doesnt seem to be going away...

According to what little research iv done, these are signs of nutrient deficiency, but i believe it was caused by overnuting. :/

so im lost here and any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

MANY THANKS!

P.S: i realised 3 days ago that by removing the top layer of soil i had exposed a little bit of the root system at the very bottom of the stem, and they were green in colour, i wonder if this could have been causing any problems with nute uptake, but remember, that the problem started after i added the food balls, and not after i removed the topsoil. I have since added a little more soil to cover up the exposed roots.

if its overfeeding they will turn brown at the tips,your ph is probably too high and the plant is not able to absorb nutes,or the lower fan leaves are not getting enough light. try to get a ph tester even a cheap 1 so u can have an idea of what ur ph is, and try to get it around 6.5, tap water is usually 7 or higher, use R/O water

i did wonder about pH but im new to this. i will definitely buy a ph tester.

in the meantime, please keep your comments/suggestions coming

food balls are bad, hard to know whether its short of nutes or the food balls are time releasing on you and you have too much. Try transplanting it into a larger container with some soil that doesn't have balls in it and then you can knock off as much of that other soil as possible. that would be a good start. It would help to post a pic, the above poster is correct in that they may be falling of naturally too and that nute burn starts with browning tips. I know the balls are bad though., if its not a problem now, its likely to become one in the future. Sometimes you can look up the ph of your tap by going to the water companies website, mine tests their water monthly and posts it online- a ph tester is better but that would be better than nothing, you can at least have a ballpark of what you are giving it. My tap is 8.4 just to give you an idea of how high it can come out.
Also, I'm not food ball expert but flushing with those in there may just release more nutes into your soil, just a thought.

samchesser said:

Also, I'm not food ball expert but flushing with those in there may just release more nutes into your soil, just a thought.

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the food balls were removed after a week or so, they were just sprinkled on the top. i removed the topsoil and collected them all.

Also, iv just taken a few pics, gona upload some now

ok, did the original miracle grow soil have any fertilizer in it.

So heres a few pics of my plant, clearly showing the problem. Some of the older white leaves were removed. the leaves in this pic were perfectly green about 5 days ago.


Also only just noticed this when taking the pics actually. White spots appearing on some of the leaves. another sign of nute def??


Hope these pics help!

given that you've never really fed it anything but water and the tips aren't brown, I'd say it needs nitrogen. Doesn't look burnt.Get a water soluable fert that has a between a 1-1-1 and 3-1-1 ratio (20-20-20 is the same as 1-1-1 btw, its just more concentrated) ....feed it half strength to start just to be careful and see if you notice any changes over the next 3-4 days, the whole plant will get darker, its kinda light green now. Avoid miracle grow products too, soil guys love Jacks classic. A hydro store would be even better cause the label will be tailored to your specific plant and you can ask the guy there some feeding questions. Check your ph too and make sure thats right. Also wouldn't hurt to give it a flush prior as well, just in case. About 100% sure it just needs nutes though, you ned to get on a permanent feeding schedule but I can't give you specific advice cause i grow hydro- probably once or twice a week for you. When it starts to flower you'll want to go to a 1-3-2 ratio fert. Feeding less rather than more is probably a good idea cause every other question on here the guys plant is burnt.

thank you samchesser!

I suppose it was foolish of me to expect the plant to grow healthily just by watering it. Im gonna buy a pH tester today, some soluble fert as u described and see how that goes.

I was just talking to my mum about pH levels, and she said the water we get here is very 'hard', which she thinks would probably mean it has a high pH level?

-what pH is ideal for my plant?
-what can i use to lower the pH?
-can i buy distilled water from a garden store?

I think soil is 6.5, double check that though, if you're going to a hydro store just buy PH down form general hydroponics $8, you can also use vinegar or lemon juice but I haven't used it. just repeating info I've read. A few drops per gallon of whatever you use should drop ph a point or so. You don't need very much. To go up I think baking soda if not the PH up. Drops work good to test ph and last a long time if you don't want to buy a pen. Available at hydro store too. basically just go to the hydro store if you can. And distilled water isn't necessary, just ph it right, your plant acually looks really good. Just a little light in color and its eating itself, thats why the leaves are turning white.

i agree looks hungry, but that last pic looks like something is eating it? dunno everything but the last pic looks like hunger to me..

dude you have to adjust the water ph.than the soil ph.to sure that dont have a nute lock out.can use dolomit lime for soil ph.(its cheap)if you have nutes containing nitro can use it as a fooliar spray till adjusting them.

He's hasn't even been feeding it with nutes, if he just feeds it, he can see if it recovers, not like one feeding is gonna build up nutes in the soil, but I agree the ph of the soil may be off in which case root feeding won't help. Personally, i'd just root feed it and then you'll know.

korf41 said:

dude you have to adjust the water ph.than the soil ph.to sure that dont have a nute lock out.can use dolomit lime for soil ph.(its cheap)if you have nutes containing nitro can use it as a fooliar spray till adjusting them.

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I have never tested the ph of my water once. My method is water. Let stand then test the ph of the soil. Adjust from there. It has worked for me with no issues for awhile now. Ph in soil is important but no where near as important as hydro growing.

okay so i bought a pH tester and some soluble fert.

The pH of the soil appears to be 6, which is not as bad as i expected. is it okay at that, or should i adjust it slightly higher???

sadly the only suitable fert that the store had was miracle-gro all purpose.. -.-
nevertheless, it is 6-5-5, which is about what you suggested. Have fed it half the suggested dose, now just to wait and see what happens

EDIT: also, can i expect the white/yellow leaves to recover, or will they die anyway?

If you feed and it still looks as though you have a nitrogen deficiency, you can use this Product:

http://www.amazon.com/InstaGreen-4-Liter-Special-Order/dp/B004V2F8R8/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1312484081&sr=8-3

And make a foliar feeding as instructed on the back and spray directly on to the leaves surface. Make sure to spray right before the lights go off, to prevent any type of burns on the plant. If you are vegging 24 straight spray them then turn the lights off for a few hours. When used as directed to results are amazing. Do not use if you are already flowering.

Losdog said:

If you feed and it still looks as though you have a nitrogen deficiency, you can use this Product:

http://www.amazon.com/InstaGreen-4-Liter-Special-Order/dp/B004V2F8R8/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1312484081&sr=8-3

And make a foliar feeding as instructed on the back and spray directly on to the leaves surface. Make sure to spray right before the lights go off, to prevent any type of burns on the plant. If you are vegging 24 straight spray them then turn the lights off for a few hours. When used as directed to results are amazing. Do not use if you are already flowering.

Click to expand...

this stuff sound pretty good! thanks for pointing it out to me, ill keep it in mind if she doesnt recover

6 is fine. you'll be good in a few days. The white/yellow ones will probably stay like that. the white ones cut off and the yellow ones still have a little food in them so you can cut or leave them. in general don't cut anything off till its dead or close to dead but you only had a few so it won't matter either way. For example if half your plant was yellow, you wouldn't want to cut all of them off.

I'd jump in with a decent fert straight off, ppm to about 800-900 and raise it from there, simply looks like it needs food and quick or loose more leaves.

My main concern is dose that pot have drainage holes in as a lot of the decorative clay ones dont, needs drainage or problem could be overwatering. Peace

Um sorry to poop on your party but the only thing which raises soil ph is generally lime. Simply pH'ing your water means bugger all, pH dont work like that!