Obama is going to use the UN to take away American gun rights

cannabineer

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
Filthy Phil said:
its weird where you get your info from... Whoever said that must not have done much traveling around the world... I've been all over and the most scary( in crime means at least) are the ones with guns. we have some of the highest rates in the world of gun violence... i dont get the reasoning
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I am curious about two things.
1) Which countries have banned gins since 1981?
2) Phil, where? I'm guessing/hoping you are citing examples in places with reasonably stable government. Africa and the 'stans will of course be scary.
cheers 'neer
 
Jack Harer

Jack Harer

Well-Known Member
Filthy Phil said:
my goodness guys... no one is going to try to take a gun away from YOU, trust me.... YOU can have your guns...i trust you with them and am too afraid to try to take em from you... but do we really think everyone having guns is a good thing? Its deffinately shown, the more guns there are the more crime there is, especially crimes with guns(imagine that)... YOU crazy nutbags can have em... but I would like to see the real criminals lose them. I'll be honest, I like guns a lot, they are fun, I have a few. But I would gladly give them up if it meant there would be fewer guns on the streets. You guys have a LOT of different types of guns to lose before you cant protect yourselves, hunt, have fun, and kill politicians. Just relax ya nutbags. Go back to detailing your bunkers ok.
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Those who would give up Essential Liberty
to purchase a little Temporary Safety,
deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.

An over used, but quite appropriate quote from Ben Franklin (or Thomas Jefferson, depending on where you read it). Just HOW would you propose that we prevent violent criminals from getting their hands on guns, yet preserve that right for those who are not violent criminals? And your posit that violent crime increases with the presence of handguns, Switzerland has virtually NO violent crime where each household is all but required to have and be proficient with one. The Swiss have no army per se, because the citizens are the army. http://www.guncite.com/swissgun-kopel.html
Right now, a criminal risks a less than 10% chance of meeting with any resistance (Much less ARMED resistance) while committing a burglary. Now reverse those numbers. If a crook had a better than average chance of being killed by breaking into a house, that house would be left alone. In the "wild west" people left their families unattended while they were out and about because of guns, and the fact that even children were proficient shots, and not afraid to use them.
No, the answer to crime is not to ban guns, but to allow more homes to carry and use them, and lessen the restrictions on their use to protect home and property. Gun control has NOTHING to do with crime control, it has way more to do with the fact that the Government fears an armed citizenry.
 
darkdestruction420

darkdestruction420

Well-Known Member
In the "wild west" people left their families unattended while they were out and about

to be fair im sure their were plenty of cases where guys got home to find their familiy dead, house burnt down and any other property stolen or destroyed.
 
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NoDrama

Well-Known Member
Filthy Phil said:
its weird where you get your info from... Whoever said that must not have done much traveling around the world... I've been all over and the most scary( in crime means at least) are the ones with guns. we have some of the highest rates in the world of gun violence... i dont get the reasoning
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The scariest countries you have been to have guns and that is your criteria? You are using your personal opinion, i am using facts and actual statistics. Since Australia's 1996 laws banning most guns and making it a crime to use a gun defensively, armed robberies rose by 51%, unarmed robberies by 37%, assaults by 24% and kidnappings by 43%. While murders fell by 3%, manslaughter rose by 16%. http://www.kc3.com/editorial/gun_control_works.htm

Canada: After enacting stringent gun control laws in 1991 and 1995, Canada has not made its citizens any safer. "The contrast between the criminal violence rates in the United States and in Canada is dramatic," says Canadian criminologist Gary Mauser in 2003. "Over the past decade, the rate of violent crime in Canada has increased while in the United States the violent crime rate has plummeted.
http://www.sfu.ca/~mauser/

England: According to the BBC News, handgun crime in the United Kingdom rose by 40% in the two years after it passed its draconian gun ban in 1997 http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk/1440764.stm

In 1998, a study conducted jointly by statisticians from the U.S. Department of Justice and the University of Cambridge in England found that most crime is now worse in England than in the United States.

The Most armed nation state in the entire world is Israel, hows the crime rate there?

Been to Somalia? I have. Been to Iraq? I have. Been to Japan? I have. Been to Brazil? I have, Been to Australia? Egypt, Kuwait, UAE? How about the Phillipines or perhaps Thailand? Mexico? Canada? China? Taiwan? Hong Kong? I have been to all of those countries, it is wrong of you to assume I have not been anywhere just because I don't get scared of seeing someone with a gun.

BTW the country with the highest rate of gun violence isn't the USA, in fact the USA isn't even in the top nine
 
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NoDrama

Well-Known Member
darkdestruction420 said:
to be fair im sure their were plenty of cases where guys got home to find their familiy dead, house burnt down and any other property stolen or destroyed.
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Did you just try to make up a statistic? I think you did. I bet if you searched you wouldn't even find a single instance of what you claim must have happened Plenty of times.
 
dukeanthony

dukeanthony

New Member
Anyone can legally own a gun in the Phillipines
I have been there numerous times

How many shops you know of without a Shotgun carrying security gaurd?
Lots of Crime in the Philippines

They will chop your hand off to get your watch. Its much faster than holding you up and demanding it
 
Jack Harer

Jack Harer

Well-Known Member
darkdestruction420 said:
In the "wild west" people left their families unattended while they were out and about

to be fair im sure their were plenty of cases where guys got home to find their familiy dead, house burnt down and any other property stolen or destroyed.
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I'm sure you're right. But.............
I'll bet they were the exception, not the rule.
 
darkdestruction420

darkdestruction420

Well-Known Member
NoDrama said:
Did you just try to make up a statistic? I think you did. I bet if you searched you wouldn't even find a single instance of what you claim must have happened Plenty of times.
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youve never heard of the native americans attacking settlers homesteads no drama?(regardless of who's side you take on it).
 
Jack Harer

Jack Harer

Well-Known Member
NoDrama said:
Did you just try to make up a statistic? I think you did. I bet if you searched you wouldn't even find a single instance of what you claim must have happened Plenty of times.
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No during the cattle range wars I'm certain that what he suggested happened happened. Armed gangs paid by the cattlemen preyed on the homesteaders. But I'll bet they were pacifists or were non violent people. And like I said, the exceptions not the rule. Of course I'm surmising all this myself, anyway.
 
darkdestruction420

darkdestruction420

Well-Known Member
Jack Harer said:
No during the cattle range wars I'm certain that what he suggested happened happened. Armed gangs paid by the cattlemen preyed on the homesteaders. But I'll bet they were pacifists or were non violent people. And like I said, the exceptions not the rule. Of course I'm surmising all this myself, anyway.
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lol, i meant to put that in my post up above too where i discussed the native americans but i guess i must of spaced out and hit reply before i had actually typed that part up. thanks for making me aware of my typing error.
 
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NoDrama

Well-Known Member
dukeanthony said:
Anyone can legally own a gun in the Phillipines
I have been there numerous times

How many shops you know of without a Shotgun carrying security gaurd?
Lots of Crime in the Philippines

They will chop your hand off to get your watch. Its much faster than holding you up and demanding it
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Really great story bro.
 
Filthy Phil

Filthy Phil

Well-Known Member
NoDrama said:
The scariest countries you have been to have guns and that is your criteria? You are using your personal opinion, i am using facts and actual statistics. Since Australia's 1996 laws banning most guns and making it a crime to use a gun defensively, armed robberies rose by 51%, unarmed robberies by 37%, assaults by 24% and kidnappings by 43%. While murders fell by 3%, manslaughter rose by 16%. http://www.kc3.com/editorial/gun_control_works.htm

Canada: After enacting stringent gun control laws in 1991 and 1995, Canada has not made its citizens any safer. "The contrast between the criminal violence rates in the United States and in Canada is dramatic," says Canadian criminologist Gary Mauser in 2003. "Over the past decade, the rate of violent crime in Canada has increased while in the United States the violent crime rate has plummeted.
http://www.sfu.ca/~mauser/

England: According to the BBC News, handgun crime in the United Kingdom rose by 40% in the two years after it passed its draconian gun ban in 1997 http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk/1440764.stm

In 1998, a study conducted jointly by statisticians from the U.S. Department of Justice and the University of Cambridge in England found that most crime is now worse in England than in the United States.

The Most armed nation state in the entire world is Israel, hows the crime rate there?

Been to Somalia? I have. Been to Iraq? I have. Been to Japan? I have. Been to Brazil? I have, Been to Australia? Egypt, Kuwait, UAE? How about the Phillipines or perhaps Thailand? Mexico? Canada? China? Taiwan? Hong Kong? I have been to all of those countries, it is wrong of you to assume I have not been anywhere just because I don't get scared of seeing someone with a gun.

BTW the country with the highest rate of gun violence isn't the USA, in fact the USA isn't even in the top nine
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Its great that you have these statistics, honestly it is. That doesnt mean that these remain as complete proof. A lot has happened all over the world since the times you give, far more variables than just guns leaving. What are though the follow up statistics, the ones where when the majority of the guns are off the street? And yeah, I have been to a lot of those places man. China, thailand, the philipines, hong kong vietnam cambodia singapore malaysia brunei laos burma mexico costa rica panama comombia venezuela brazil germany turkey greece...and more. Ive been plenty of places man, and Im not standing in direct opposition to you, I am trying to bring up points to make further discussion about the topic.

I will tell you this: in a lot of those place when I talk to people I have asked them if they have ever wanted to come to america, MOST places they say no, they are afraid that they might get shot or something. This I know. South americans are less likely to be affraid, for obvious reasons.

i wish i had exact names of studies, but i do know a study that showed you were statistically more likely to be the victim of gun violence if you own a gun than if you dont.

And America isnt even on the top 9 anymore?? WOW THATS GREAT NEWS!! so out of 196 countries in the world, we're out of the top nine most violent? thats great news. movin on up america. I wonder though... since gun violence is going down....and gun restrictions are getting tighter.... i wonder if theres any correlation?
 
grizlbr

grizlbr

Active Member
sen.c said:
That pretty much is the gist of the 2nd amendment, it was put in place so that we would be able to protect ourselves from our own government. Got plenty of ammo here Jack.............LOL I am with you.
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When to WallyWorld brought box O shells to front register. Are these for a hand gun? No. What kind are they? Read the box. Oh Long rifle. Yes for my rifle. At least she touched the box Not like the hindu that will not touch packaged meat? He is geting slick if you did not notice the hand in the bag to pick up meat them into another bag. Guess I am having his grand mother for dinner?
 
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NoDrama

Well-Known Member
Filthy Phil said:
Its great that you have these statistics, honestly it is. That doesnt mean that these remain as complete proof. A lot has happened all over the world since the times you give, far more variables than just guns leaving. What are though the follow up statistics, the ones where when the majority of the guns are off the street? And yeah, I have been to a lot of those places man. China, thailand, the philipines, hong kong vietnam cambodia singapore malaysia brunei laos burma mexico costa rica panama comombia venezuela brazil germany turkey greece...and more. Ive been plenty of places man, and Im not standing in direct opposition to you, I am trying to bring up points to make further discussion about the topic.
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You are well traveled.

I will tell you this: in a lot of those place when I talk to people I have asked them if they have ever wanted to come to america, MOST places they say no, they are afraid that they might get shot or something. This I know. South americans are less likely to be affraid, for obvious reasons.
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anecdotal evidence that has no bearing on the facts as presented.

i wish i had exact names of studies, but i do know a study that showed you were statistically more likely to be the victim of gun violence if you own a gun than if you dont.
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That only makes logical sense that you would be the victim of gun violence if you own a gun, I assume they are counting suicide as Gun Violence and accidental shootings and murder by your own family member as part of the statistics. They don't carry statistics that show how many lives owning a gun has saved, because it is nearly impossible to do such a thing, its like trying to prove a negative.

people who own cars have a much higher statistical average of getting into a traffic accident than pedestrians. 100% true fact. Ban Cars!

And America isnt even on the top 9 anymore?? WOW THATS GREAT NEWS!! so out of 196 countries in the world, we're out of the top nine most violent? thats great news. movin on up america. I wonder though... since gun violence is going down....and gun restrictions are getting tighter.... i wonder if theres any correlation?
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Not Ninth in the world, tenth out of all the countries where one can own firearms. As of today you are allowed firearms in 37 countries. USA is Tenth out of 37.
 
PeachOibleBoiblePeach#1

PeachOibleBoiblePeach#1

Well-Known Member
Sound's to me That the NRA is drumming up a war call that,,,again is unjustified,,,Just vote GOP,,,and you can have your Gun's,,,Vote Dem's and you lose your right's:wall:,,,Hope you all like giving your contribution's for them cool looking sticker's:roll:,,,Gun's and ammo are not in danger in America as they like you to "Become Ted Nuggent or Sara Palin about",,,:lol: Fool's:dunce:
 
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