organics, where to start?

Give yourself 3 months to get your dirt set up. 1 month to source ingredients and 2 months to cook it. I'd read the TLO first because it is the easiest and most practical for getting your dirt going. Then I'd read some of the critiques of the TLO book because they are full of ways to make the recipe a little more inexpensively and substitute some of the hard to find ingredients. After your dirt is mixed I'd read the Teaming With Nutrients. It is an amazing book but not as practical for getting started, more of a big picture book.

foreverflyhi said:

Bro if I was the op , I would respond the same way. You hve bad chemical hydro boo boo vibes all over you. Chill out, smoke some organics

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thanks forever.. i was simply looking for some advice on some starting points on organics, nothing more, nothing less.. i can read all day and night, which i have been doing btw, regarding organics, but tbh, idk if i'm stupid or w/e, but it's all pretty much over my head at this point, and was simply looking for a bit of advice on where to start...

\ i do not think i will bother engaging you in conversation again,\

Word, well keep them questions coming.

As for simplicity here's the honest truth that most of us ROLS farmers would agree on.

The intial start up will be some what labor and time intensive. However, the beauty about rols isit eventually sustains itself. Thus becoming almost worry free with little labor involved.
Maintaining the worm bin is honestly where a lot of my time goes into.
Rarely do aact teas, usually focus on enzymes more then I do npks.

Sativied said:

Almost ironic, that the organic info is often more scientific than some of the stuff people make up in what I would expect to be more technical forums.

I hope you don't mind me saying, your comment about doing it "mostly for the simplicity" imho does sort of warrant skunkd0c's reply. Someone who says he's going to switch to hydro for bigger yields will receive similar questions I hope. Many organic growers don't grow organics for simplicity but to grow organics, it's often a goal (and hobby and work) by itself. There are indeed different degrees of organics, and for someone getting into organics I think it's good to be well aware of that especially if the goal is simplicity.

I'm doing a nearly-water-only run at the moment and apart from adding microbes and funghi from a bottle and some food for them (molasses) I don't make an effort as in brewing teas or making my own compost. Not saying that's pointless at all, just saying organics can be very simple. I do enjoy the simplicity of water-only and not measuring and controlling ppm/ph, at least for now while my plants are healthy.

The saying that there are as many grow methods as there are growers is probably something an organic grower made up, which I don't mean offense, my point is if you ask 10 organic growers you get 10 different answers. I'd ask @stowandgrow for a good and simple to maintain soil mix as "a good starting point to get my feet wet" and take it from there.

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What the op has done is continue to argue, what the op has not done is share his preconceived ideas
which is what i asked for

OP even at one point suggested that i should automatically know the level of his organic knowledge
like i am his personal biographer or some kind of mind reader

all he needed to do was clarify his ideas and methods that he wishes to follow
i pointed out that i was seeking him to elaborate , but he seems determined to accuse me of unnecessary scrutiny

OP is asking questions, but is also making statements, when i asked him to clarify why he does not want to use bottled nutes, and why he thinks organics would be more simple
instead of sharing his ideas, he accuses me of "nit picking"

like i said before, i do not want to waste time on folk that are unable to express themselves without getting into a pointless arguments
this conversation could of been so different but the OP feels he needs to defend something when it wasn't even warranted

peace

skunkd0c said:

What the op has done is continue to argue, what the op has not done is share his preconceived ideas
which is what i asked for

OP even at one point suggested that i should automatically know the level of his organic knowledge
like i am his personal biographer or some kind of mind reader

all he needed to do was clarify his ideas and methods that he wishes to follow
i pointed out that i was seeking him to elaborate , but he seems determined to accuse me of unnecessary scrutiny

OP is asking questions, but is also making statements, when i asked him to clarify why he does not want to use bottled nutes, and why he thinks organics would be more simple
instead of sharing his ideas, he accuses me of "nit picking"

like i said before, i do not want to waste time on folk that are unable to express themselves without getting into a pointless arguments
this conversation could of been so different but the OP feels he needs to defend something when it wasn't even warranted

peace

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dude, seriously, who cares why i don't want to use bottled nutes any longer? what's that have to do with where to start using organics?? seriously, what difference would it make had i answered i don't like the smell of bottled nutes, or if i said i was trying to save the earth from the evil monsanto and want to go organic? would anyone have given me a different starting point on where to start looking into organics dependent on what i said where the reasons why i wanted to go organic?
people go organic for a variety of reasons, who cares what brought them there?? not me said the bee..
just admit that you were trying to be a dick and pick apart the fact that i said i thought organics were simple, and we can move on.. even after i answered of course i want to use aact teas, you spew off at the mouth, offering no advice at all.
i'm so over it, but thanks to those who gave me some where to start, that's all i wanted.. what a great way to start a new day, getting into an internet argument when all i wanted was someone to point me in the right direction.. thanks again for all the helpful advice skunk. much appreciated...

racerboy71 said:

thanks forever.. i was simply looking for some advice on some starting points on organics, nothing more, nothing less.. i can read all day and night, which i have been doing btw, regarding organics, but tbh, idk if i'm stupid or w/e, but it's all pretty much over my head at this point, and was simply looking for a bit of advice on where to start...

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I feel ya, if anyone cares, it's why my time in this site has dwindled to nearly nothing.
Grasscity has some fantastic stickys, and undoubtedly a much better crowd, more mature.
I feel better spending my time on that site, as opposed to this one, for stupid reasons such as arguing about mindless stuff.
I recommend checking out that site, you'll be better off

racerboy71 said:

dude, seriously, who cares why i don't want to use bottled nutes any longer? what's that have to do with where to start using organics?? seriously, what difference would it make had i answered i don't like the smell of bottled nutes, or if i said i was trying to save the earth from the evil monsanto and want to go organic? would anyone have given me a different starting point on where to start looking into organics dependent on what i said where the reasons why i wanted to go organic?
people go organic for a variety of reasons, who cares what brought them there?? not me said the bee..
just admit that you were trying to be a dick and pick apart the fact that i said i thought organics were simple, and we can move on.. even after i answered of course i want to use aact teas, you spew off at the mouth, offering no advice at all.
i'm so over it, but thanks to those who gave me some where to start, that's all i wanted.. what a great way to start a new day, getting into an internet argument when all i wanted was someone to point me in the right direction.. thanks again for all the helpful advice skunk. much appreciated...

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organics IS easier once you get the basics down, but it really is all about preference.
Mix the soil properly, age, and reuse, every third harvest re-amend.
it IS simple.
But there are a lot of things that go into that.
I feel a lot of the time internet forums are frustrating, people treating people MUCH differently than they would dream of doing in real life, maybe it's why they do that in fact... If you can't bully or be aggressive in REAL life, than I could see the allure/need to try and do it in a "cyber" fashion.
I digress though...

greasemonkeymann said:

I feel ya, if anyone cares, it's why my time in this site has dwindled to nearly nothing.
Grasscity has some fantastic stickys, and undoubtedly a much better crowd, more mature.
I feel better spending my time on that site, as opposed to this one, for stupid reasons such as arguing about mindless stuff.
I recommend checking out that site, you'll be better off

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that's a sin grease, i've always enjoyed your posts...

skunkd0c said:

What the op has done is continue to argue, what the op has not done is share his preconceived ideas
which is what i asked for

OP even at one point suggested that i should automatically know the level of his organic knowledge
like i am his personal biographer or some kind of mind reader

all he needed to do was clarify his ideas and methods that he wishes to follow
i pointed out that i was seeking him to elaborate , but he seems determined to accuse me of unnecessary scrutiny

OP is asking questions, but is also making statements, when i asked him to clarify why he does not want to use bottled nutes, and why he thinks organics would be more simple
instead of sharing his ideas, he accuses me of "nit picking"

like i said before, i do not want to waste time on folk that are unable to express themselves without getting into a pointless arguments
this conversation could of been so different but the OP feels he needs to defend something when it wasn't even warranted

peace

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your first line makes you sound like an ass.
Why does he have to do anything you asked for, he was asking for advice.

Thanks for starting this RB. I too have switched back to soil from hydro and am now looking at organics. I too find it very overwelming to get my head around and maybe its because Im trying to source info from the net with its million different opinions. Im ordering Teaming with Microbes and Rev's book right now.

racerboy71 said:

that's a sin grease, i've always enjoyed your posts...

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not gone forever, just much, MUCH less time.
It's too much of a "look what I know, my way is right, and your way is wrong" type of site, as opposed to, "hey my brother, we have common interests, lets work in harmony and see what we can accomplish"
frustrating.
sadly I know of a few other VERY knowledgable cats that have left as well.

Doobius1 said:

Thanks for starting this RB. I too have switched back to soil from hydro and am now looking at organics. I too find it very overwelming to get my head around and maybe its because Im trying to source info from the net with its million different opinions. Im ordering Teaming with Microbes and Rev's book right now.

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well, i'm glad you got some good out of this mess of a thread, lol..

so what are you growing now?... warehouse or a closet or what?..... that kinda makes a difference too worm bins and mixing your own soil just isn't practical w more than a light or two....... I start w ffof and topdress it ...... transplant rather than feeding in veg.... try to think a week ahead....

greasemonkeymann said:

not gone forever, just much, MUCH less time.
It's too much of a "look what I know" type of site, as opposed to, "hey my brother, we have common interests, lets work in harmony and see what we can accomplish"
frustrating.

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that's why i started this thread to begin with.. i thought asking some people who are knowledgeable about the subject instead of my spending hours and hours reading stuff online would be a wiser starting point..

woody333333 said:

so what are you growing now?... warehouse or a closet or what?..... that kinda makes a difference too worm bins and mixing your own soil just isn't practical w more than a light or two....... I start w ffof and topdress it ...... transplant rather than feeding in veg.... try to think a week ahead....

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just a small closet grow woody.. 400 watt hps, about 5 or so plants max per grow.. have always used ffof, but my last grow i used some ewc and plant tone mixes for one of my plants and used bottled stuff on the rest..
needless to say the bubba that was in the amended soil mix gave me results that i thought further adventures into organics would be beneficial..

I will let you all know that I am much meaner in person than on the internet.
Teaming with microbes is the best place to start. I also read Let it Rot to get an understanding of how to compost. Fresh compost is the backbone of organic growing. And when sourcing orgainic materials for building your soils, simple rule of thumb, nothing should come in a bottle.

racerboy71 said:

dude, seriously, who cares why i don't want to use bottled nutes any longer?

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i asked you a question, all you needed to do was answer

racerboy71 said:

what's that have to do with where to start using organics??

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You have already made a start with the reading you have done , i was asking you to share your ideas so far

racerboy71 said:

seriously, what difference would it make had i answered i don't like the smell of bottled nutes, or if i said i was trying to save the earth from the evil monsanto and want to go organic?

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you would of answered the question, which could of raised further discussion , its called a conversation

racerboy71 said:

would anyone have given me a different starting point on where to start looking into organics dependent on what i said where the reasons why i wanted to go organic?

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i cant speak for everyone, i can only speak for myself, organic growing methods can take various forms
if you clarify what you want, it would help others to point you in a given direction

racerboy71 said:

people go organic for a variety of reasons, who cares what brought them there?? not me said the bee..

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if no one cared why anyone did anything we would not have a forum to share information

racerboy71 said:

just admit that you were trying to be a dick and pick apart the fact that i said i thought organics were simple,

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organics might indeed be more simple, depends on the method, this is why i asked you to elaborate

racerboy71 said:

even after i answered of course i want to use aact teas, you spew off at the mouth, offering no advice at all.

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firstly you said you wanted to use water only, so i said "so you wont be using teas then"
you answered by saying "of course i will use teas",
make your mind up and learn to express yourself coherently from the onset

racerboy71 said:

i'm so over it, but thanks to those who gave me some where to start, that's all i wanted.. what a great way to start a new day, getting into an internet argument when all i wanted was someone to point me in the right direction.. thanks again for all the helpful advice skunk. much appreciated...

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there is no IT to start with, you lack the ability to express yourself intelligently, you contradict yourself, and even misuse the word "semantics"

we will have to agree to disagree, its clear you are always going to feel scrutinized by my questions which was not my intent
i would rather have a conversation where you feel able to express your ideas freely

i am quite happy to never speak to you again, from previous dealings with you i have come to regard you as lacking in intelligence anyway
it has taken you about 5 years to post a few pictures of your grow, like i said previously you have little to offer other than paranoia

good luck

lets all just chillll a wee bit shall we?

racer i really suggest the kylekushman website he has some fantastic reading material on it that is easy to read and understand!

he also has his own line of products you could read about , i havent tried them yet they are available in my store yet but i know you said you were looking to stay away from bottled stuff

either way hes got some good well written blogs

racerboy71 said:

just a small closet grow woody.. 400 watt hps, about 5 or so plants max per grow.. have always used ffof, but my last grow i used some ewc and plant tone mixes for one of my plants and used bottled stuff on the rest..
needless to say the bubba that was in the amended soil mix gave me results that i thought further adventures into organics would be beneficial..

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I would do something about the odd number of pots....... sounds like you've already started tho...... maybe do what you did and build on it..... teaspoon of psg and start using liquid seaweed...... I dunno how important your crop is to you but I don't fuck around w making my own ingredients or buying castings from the amish or any of that crazy shit..... bugs