Outlaw pot growers in California fear legalization

its not fair those the growers who have put in the work. its really not. think of places like humboldt county who make a living out of this...and it stimulates their local economy...

make it legal and they are out of work and the government is back in business. not fair. the market is more open now that its illegal than if it were legal...

once its legal the camel's and newports of weed will take over...all the little people out of work or getting jobs with said companies not making nearly the $ they could have on their own.



prop 215 is a medicinal cannabis program. i agree. however its not very hard to fake insomnia or migraines...or anxiety (whatever it may be).

half of these places just ask you what you're problems are if you have one that mj treats you're in business. lets not be so square and worry about "committing fraud".

their are plenty of frauds in this world and claiming a false or half true illness to legally obtain cannabis is the least of anyones worries. its not hurting anyone...

im not saying everyone should go and lie but lets be honest you can get a card very easily.


taxes is the fast track to legitimacy but the fast track isnt always the best path.

im against anything that makes the growers/buyers give up their money...
if the vote for legalisation goes NO, the main stream media will portray it as "California votes AGAINST marijuana" i.e. California is ANTI. the ins and outs of the debate such as fears of high taxes and undue restrictions will not be explored or portrayed.

smokey do you think the cali growers and sceptics would vote YES to legalisation under different terms? if so what do you think they might be?
 

CrackerJax

New Member
I've mentioned this before..... it is possible that MMJ will DERAIL full legalization. It is possible that IF weed gets accepted as a medical regimen, it may only go that far and NO further.

Either way... "legalization" comes in many forms. Not all of them are good for small growers.

The EASIEST way for the GOVT. to do it is to simply hand it off to Big Tobacco and Big AG.

Tax wise and distribution wise and top to bottom infrastructure wise...it is the easiest to CONTROL and TAX.

When does the govt. ever go the hard way....other than hard on the citizens. No, they go the path of least resistance. Kind of why Social Security doesn't get reformed.....until it busts us out.
 
wow.

legalization of weed could be a possibility and a couple of stoners on a pot growing website are complaining.

geez.....
thank g-d someone here has some sense.

there is no good reason marijuana should be illegal. the world is finally waking up to this fact.

we are talking about peoples civil liberties here, about making a change that will positively effect many peoples lives, and make a huge statement about the past 70 so years of a stupid prohibition...

and some self righteous, selfish people are worried they cant compete with the free market.

sounds like some people have a monopoly and are afraid to lose it.
 

MrBlanco

Active Member
The only real bad part to the bill that is proposed is the 25 sq. ft. maximum limit for space to grow in, I mean I literally have single plants that cover more space than that. The more and more I hear about it, I think I will be voting no ont the upcoming ballot, I have my medical liscense and as long as you have a little cash anyone can basicly get their liscense, I like it the way it is, especially now with the new supreme court ruling. Sorry to all those that will disagree, but I believe the full legalization would not be an entirely good thing. I mean 25sq ft to grow in outdoors, that is a joke, Im still undecided but leaning towards voting no, which is funny because a few months ago I was all for complete legalization. Peace!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You should try reading the bill at TaxCannabis.org. Medical patients won't be affected. That means that you get two gardens. One medical and one personal. The bad part about the size of the grow is the 1oz. possession limit. I can only assume they're looking at a perpetual system since this bill is coming out of Oakland.

its not fair those the growers who have put in the work. its really not. think of places like humboldt county who make a living out of this...and it stimulates their local economy...

make it legal and they are out of work and the government is back in business. not fair. the market is more open now that its illegal than if it were legal...

once its legal the camel's and newports of weed will take over...all the little people out of work or getting jobs with said companies not making nearly the $ they could have on their own.



prop 215 is a medicinal cannabis program. i agree. however its not very hard to fake insomnia or migraines...or anxiety (whatever it may be).

half of these places just ask you what you're problems are if you have one that mj treats you're in business. lets not be so square and worry about "committing fraud".

their are plenty of frauds in this world and claiming a false or half true illness to legally obtain cannabis is the least of anyones worries. its not hurting anyone...

im not saying everyone should go and lie but lets be honest you can get a card very easily.


taxes is the fast track to legitimacy but the fast track isnt always the best path.

im against anything that makes the growers/buyers give up their money...
It's not fair to the growers? How about it's not fair to the smokers who get to sit in prison so the growers can make six figure incomes? That's just pure greed. Those growers are only out of work if they aren't intelligent enough to adapt with the market, like every other market.

As far as the big companies coming in. Of course they will. Think about beer and all of the microbrews. The companies that make good product are able to compete on some level, from local to national. What we're going to see are a lot of local specialty brands with the best going regional and possibly statewide. Of course, those growers will have to dig their heads out of the sand and invest in getting legal.

Some people have this thing called "character". That means that they don't want to commit fraud or add to the growing national joke that is our MMJ system. When NJ legalized MMJ they flat out that their laws weren't going to be a joke like California's. It's really hard defending the legitimacy of MMJ for people that actually need it when there are people that see no problem with abusing the system. This will eventually backfire on the entire MMJ community as the public gets tired of the abuse of the system.

Legalization for taxation is the only legitimate way to go. Alcohol and tobacco are taxed so why shouldn't marijuana be taxed? You're free to brew your own beer, grow your own tobacco, and you'll be free to grow your own weed. You'll even get good at it with experience.
 
Legalization for taxation is the only legitimate way to go. Alcohol and tobacco are taxed so why shouldn't marijuana be taxed? You're free to brew your own beer, grow your own tobacco, and you'll be free to grow your own weed. .
good post thanks for the link. just this last bit, where you give your reasoning about why MJ should be taxed... getting shafted on beer, getting shafted on tobacco so why bother suggesting that we don't get shafted on MJ as well?

but then that's the way is ... one step at a time.
 

CrackerJax

New Member
If you don't understand how the govt. thinks and works.... you will end up being manipulated by them quite easily.

They are word masters.
 
just read through the initiative, the links back a bit ... recommended reading before posting. yeah it seems very well put together and, if i've got it correct, has a proposal to have regulation split into 52 local authourities, who can alter the regulations to suit the needs of the local population.

are there any ncal growers who have read the initiative, who can express where their concerns aren't address in this initiative?
 

10jed

Active Member
good post thanks for the link. just this last bit, where you give your reasoning about why MJ should be taxed... getting shafted on beer, getting shafted on tobacco so why bother suggesting that we don't get shafted on MJ as well?

but then that's the way is ... one step at a time.
I think a lot of people are missing the big picture! We are getting taxed now... the money just isn't going to anything that could help the people in our communities. Quite the opposite actually! We are getting taxed by the dealers and distributors and the taxes are payable to the criminal organizations! I love how nobody seems to see this! Also, the growers, the guys we LIKE in this equation... they aren't making all the money. Unless you buy directly from a grower, you are funding criminal organizations with every sack!

Actually we are getting taxed double becuase every untaxed dollar earned by people in this business is something the rest of us has to cover. Our governments don't set income tax rates, collect their money, and then deceide how to spend it. The decide how much they want and then set tax rates that will accomplish that. You aren't screwing our govenment by doing this under the table, you are screwing the people. The government gets their money and the rest of us get the pleasure of covering your ass.

I'm not saying that the government will take every dollar and put it back into our economy or into beneficial programs, but money going into our tax base is money they don't have to charge me. Same is true with sales tax so it is a triple tax we currently pay.

Jed
 

Johnnyorganic

Well-Known Member
I think a lot of people are missing the big picture! We are getting taxed now... the money just isn't going to anything that could help the people in our communities. Quite the opposite actually! We are getting taxed by the dealers and distributors and the taxes are payable to the criminal organizations! I love how nobody seems to see this! Also, the growers, the guys we LIKE in this equation... they aren't making all the money. Unless you buy directly from a grower, you are funding criminal organizations with every sack!

Actually we are getting taxed double becuase every untaxed dollar earned by people in this business is something the rest of us has to cover. Our governments don't set income tax rates, collect their money, and then deceide how to spend it. The decide how much they want and then set tax rates that will accomplish that. You aren't screwing our govenment by doing this under the table, you are screwing the people. The government gets their money and the rest of us get the pleasure of covering your ass.

I'm not saying that the government will take every dollar and put it back into our economy or into beneficial programs, but money going into our tax base is money they don't have to charge me. Same is true with sales tax so it is a triple tax we currently pay.

Jed
And think of all the taxes dedicated to enforcement. We pay those now, but I don't see any re-legalization/tax opponents complaining about those taxes.

And we pay in other ways as well.

We pay in paranoia.

We pay attorney fees and court costs.

Some of us pay behind bars with our freedom.

Bur for me the biggest tragedy is the Liberty we lose under the current system.

It's a fucking plant that does no harm. My government seeks to outlaw motherfucking nature.
 

CrackerJax

New Member
just read through the initiative, the links back a bit ... recommended reading before posting. yeah it seems very well put together and, if i've got it correct, has a proposal to have regulation split into 52 local authourities, who can alter the regulations to suit the needs of the local population.

are there any ncal growers who have read the initiative, who can express where their concerns aren't address in this initiative?
That is a proposal..... but true legalization will come from the FED'S ... if at all. At any time....if the FED'S want to shut down MMJ..... they can.

What that will be (if anything at all) is a mystery.

But I understand the state law must/should come first....chipping away at he federal law is the way to go.
 

10jed

Active Member
And think of all the taxes dedicated to enforcement. We pay those now, but I don't see any re-legalization/tax opponents complaining about those taxes.

And we pay in other ways as well.

We pay in paranoia.

We pay attorney fees and court costs.

Some of us pay behind bars with our freedom.

Bur for me the biggest tragedy is the Liberty we lose under the current system.

It's a fucking plant that does no harm. My government seeks to outlaw motherfucking nature.
Yeah that isn't even the tip of the iceberg! Think of how many people are using up welfare resources because daddy is in jail or because he failed his wiz quiz and lost his job. Think of the damage done to public lands by the irresponsible growers. Or the electric being stolen... shit electric is the same as the tax base. You aren't ripping off the electric company if you ssteal power for your grow, you are ripping of the people who have to pay a higher rate to cover what you steal!

It's never ending really.

Jed
 

10jed

Active Member
Well, they can always drift into bootleg cigarettes. That business is BOOMING....
I've been known to buy 5-10 cartons whenever I pass through Virginia... for personal use of course! I can see how that would be lucrative.

Jed
 

CrackerJax

New Member
Heh... the best are unloaded directly from the semi.... :wink:

Gloomy...look at it this way.

You can be corporate and vote AGAINST legalization

Or

You can be HIP and vote FOR legalization

The growera against it are the suits in this case. Not to be trusted....they are greed.
 
Heh... the best are unloaded directly from the semi.... :wink:

Gloomy...look at it this way.

You can be corporate and vote AGAINST legalization

Or

You can be HIP and vote FOR legalization

The growera against it are the suits in this case. Not to be trusted....they are greed.
well said buddy
 

CrackerJax

New Member
TY ... it's hard to imagine some ppl who smoke actually feel the way he does.

It's ppl like that got who jacked weed up to 400/ounce.

It's ppl like that who bring LEO to front doors.
 
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