Pheno variation with autos

I’m in the process of finishing 4 x Haze CBD autos from Dinafem and I’m shocked at the difference in phenotypes. Out of 4 seeds, I have three very different phenos ranging from a super dense nugged, low leaf to bud ratio, longer flowering beauty to a squat, leafy piece of garbage. Then I have two kind of in between with one of those very susceptible to mold. Seems like some instability with this strain. Never saw such a variance in phenotypes with my photos. I grew 3 different autos last year and the same strain plants were very similar. Is there something with the ruderalis genes that create instability or maybe the breeder hasn’t gone far enough to stabilize the strain?

Seawood said:

I’m in the process of finishing 4 x Haze CBD autos from Dinafem and I’m shocked at the difference in phenotypes. Out of 4 seeds, I have three very different phenos ranging from a super dense nugged, low leaf to bud ratio, longer flowering beauty to a squat, leafy piece of garbage. Then I have two kind of in between with one of those very susceptible to mold. Seems like some instability with this strain. Never saw such a variance in phenotypes with my photos. I grew 3 different autos last year and the same strain plants were very similar. Is there something with the ruderalis genes that create instability or maybe the breeder hasn’t gone far enough to stabilize the strain?

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Do you have pics? Who was seed breeder?

Im noticing the same thing. I started with autos and they were all over the place. Now that i have switched to photos, they seem far more consistent. Look at the two pineapple express in the back of this tent. They couldnt be any more different. Came out of the same pack. They did smell similar though.

Doug Dawson said:

Do you have pics? Who was seed breeder?

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Dinafem. I’ll get some pics tomorrow. I chopped two today but l still have the best and worst on the go. Wet weights after harvest from the two today were 143 grams and 324 grams....lol.

Few pics. Don’t have any of the other two as I cut them yesterday.

Seawood said:

Few pics. Don’t have any of the other two as I cut them yesterday.View attachment 4645975View attachment 4645976View attachment 4645977View attachment 4645978View attachment 4645979

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Yeah that doesnt surprise me at all. Ive also noticed in general autos are leafy as fuck compared to photos.

Check out the difference in these two buds...is it normal to have this much pheno variation within the same auto strain? Yield on the left bud will be 25ish grams. The one on the right will end up at about 3 zips. I’m shocked that there is this much difference. I’ve never seen this with any of my photos.

Seawood said:

Check out the difference in these two buds...is it normal to have this much pheno variation within the same auto strain? Yield on the left bud will be 25ish grams. The one on the right will end up at about 3 zips. I’m shocked that there is this much difference. I’ve never seen this with any of my photos.
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Totally normal. Go back to photos.

Seawood said:

Check out the difference in these two buds...is it normal to have this much pheno variation within the same auto strain? Yield on the left bud will be 25ish grams. The one on the right will end up at about 3 zips. I’m shocked that there is this much difference. I’ve never seen this with any of my photos.
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Thats one of the biggest pheno variations ive seen but check out the two pineapple express in the back of the tent. They are complete opposites even though the seeds came from the same pack and were grown under identical conditions. They did smell similar though.

JoeBlow5823 said:

Thats one of the biggest pheno variations ive seen but check out the two pineapple express in the back of the tent. They are complete opposites even though the seeds came from the same pack and were grown under identical conditions. They did smell similar though.

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It doesn't seem like you know alot about growing. Same strain from same pack means nothing. Photos can vary just as much. You probably bought cheap autos and thats why. They are probably F/S 1s and so no ACTUAL breeding for stable traits was done. You get Photo F/S 1s as well. When you STABLE strains you need to get a good BREEDER, NOT A CHEAP POLLON CHUCKER and buy seeds that are F4 or F5 or F6/F7/F8 and on and on. You keep bashing autos cause you bought cheap seeds. Buy good seeds and you get good plants.

MATTYMATT726 said:

It doesn't seem like you know alot about growing. Same strain from same pack means nothing. Photos can vary just as much. You probably bought cheap autos and thats why. They are probably F/S 1s and so no ACTUAL breeding for stable traits was done. You get Photo F/S 1s as well. When you STABLE strains you need to get a good BREEDER, NOT A CHEAP POLLON CHUCKER and buy seeds that are F4 or F5 or F6/F7/F8 and on and on. You keep bashing autos cause you bought cheap seeds. Buy good seeds and you get good plants.

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I thought I was buying good seeds (Dinafem) and ended up with a mix of good, mediocre and junk. Dinafem is quite highly regarded when it comes to autos...or so I thought. Others’ results may vary.

Dina fems has good strains but @MATTYMATT726 pretty much described most auto breeders , some ( few ) really work the lines enough for stability and consistency, the variables are not always a bad thing , especially if you breed your own .

But with any seed pack ( autos or photos ) you get variations of cross , had plenty of strains go to each side of parent.
Most sling bulk ( F1 or S1 selfed ) , that Way they can keep selling the line.

Why would a company like Dinafem take a chance on selling F1/S1 seeds and not stabilize their genetics further? I can see some of the distributors/resellers buying bulk F1 seeds from Dinafem but seems like a risky deal for a breeder with any kind of reputation to uphold to sell first gen seeds under their own brand.

Seawood said:

Why would a company like Dinafem take a chance on selling F1/S1 seeds and not stabilize their genetics further? I can see some of the distributors/resellers buying bulk F1 seeds from Dinafem but seems like a risky deal for a breeder with any kind of reputation to uphold to sell first gen seeds under their own brand.

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I think the same reason there are still regular seeds and not all fem. Some people do want to pheno hunt for stuff. Dinafem is good, but they left their stuff open to many phenos i suppose, where as Mephisto breed up to F8 on strains to lock in a very specific plant almost every time.

That makes sense about the reg seeds....I get the whole pollen chucking/pheno hunt. That’s fun for growers and gives options. Not sure how that applies to a breeder like Dinafem who relies on the stability of a good gene to sell seeds. Case in point, I bought an auto strain from them that obviously wasn’t stabilized. I have had good luck with their photos but you think I’m gonna buy Dinafem auto seeds again? Maybe....but probably not. Bad for business from a breeder’s perspective.

If you’re gonna sell photo fem seeds or autos and call yourself a “breeder”, then you need to have your shit stabilized. Period. I don’t know shit from fuck about breeding autos and how the cloning thing, or lack thereof, messes up the equation but there has to be a way to stabilize genetics? How does this work if you can’t clone or back cross?

Just cause seeds come in same packs doesn’t mean they came from the same exact plant.. there plants there gonna be different grow at different rates regardless of similar growing conditions some seeds are stronger then others some are taller I got some seeds off weedseedsexpress buy 10 get 10 Girl Scout cookie auto and they were all over the place some had huge yields and others not enough to bother with some larger plants and some that didn’t even grow past 15 inches after stretch. Regardless bud potency was consistent throughout All of them even the shitty Larfy buds still had killer potency.