Political science experiment: Can politics be discussed without resorting to personal attacks?

Fogdog said:
Easy.

Fake news is fake.

If you don't like that then I think the President should decide.
Click to expand...
If it were easy for people to determine what news is fake, we wouldn't be discussing this 'fake news' issue

Obviously, some people can't, or choose not to, determine what constitutes fake news. Objective truth doesn't matter to these people or make any difference in their thinking. Right-wing talk radio has been waging a war determined to undermine the institutions that have traditionally sought to inform our society; vouchers in favor of funding public school, cuts in education across the board, the idea pushed that American colleges are liberal indoctrination centers, etc. And it's worked. Many conservatives actually believe in these things. So how would you get them to believe otherwise? If they won't, and you took their right to vote away for it, there is no doubt in my mind they would be manipulated by those in power to stage a revolt, and imo, they'd be half right about it since the Constitution guarantees your right to vote, even if you believe fake news.

So any further replies about the 'fake news' issue should take that into consideration, I would appreciate it
 
Padawanbater2 said:
If it were easy for people to determine what news is fake, we wouldn't be discussing this 'fake news' issue

Obviously, some people can't, or choose not to, determine what constitutes fake news. Objective truth doesn't matter to these people or make any difference in their thinking. Right-wing talk radio has been waging a war determined to undermine the institutions that have traditionally sought to inform our society; vouchers in favor of funding public school, cuts in education across the board, the idea pushed that American colleges are liberal indoctrination centers, etc. And it's worked. Many conservatives actually believe in these things. So how would you get them to believe otherwise? If they won't, and you took their right to vote away for it, there is no doubt in my mind they would be manipulated by those in power to stage a revolt, and imo, they'd be half right about it since the Constitution guarantees your right to vote, even if you believe fake news.

So any further replies about the 'fake news' issue should take that into consideration, I would appreciate it
Click to expand...
You completely swallowed the false news story about the murdered tech who worked for Clinton.

I'm not convinced you should be allowed to vote.
 
Fogdog said:
You completely swallowed the false news story about the murdered tech who worked for Clinton.

I'm not convinced you should be allowed to vote.
Click to expand...
That would be an example of 'fake news';

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Do you believe mainstream news outlets like CNN, FOX, MSNBC, ABC, etc. do not, ever, report 'fake news' stories to push a political agenda?
 
Padawanbater2 said:
Do you believe mainstream news outlets like CNN, FOX, MSNBC, ABC, etc. do not, ever, report 'fake news' stories to push a political agenda?
Click to expand...
Recall that a fake news story is entirely made up. This differentiates fake news from other stories that are false or biased but contains some facts.

I don't have an example of a fake news story reported as if it were true from CNN, MSNBC or ABC. Doesn't mean they haven't, but they don't do this enough to register on my radar.

Fox has been caught several times going with fake news stories as if they were true. This is fact. I can't say I know whether or not they ran with those stories to push a political agenda or if they made a mistake.

Belief is different. I believe Fox is biased based upon their content and freedom from the need to report facts but that's a belief. We can discuss this if you like.
 
Padawanbater2 said:
If it were easy for people to determine what news is fake, we wouldn't be discussing this 'fake news' issue

Obviously, some people can't, or choose not to, determine what constitutes fake news. Objective truth doesn't matter to these people or make any difference in their thinking. Right-wing talk radio has been waging a war determined to undermine the institutions that have traditionally sought to inform our society; vouchers in favor of funding public school, cuts in education across the board, the idea pushed that American colleges are liberal indoctrination centers, etc. And it's worked. Many conservatives actually believe in these things. So how would you get them to believe otherwise? If they won't, and you took their right to vote away for it, there is no doubt in my mind they would be manipulated by those in power to stage a revolt, and imo, they'd be half right about it since the Constitution guarantees your right to vote, even if you believe fake news.

So any further replies about the 'fake news' issue should take that into consideration, I would appreciate it
Click to expand...
"Dear American conservative; you've been had"

You've been duped into believing that corporations deserve to control the country, that the wealthy are more qualified to act in your interests, that the essential conflicts in politics are centered around abortion rights, gun laws and religious issues.

Meanwhile, the ultra wealthy have stolen not only your prosperity, but the wealth of your grandchildren.

Instead of building a stronger country, they've built stronger rights for their corporations, which they've used to impoverish you, take your jobs, ruin your educational system, and build a military that murders millions during a time of peace in your name.

You've every right to be frustrated with your ever shrinking standard of living. But have the prescriptions advanced by your representatives improved your lives? They've had 40 years since Mr Reagan was elected, one would expect that if they were going to work to build American prosperity, they'd have done it by now.

Instead, we've gotten a ballooning deficit, the greatest national debt in the history of civilisation, a homeless population larger than seen in the Dust Bowl years, millions in prison, and wars of opportunism and profit rather than for protection or peace.

The rich have gained unimaginable wealth and power- and far from being in a mood to share, they blame you for your poverty while shipping your jobs overseas and passing more tax cuts for themselves.

Now, they've come for your health insurance. Your very life expectancy has fallen for the first time in our nation's history, and those who've seen it fall the most are the most stanchly conservative districts in the country. THIS is how they've repaid you for your loyalty.

Maybe it's time to try something different. Perhaps it's time to consider the idea that the wealthy are out for themselves, even at your expense. When the banks were bailed out after the 2008 economic crash, did you get your house back? Your job? Your old standard of living? So why does the television say we've been out of recession for years now?

Because you don't count anymore. All of you put together, the entire American working and middle class makes less than half the income earned, yet you pay far more than half the taxes. The rich have taken most of the income for themselves, sloughed off the tax bill onto you- and your children- and taken nearly all the wealth of the nation for themselves.

None of this is your fault. You've been fooled; by Bill O'Reilly, by Rush Limbaugh, by a succession of Presidents from Reagan to Trump. Even the Democrats have taken the money and are in on the game.

It's time to ask your representatives why you work so much harder than ever before and yet receive so much less for your efforts? Do you live as well or better than your parents? Do you feel confident about your future and that of your children, or, in spite of paying for the greatest military in history, do you feel afraid for your future prospects?

Strangely enough, we on the Left feel exactly the same way. It turns out we have much in common and in fact we've realized that it isn't the other side of the aisles in Congress that's the enemy...

It's ALL OF THEM.

Perhaps it's time for a change. The New Left are not being listened to by our representatives any more than you are. It's time for We the People to take a stand and make our voices heard in unison, rather than being manipulated into opposing one another.

It is our country at stake. Our future, and that of our children. Is it really acceptable that a tiny few should take all the money and leave the rest of us to scrape for scraps?

Sincerely, the New Left
 
Fogdog said:
Recall that a fake news story is entirely made up. This differentiates fake news from other stories that are false or biased but contains some facts.

I don't have an example of a fake news story reported as if it were true from CNN, MSNBC or ABC. Doesn't mean they haven't, but they don't do this enough to register on my radar.

Fox has been caught several times going with fake news stories as if they were true. This is fact. I can't say I know whether or not they ran with those stories to push a political agenda or if they made a mistake.
Click to expand...
What 'fake news' story reported by FOX doesn't have at least one fact contained in it? Could you cite an example for clarification?
Fogdog said:
Belief is different. I believe Fox is biased based upon their content and freedom from the need to report facts but that's a belief. We can discuss this if you like.
Click to expand...
Do you believe FOX is the only politically biased mainstream news outlet?
 
Padawanbater2 said:
What 'fake news' story reported by FOX doesn't have at least one fact contained in it? Could you cite an example for clarification?

Do you believe FOX is the only politically biased mainstream news outlet?
Click to expand...
Mixing facts with drivel and spin is their stock in trade.

They're all biased.

Jeff Bezos took $600 million from the CIA, then bought the Washington Post. No spin, bias or propaganda here, move along!
 
ttystikk said:
"Dear American conservative; you've been had"

You've been duped into believing that corporations deserve to control the country, that the wealthy are more qualified to act in your interests, that the essential conflicts in politics are centered around abortion rights, gun laws and religious issues.

Meanwhile, the ultra wealthy have stolen not only your prosperity, but the wealth of your grandchildren.

Instead of building a stronger country, they've built stronger rights for their corporations, which they've used to impoverish you, take your jobs, ruin your educational system, and build a military that murders millions during a time of peace in your name.

You've every right to be frustrated with your ever shrinking standard of living. But have the prescriptions advanced by your representatives improved your lives? They've had 40 years since Mr Reagan was elected, one would expect that if they were going to work to build American prosperity, they'd have done it by now.

Instead, we've gotten a ballooning deficit, the greatest national debt in the history of civilisation, a homeless population larger than seen in the Dust Bowl years, millions in prison, and wars of opportunism and profit rather than for protection or peace.

The rich have gained unimaginable wealth and power- and far from being in a mood to share, they blame you for your poverty while shipping your jobs overseas and passing more tax cuts for themselves.

Now, they've come for your health insurance. Your very life expectancy has fallen for the first time in our nation's history, and those who've seen it fall the most are the most stanchly conservative districts in the country. THIS is how they've repaid you for your loyalty.

Maybe it's time to try something different. Perhaps it's time to consider the idea that the wealthy are out for themselves, even at your expense. When the banks were bailed out after the 2008 economic crash, did you get your house back? Your job? Your old standard of living? So why does the television say we've been out of recession for years now?

Because you don't count anymore. All of you put together, the entire American working and middle class makes less than half the income earned, yet you pay far more than half the taxes. The rich have taken most of the income for themselves, sloughed off the tax bill onto you- and your children- and taken nearly all the wealth of the nation for themselves.

None of this is your fault. You've been fooled; by Bill O'Reilly, by Rush Limbaugh, by a succession of Presidents from Reagan to Trump. Even the Democrats have taken the money and are in on the game.

It's time to ask your representatives why you work so much harder than ever before and yet receive so much less for your efforts? Do you live as well or better than your parents? Do you feel confident about your future and that of your children, or, in spite of paying for the greatest military in history, do you feel afraid for your future prospects?

Strangely enough, we on the Left feel exactly the same way. It turns out we have much in common and in fact we've realized that it isn't the other side of the aisles in Congress that's the enemy...

It's ALL OF THEM.

Perhaps it's time for a change. The New Left are not being listened to by our representatives any more than you are. It's time for We the People to take a stand and make our voices heard in unison, rather than being manipulated into opposing one another.

It is our country at stake. Our future, and that of our children. Is it really acceptable that a tiny few should take all the money and leave the rest of us to scrape for scraps?

Sincerely, the New Left
Click to expand...
The elite want us fighting each other with trivial bullshit like left, right. They use the news to steer our emotions and actions tord there end game. They incite racism, violence, confusion. They make us afraid and scared untill they dont have to take away our rights, we'll give them away freely. Well exchange slavery for "peace". 1984 wasnt a work of fiction it was a proficy. If we dont do something in the next 5 to 10 years it will be to late. Nothing short of a complete rebute. Throw out every elected official, return to the popular vote, remove the Federal reserve and start printing our own money again. I see a 2nd civil war at the least.
 
We should bring back public execution and put it on pay per view. All proceeds go to victims families. Only for mass murderers. Charles Manson, James Holmes, McVeigh.
 
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