Prerequisites for a DIY LED build?

Zulu Smoker said:

Lol @Humanrob - this is EXACTLY what I was afraid of. I mean, I can be anal with measurements and stuff but sometimes the skills just aren't as well-honed as a veteran's.

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It's funny, that unit was the 8th heat sink I did, and I did not break a single drill bit until that one... and then I broke three. So pace yourself and keep your focus, and you'll be fine. I've debated whether or not to disassemble the whole thing and try and reconstruct it better... but so far I'm just using it as is. So I might be the experiment in regards to effects of poor craftsmanship, but there is no telling how long it will take before I hit a critical failure. That is another reason to drive them "softly", I believe that lower watts = lower heat, and therefore a more forgiving light (the other common newbie mistake I read about is improper application of thermal paste, which again comes into play most critically as things heat up).

I have some Optic lights. What I recently learned is that COBs with lenses driven hard (90+ watts), are going to produce a light with different characteristics than ones driven softly (depending on who you follow, people here sometimes drive 3950's below 30w, and 3070's often around 50w). That difference will impact if not dictate your growing style. On the other hand, if you know your preferred growing style (or environmental limitations), you can get or make a light to match it.

If you want to grow taller plants and have excellent intensity and penetration from the lights, high watts and lenses (or reflectors) will serve you better. If you don't have the vertical space, or want to run a wide even scrog, then more COBs driven softer and spread out more, should work better. There doesn't seem to be anything that is absolutely definitive, but that seems to be at least a general theory.

Hey Zulu, i started off absolutely clueless in my my cob light building know how.

Early this year Supra turnen my on to optic. I bought a 360vero. It works great but i wanted more photons on the long side of my roughly 2 x 4' space. With the optic in place i built 2 pontoons and attached them to each end of the optic. I learned it all from these threads. I grabbed 4x 3590cd 72v from Jerry and a repurposed heat sink from ebay. Realstyles helped me out when i got stuck. In the end it worked out great. Its a huge heatsink so passively cooled.

I used a drill and simply used ideal holders and drilled a through hole slightly smaller than the m4 screw. Its been running 2months now with zero issues.

@Humanrob what size drill bit and self tapping screws did you use?

sureshot138 said:

@Humanrob what size drill bit and self tapping screws did you use?

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uh... I wish I was that organized. I just bought self tapping screws at Home Depot and then held them up to my drill bits until I found one slightly smaller. Sorry I didn't pay closer attention or keep records.

[QUOlol that's cool.umanrob, post: 12025023, member: 896155"]uh... I wish I was that organized. I just bought self tapping screws at Home Depot and then held them up to my drill bits until I found one slightly smaller. Sorry I didn't pay closer attention or keep records.[/QUOTE]
Lol thats

Haha - one of my fans looks exactly like the photo Humanrob uploaded. Mine however only has two broken bits inside it.

Zulu Smoker - you may want to consider building a simpler prototype first. Get some smaller cxa cobs, 3070 or even 3050s. Build something you could use for vegging and covers a smaller area. Would be cheaper and once you do that and get it working, you'd feel confident about tackling a build with cxb3590s for a larger area.

Also, I discovered the hard way, it's a good idea to buy more than you need. If nothing else, it's nice to have a spare driver/fan/cob on hand in case something goes out, you can just fix it. Or, you could be like me and fry a fan building it, and then have to wait a week for a replacement to arrive.

Nice, I'm gathering a lot of real-world tips and experiences here. I'm a bit of a pragmatist myself so this is good. Very good.

AS MUCH as I'd love to get my money's worth and build a DIY light, I'm being drawn towards consumerism and just wanna worry about growing. I would love to engulf myself in all of these DIYs and tools and geeky endeavours but for now the more pressing need is to grow immediately before the weather/season turns - so I'm highly considering getting a 400W Optic Vero for mixed use, and just make a DIY light for the veg tent. Happy that I might not need to build my own (less stress!), but sad to see how much the costs are!

What's making this decision harder is because now that I know how much the basic components cost for these lights, it's making it harder for me to pull the trigger. For about the same costs as the 400W light I could have gotten two lgihts for a probable total of 500W+, with better coverage and custom-made to my own designs. But that's probably at least a month down the road, a hundred or so hours of researching, planning, designing, drafting, sourcing, waiting, and manufacturing/assembly. Yeah it's easy to argue that this figure could be a lot less for the more experienced folk, but for a complete noob trying to create the ideal grow light, this could actually be a lot more.

BUT! I'm still going to work on my own light! A better idea for my situation would be to get a "starter" working LED fixture, start growing and actually UNDERSTANDING how the light functions (and how it affects the grow) before I create my own. This is going to be my first light in my first indoor grow - I don't mind spending money on the right investments, and I actually need a baseline to know what to improve on in the future. So having skipped the HID train I'm jumping on the LED/LES train right now, gonna get my feet wet, and improve on current/existing designs.

I'd love to be an inventor, but for now I might be better off as an innovator. Deep in the back of my mind a cob monster is still in the works (yes, that 1000W HID replacement with 8-12 CXB3590s on a custom pivoting-rail system with integrated heat shroud/ducting utilizing thermoelectric cooling, with a programmable raspberry pi onboard for auto-dimming seasonally-accurate schedules and provide telemetry, while also having climate control - iOS/Android apps to follow!), but for now I'm hella excited to grow. I still need a veg light (100-200W) for a dedicated veg tent down the road so I guess that counts as a "simple prototype" @Sonnshine lol.

testiclees said:

Hey Zulu, i started off absolutely clueless in my my cob light building know how.

Early this year Supra turnen my on to optic. I bought a 360vero. It works great but i wanted more photons on the long side of my roughly 2 x 4' space. With the optic in place i built 2 pontoons and attached them to each end of the optic. I learned it all from these threads. I grabbed 4x 3590cd 72v from Jerry and a repurposed heat sink from ebay. Realstyles helped me out when i got stuck. In the end it worked out great. Its a huge heatsink so passively cooled.

I used a drill and simply used ideal holders and drilled a through hole slightly smaller than the m4 screw. Its been running 2months now with zero issues.

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I guess you could say we're thinking along the same lines here. Was this your first indoor light also? It seems like my retail light will also become frankenstein-ed (or at least be helped by a few of my own) further down the road to promote better plant growth. And denser buds definitely.

Zulu Smoker said:

I guess you could say we're thinking along the same lines here. Was this your first indoor light also? It seems like my retail light will also become frankenstein-ed (or at least be helped by a few of my own) further down the road to promote better plant growth. And denser buds definitely.

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no it was my second light. my first was a mars900.

the optic 360 4k is capable growing big hard nugs by itself but 2.5 x 3.25' is about its optimal footprint.
The small case size is somewhat limiting. i extended my case by 30 inches adding 200w.

testiclees said:

the optic 360 4k is capable growing big hard nugs by itself but 2.5 x 3.25' is about its optimal footprint.
The small case size is somewhat limiting.

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Does the old 4000K Vero 360W share the same dimensions as the new Vero 400W? I have to ask Optic directly about that. I haven't found anything that states nor compares any of the three lights actual sizes. Optic lighting recommends the Vero 400W for a 48"x44" space - does that sound realistic?

testiclees said:

i extended my case by 30 inches adding 200w.

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That might ultimately be what I'll end up with. Unless I get two of their Vero 200W instead, but that still doesn't give me a complete "strong" coverage in a 4'x4'. Optic rates the 200W for 36"x24" coverage, so it's still not perfect.

Using Optic's eBay images I made the composite below to compare their sizes. I wish they had a site to show all the important info.



That said, I've been reading some info from @JimmyIndica regarding a community-centric light project he's testing, the Vero240 or something. I'm really digging the Stella lens, might be a contender versus the Optic if it's out there soon enough. I might wait for it myself if the price is great.

JimmyIndica said:

View attachment 3531259

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The case does look a bit FAT though. lol

Ok let me take that all back - opticgrowlights.com is actually live. Now if only Jimmy's light's site goes up...

Ya ji is knowledgeable on optic lamps. my case is 12x18'' . I thought that size was the largest they were using.
Small case size has a negative effect on lamp performance particularly when the grow area extends well beyond the case dimensions.
As you see all the diy lights are configured to spread the light emitters evenly above the canopy matching the footprint.
i dont think cobs in an 18 X 12 case can optimally light a 48" space.

Zulu Smoker said:

Does the old 4000K Vero 360W share the same dimensions as the new Vero 400W? I have to ask Optic directly about that. I haven't found anything that states nor compares any of the three lights actual sizes. Optic lighting recommends the Vero 400W for a 48"x44" space - does that sound realistic?


That might ultimately be what I'll end up with. Unless I get two of their Vero 200W instead, but that still doesn't give me a complete "strong" coverage in a 4'x4'. Optic rates the 200W for 36"x24" coverage, so it's still not perfect.

Using Optic's eBay images I made the composite below to compare their sizes. I wish they had a site to show all the important info.

View attachment 3532479

Zulu Smoker said:

Does the old 4000K Vero 360W share the same dimensions as the new Vero 400W? I have to ask Optic directly about that. I haven't found anything that states nor compares any of the three lights actual sizes. Optic lighting recommends the Vero 400W for a 48"x44" space - does that sound realistic?


That might ultimately be what I'll end up with. Unless I get two of their Vero 200W instead, but that still doesn't give me a complete "strong" coverage in a 4'x4'. Optic rates the 200W for 36"x24" coverage, so it's still not perfect.

Using Optic's eBay images I made the composite below to compare their sizes. I wish they had a site to show all the important info.

View attachment 3532479

That said, I've been reading some info from @JimmyIndica regarding a community-centric light project he's testing, the Vero240 or something. I'm really digging the Stella lens, might be a contender versus the Optic if it's out there soon enough. I might wait for it myself if the price is great.


The case does look a bit FAT though. lol

Click to expand...

That said, I've been reading some info from @JimmyIndica regarding a community-centric light project he's testing, the Vero240 or something. I'm really digging the Stella lens, might be a contender versus the Optic if it's out there soon enough. I might wait for it myself if the price is great.


The case does look a bit FAT though. lol

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Cooliance Coolers had to fit in there to keep 100/120 watt CXB3590s/Vero29s Cool
Thanksgiving release if growers want a production fixture with the best components available.
Company wanted this flower run done before release to see what its capable of.
Cases are 14x17 and I have the fixture at 20-24inches and coverage area is 24in x 36in. Stella has really helped the even distribution light to canopy. No more circular hotspots. Here is update CXB200/sweettooth x blueberry headband 30days flower.
If anyone has questions? PM me-Truth-Transparency- Support are companies top priority.
There will be Ad/Banner on rollitup to support this site/community!

Working with this pheno sweet tooth x blueberry headband in the past. I am guessing 10oz + plant with CXB200

JimmyIndica said:

Cooliance Coolers had to fit in there to keep 100/120 watt CXB3590s/Vero29s Cool

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Wow, I looked over at Cooliance's Coolstrate line and I must say, those are really good choices for cooling.

JimmyIndica said:

Thanksgiving release if growers want a production fixture with the best components available.
Company wanted this flower run done before release to see what its capable of.

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That's actually good to hear - they're going for real-world results first before selling it to consumers. I hope I'll have a chance to purchase those fantastic looking lights!

Zulu Smoker said:

Wow, I looked over at Cooliance's Coolstrate line and I must say, those are really good choices for cooling.


That's actually good to hear - they're going for real-world results first before selling it to consumers. I hope I'll have a chance to purchase those fantastic looking lights!

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I agree that cooliance was very good choice.
Lots of testing for durability/performance was a must before sales. Ive always been a person that shows the capabilities of a fixture. Showing someone what fixture can do is much better than talking/claiming.IMO
A startup promo code will be sent for my viewers after they go live.
The flower footprint @24in up to 6sqft
If your running 4000K full cycle emitters? Vegetation operating distance @36inches up to 9sqft coverage area.

Zulu Smoker said:

Optic rates the 200W for 36"x24" coverage...

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Optic rates their 120's at 24"x36", so I got a pair of them for a 24"x48" and thought I had it covered -- but their footprint ratings are way optimistic. In reality each covered about 18"x24", and I had edges in shadow. I have the two 120's in a 24"x30" space now, and that seems to be working. Optics are decent lights, just know the real numbers when you are planning for coverage.

(And, for what its worth, I spent about $650 for the pair of 120's (using Vero18's), and for about half that built a DIY light with 6 Cree 3070's that produces more light in a better footprint.)

Humanrob said:

Optic rates their 120's at 24"x36", so I got a pair of them for a 24"x48" and thought I had it covered -- but their footprint ratings are way optimistic. In reality each covered about 18"x24", and I had edges in shadow. I have the two 120's in a 24"x30" space now, and that seems to be working. Optics are decent lights, just know the real numbers when you are planning for coverage.

(And, for what its worth, I spent about $650 for the pair of 120's (using Vero18's), and for about half that built a DIY light with 6 Cree 3070's that produces more light in a better footprint.)

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Ive told optic that couple different times that listing a overall veg print is bad idea because growers that havnt used COBs before think they are getting a flower print with that #.

JimmyIndica said:

Ive told optic that couple different times that listing a overall veg print is bad idea because growers that havnt used COBs before think they are getting a flower print with that #.

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I hear you Jimmy, but with the way the lenses focus the light towards the center, I'm not sure those numbers even cut it for veg. I believe their website gave a footprint at a specific height, so I set it to that height and I simply did not get edge to edge coverage, not nearly. I don't have a light meter so I can't say for sure that the amount reaching the edges was insufficient to grow plants, it was just so limited relative to the center that to my eye it looked to be in shadow (I was growing in a scrog with white PVC running around the perimeter of the space, so the amount of light reaching the edges was obvious).

Don't mean to hijack the thread or beat a dead horse, it still frustrates me if I think about it. Lenses definitely "work", I guess I don't really like the effect they have. It is interesting to see the new designs though, if I'm understanding it correctly they are getting better at amplifying the light without being so center dominant in their focus.

JimmyIndica said:

Ive told optic that couple different times that listing a overall veg print is bad idea because growers that havnt used COBs before think they are getting a flower print with that #.

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hey ji, In that post where you mention 20-24" spacing are you saying that when driving the cobs at about 100w 20-24 is how you do it with lenses on?

testiclees said:

hey ji, In that post where you mention 20-24" spacing are you saying that when driving the cobs at about 100w 20-24 is how you do it with lenses on?

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20 to 24in was operating distance from canopy
I think I am understanding? The optic magnetic lense would def have to be taken off too get that overall rec print