QB96 Elite V2 w/ SSTX heatsink question

Or_Gro said:

Sounds like you should go into business...and learn wtf you are talking about!

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You must be pretty old it's not the 1960s anymore. That "the customer is always right" saying will put you out of business these days. I know hlg has been growing really fast doing what they are doing without your "help". Even with you being an angry asshole that hates hlg you still bought their products so I would say that proves me right enough.

@Humple, in your opinion, those PLC strips are light on the reds? I was/am geeked about those strips. Kinda works out that he is out at the moment. Who know whats going to drop in the next couple of weeks.
*I'm still gonna build one*

This thread went to shit.

Randomblame said:

This discussion leads to nothing. Yes, it could be even better, but if I look at the board and know beam angle and efficiency I don't need a PAR map. The numbers for 1 or 2 boards could have been easily estimated.
It depends on so many things like number of boards, distance from sensor, walls or not, degree of reflection if, etc., etc.
A few general PAR maps would only provide clues but says not what I would get in my own enviroment. You would need the exact same tent to get the same measurments.

The criticism itself is good, bro, only the rude undertone in which you utter them leads to endless discussions and in the end all offend each other and it is called, ehh typical RUI. Thats unneccessary and leads to nothing.

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Dude has a short fuse and a chip on his shoulder. Don't think there's much point in trying to reason with him.

Ryante55 said:

Cutter has options if you really want it you can have red right now. If hlg came out with the enhanced strips you want would you really take down your current fixture and build a new one? It's funny how people spend a couple hundred dollars an think they are a valuable customer spend $500k and you might have the right to ask for a new product. The customer is almost always wrong.

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I haven't the faintest idea why you're talking about customer "rights". I am not demanding anything from HLG. I am a customer providing feedback on the sort of product I would like to see in the future (and I'm not the only one). If Stephen and Robin have no interest in putting out such a product, that's perfectly fine - it's their business, and I do not expect them to alter their plans for me. But you speak as if I have no business communicating my interests unless I'm ready to drop big money. If you don't want strips, that's fine; if I do want strips, that's also fine. I don't understand why you feel the need to step in and tell one of their customers what they should or shouldn't say to the company.

And whether or not I would tear down my current lights for new strips is completely irrelevant.

CoB_nUt said:

@Humple, in your opinion, those PLC strips are light on the reds? I was/am geeked about those strips. Kinda works out that he is out at the moment. Who know whats going to drop in the next couple of weeks.
*I'm still gonna build one*

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I honestly don't know. I know those strips have less red supplementation than a QB96 or a ChilLED board, but that doesn't mean a lot to me right now because I have no clue what the sweet spot would be (and it could change from strain to strain, I imagine). That's why I want to see more products like this on the market, with different ratios and spectrums, so we'll have a larger data-set.

Humple said:

Dude has a short fuse and a chip on his shoulder. Don't think there's much point in trying to reason with him.

I haven't the faintest idea why you're talking about customer "rights". I am not demanding anything from HLG. I am a customer providing feedback on the sort of product I would like to see in the future (and I'm not the only one). If Stephen and Robin have no interest in putting out such a product, that's perfectly fine - it's their business, and I do not expect them to alter their plans for me. But you speak as if I have no business communicating my interests unless I'm ready to drop big money. If you don't want strips, that's fine; if I do want strips, that's also fine. I don't understand why you feel the need to step in and tell one of their customers what they should or shouldn't say to the company.

And whether or not I would tear down my current lights for new strips is completely irrelevant.

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Ok sorry your usual pretty cool I just can't stand the Oro guy. You are right you can make suggestions I was just annoyed with Oro an took it out on you. The problem is this thread was about a specific light and heatsink several people pretty much just said this is stupid make some strips without realizing the value of this product. It might be more effective to make suggestions about new products on their main thread

Ryante55 said:

Ok sorry your usual pretty cool I just can't stand the Oro guy. You are right you can make suggestions I was just annoyed with Oro an took it out on you. The problem is this thread was about a specific light and heatsink several people pretty much just said this is stupid make some strips without realizing the value of this product. It might be more effective to make suggestions about new products on their main thread

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And you both are a piece of work...

Ryante55 said:

Ok sorry your usual pretty cool I just can't stand the Oro guy. You are right you can make suggestions I was just annoyed with Oro an took it out on you. The problem is this thread was about a specific light and heatsink several people pretty much just said this is stupid make some strips without realizing the value of this product. It might be more effective to make suggestions about new products on their main thread

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No worries, man, I understand. That dude has a habit of stirring shit up! And just to clarify, I definitely wasn't suggesting that the QB96 is a stupid product. We may not fully agree on the uniformity issue (and that's fine too!), so our thoughts on QB96 implementation in a tent may differ, but I can absolutely see the value of this product: firstly (as you stated previously) because you'll get better than HID efficiency with at least as good a spread, and secondly, because this board seems very well-suited (and priced) for high-bay/warehouse-style or large room grows.

Humple said:

I honestly don't know. I know those strips have less red supplementation than a QB96 or a ChilLED board, but that doesn't mean a lot to me right now because I have no clue what the sweet spot would be (and it could change from strain to strain, I imagine). That's why I want to see more products like this on the market, with different ratios and spectrums, so we'll have a larger data-set.

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Great question.. What is the difference in yield extra red vs. QB 288 3000-4000k vs. cxb 3590 3000k 80 CRI.....

Humple said:

I honestly don't know. I know those strips have less red supplementation than a QB96 or a ChilLED board, but that doesn't mean a lot to me right now because I have no clue what the sweet spot would be (and it could change from strain to strain, I imagine). That's why I want to see more products like this on the market, with different ratios and spectrums, so we'll have a larger data-set.

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Thank you. I'm glad I asked you the question.

@Dave455..
Depends on how much more PPF you get with white/deepred compared to white only.
1PAW/w deep red has ~5,5μMol/J(QER, radiant watts); 1PAR/w warmwhite around "only" ~4,85.
So with each deep red watt you get ~0,65μMol/s more PPF compared to 1 watt of warmwhite.
You just have to calculate how much PAR watt you get from the red diodes and what it would be with warmwhite only with just as much watts.
The difference should be only a few percent; +2% more usable photons, maybe less. But red wavelengths drive PS more efficiently so more red means your plants profit two times. They get a few percent more photons and a better spectrum.

And more red is also a benefit for your eyes because CRI goes up when you add deepred to CRI80. With 15-20% you already get CRI90 and with 30-35% it would be CRI95. Osram has used these technique for a long time and they still do it cuz its more efficient compared to high CRI phosphor coating. At least at the moment...

Here is an example with 140w 3500°k/CRI white and 35w deep-red..

And here is a screeny with only 140w 3500°k/CRI80.. As you can see "only" 2,57μMol/J compared to 2,6 with deep-red.




With more lower driven diodes you can get even better efficiency and here is a screenie with 2,66μMol/j and twice as much deepred diodes at half current.

I'm still waiting for strips with the new Osram Square series in deep-red(up to 3,91μMol/J at 700mA!). The difference would be even higher using them but they are f...ng expensive currently. They are available and led-tech.de has mixed strips with Osram square and oslon ssl120 but they don't fit my needs because they are all 24v CV and can not work with constant current(unless one is willing to lose the warranty and removes the smd resistors/drivers and replace them against simple jumpers, lol).

And at last a screenie how it would look like when you use 2 additional red strips at 700mA but with the same 140w you get from just one board at max current...

@Stephenj37826 You around?

@Stephenj37826

Yesterday, among other things, you said, re: the 96, hlg would “generally pay someone to do these types of tests and our go-to guy is MIA. We will do it when we have time personally.”

Am I correct?

If so, would HLG commit to do this for each main light board (like 120, 288, 96, future models, and all updates) at release date of the kit format? Using a 5x5 grid with 6” spacing, with 4 reasonable wattages, at the height that gives best spread near 1000ppfd?

I’m not asking for HLG to spend exorbitant sums of money to have an outside consulting firm do the work. I think we all would be happy if hlg did it internally, publishing on its blog, as an informal post, with all the appropriate lawsuit-avoidance disclaimers.

Would HLG commit to this? What is a reasonable start date that we can hold HLG to?

After a few bongs, i decided to post the following tables to help out fellow growers, just like some of the members here have helped me out.

Instead of mapping all the data i had planned, i did a bunch of pre-work to identify the best layout of each quantity of lights, just for flowering.

Buy yourself a light meter, and adjust your height and/or dimmer to get lower/higher intensity from these starting places.

Remember, you need:
Veg: 300-600 ppfd, using 67: ~20K-40Klumens

Flower: 600-1000 ppfd, using 67: ~40K - 67K lumens

For three 96s, each on individual hlg-240h-54A drivers:


For four 96s, each on individual hlg-240h-54A drivers:


I think you will find that HLG has designed a reasonably priced product capable of excellent intensity and spread for standard sized grow spaces.

We still have to see how much heat they generate, remember that the sinks are rated for passive cooling at 200w.

And, of course we need to see how they actually grow the wacky weed.

Hopefully HLG will commit to provide this type of information upon release and upgrade of every “main” growlight board, when they no longer have “the move” as an excuse. You guys deserve at least that much respect.

looks like having my 4 lights at 105w and 16" in my 3x3 is right around where i want to be.

4 @ 160w 16"-18" in a 4x4 looks good too.

i appreciate the maps Or_Gro i recognize it must have been a lot of time/energy.

Thanks Again.

pulpoinspace said:

looks like having my 4 lights at 100w and 16" in my 3x3 is right around where i want to be.

4 @ 160w 16"-18" in a 4x4 looks good too.

i appreciate the maps Or_Gro i recognize it must have been a lot of time/energy.

Thanks Again.

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Thanks, my pleasure

Whether I agree with the HLG "shredding" or not, Or_Gro you have done the community as well as HLG a great service. I for one appreciate it as I am considering what my next rig build will be.
I was/am really interested in the new strips Grenegenes has.
I started lurking this thread before I was aware of PLC's new strip lights, and was/am really interested in these too.
Your work here makes it hard for me to decide.
lol. Thanks.