Slipping more and more from my pro-gay stance as tactics grow spiteful

DonPepe

DonPepe

Active Member
It seems more and more we are abandoning the rationality and reasoning that held so much power during the first part of the gay rights movement and is turning into a shit slinging contest. As more and more effort is moved from raising public awareness to defacing and attacking individuals simply for having a diffident view the steam is quickly running out for me.

For me it was all about achieving equality for most of the gay community not about silencing and defacing all public opinions that are different. For years this country has allowed many conflicting beliefs to exist together and cohabitate this nation getting along in relative peace with only a few hurt feels here and there enjoying the same protection under the law. Yet it seems the closer we get to equality for more and more of the minority groups, the less it becomes about obtaining legal protection and the more the fight is shifted toward attacking others for being or believing different.

http://news.yahoo.com/chick-fil-record-setting-sales-appreciation-day-152027048.html

After an outpouring of support for Cathy and his company during Wednesday's Appreciation Day, gay activists are taking to the streets, or rather the Chick-fil-A parking lots, around the country for National Same Sex Kiss Day at Chick-fil-A on Friday to protest the chicken chain's opposition to the LGBTQ community.
Same-sex couples are being urged to take photos and videos of themselves kissing outside of Chick-fil-A restaurants nationwide.
About 11,000 have said on Facebook that they will attend the event. The Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day event had about 55 times that many Facebook attendees.
Although the restaurant chain has become a rallying cry for people on both sides of the marriage debate, Chick-fil-A has aimed to stay out of the politics and controversy stemming from its CEO's comments.
"The Chick-fil-A culture and service tradition in our restaurants is to treat every person with honor, dignity and respect –regardless of their belief, race, creed, sexual orientation or gender," Robinson said in a statement. "We understand from news reports that Friday may present yet another opportunity for us to serve with genuine hospitality, superior service and great food."
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Antics like this just leave me with a sicking feeling in my stomach, not mention how similar it is to current political struggles. I will say props to Chick-fil-A for there closing statment welcoming all and pledging to continue to "treat every person with honor, dignity and respect –regardless of their belief, race, creed, sexual orientation or gender." which i see as a perfect example for how we should behave. We can't agree with everyone, but we can voice our disagreement while continuing to treat everyone with the same respect.

I think this is much of the same problem that has developed in our political system, where opponents attack the one another and attempt to destroy the reputation of there opponent rather than display how well they would preform in the respective office. Leaving the public to choose who is worse rather then who is better.

anyways, i just wanted to share my opinion on the subject and hope that soon we can get refocused on the actual goal, and abandon this tangent that is implicating us in the same crimes that resulted in the poor treatment of homosexuals for so many years.
 
Geronimo420

Geronimo420

Well-Known Member
following is a post i put on the tread about Gay mariage :

Government don't belong in people bedroom, they exist to make laws that apply equally to everybody without regard to their sexual orientation, race or sex. As for Religion if they could keep their dirty priest hand's out of little boy's pants I would care a little more about the morality line they would like me to walk. As for peoples who are so desperate to tell other what to do with their life I would suggest them to get one of their own. Maybe they simply have unresolved issues...

WE ARE ALL EQUALS + WE ONLY NEED TO ADAPT THE LAWS TO REFLECT REALITY
 
DonPepe

DonPepe

Active Member
Geronimo420 said:
following is a post i put on the tread about Gay mariage :

Government don't belong in people bedroom, they exist to make laws that apply equally to everybody without regard to their sexual orientation, race or sex. As for Religion if they could keep their dirty priest hand's out of little boy's pants I would care a little more about the morality line they would like me to walk. As for peoples who are so desperate to tell other what to do with their life I would suggest them to get one of their own. Maybe they simply have unresolved issues...

WE ARE ALL EQUALS + WE ONLY NEED TO ADAPT THE LAWS TO REFLECT REALITY
Click to expand...
I should point out that you say "religion", leading us to believe you are speaking about the institution of religion itself, then follow with a complaint about one specific religion.

This, however, has little to do with the topic at hand as I am not examining the validity of claims made by the catholic church, but rather the tactics being employed in the struggle.

I personally am both religious (not catholic) and pro-gay, and while i see the possible conflict between the 2 i have personally found ways to justify my beliefs in both, but i do not support the harassment and personal attacking being advocated by the leaders of the movement. The very foundation of our argument is that it is none of anyone else's business, then they encourage us to turn around and attack others for there beliefs.
 
Nitegazer

Nitegazer

Well-Known Member
You can look at the bright side.... there have been tremendous gains for gay rights (though there is still far to go). I'd much rather see this kind of symbolic sillyness than the straight up violence around gay rights a few decades ago (scratch that, violence is ongoing, just less-so). The movement may have lost some of it's direction, but part of that might be that successes have come faster than most expected.

[video=youtube;Tg_emQoerBA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tg_emQoerBA[/video]
 
Geronimo420

Geronimo420

Well-Known Member
DonPepe said:
I should point out that you say "religion", leading us to believe you are speaking about the institution of religion itself, then follow with a complaint about one specific religion.

This, however, has little to do with the topic at hand as I am not examining the validity of claims made by the catholic church, but rather the tactics being employed in the struggle.

I personally am both religious (not catholic) and pro-gay, and while i see the possible conflict between the 2 i have personally found ways to justify my beliefs in both, but i do not support the harassment and personal attacking being advocated by the leaders of the movement. The very foundation of our argument is that it is none of anyone else's business, then they encourage us to turn around and attack others for there beliefs.
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Actually pedophiles on the loose are also present in the jehova witness, the local comunity ad a case recently.....But i do agree that it's more often a roman catholic problem
 
Geronimo420

Geronimo420

Well-Known Member
Personally I belive in Santa a little more than i belive in all those goods including Aphophis, Zeus or the mighty Thor. The reason I imply religion as more to do with the fact that it's their nocive influence that lead to Homophobia.
 
DonPepe

DonPepe

Active Member
Geronimo420 said:
Actually pedophiles on the loose are also present in the jehova witness, the local comunity ad a case recently.....But i do agree that it's more often a roman catholic problem
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I see I was unaware, i apologize.

and yes i agree that your assertions about religion are mostly accurate, yet is it not their right to speak out against something they feel may be detrimental to society?

many atheists are guilty of the same crime when it comes to speaking out against religion, and often cause some degree of suffering in the followers (admittedly not to the extent of homosexuals), yet the majority of Americans can not accept such truths.
 
DonPepe

DonPepe

Active Member
Actually i may be eating my own words, as i may have misunderstood the situation here.

It seems the Kiss Day was well received at Chick-fil-A and over all it was seen as a display more or less of the fact the homosexual people are just normal people with different sexual preferences. It seems what i saw as spitting in ones face was more of a means of calling a trues, much like what i was suggesting all along.

props to humanity for once =)
 
BustinScales510

BustinScales510

Well-Known Member
What do you mean when you say "implicating us in the same crimes that resulted in the poor treatment of homosexuals for so many years" ? Nothing criminal has happened. Chick fil a has been saying shitty things about gay people for a while. And now the right wing evangelicals wanna make a big deal about it and celebrate them for it. They flocked out to show how much they dislike gay people with their little "appreciation day"..so I dont see anything destructive or "criminal" about gay people holding up the middle finger in a peaceful and humorous way.
 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
I'm going to get all global-social/psycho-babble. I've gone thru various levels of understanding the issues here. I live in a gay marriage State. Bear with me please, because I'm just getting this.

It's on the question of exactly who rejects gays and why. Leave out the political. Grant that homophobia is fear, not OF gays, it's fear of BEING gay, or being even perceived that way.

So, when is this the most important issue for the survival of the species? Puberty, right? Only one brain, yet, and it's below the navel. And then, who rejects gays the most violently? Pubers. And most naturally, I might add.

What I'm beginning to see, is a gay youth will be excoriated very early in life by his peers, the breeders. What perhaps was not choice, now becomes pure. The youth must decide with only 1/2 brain, what is worth it. Suffer or change.

Yet, we think somehow, as a society we can straighten that out. Pubers have no sense of right and wrong on this. We can't straighten that. It's breeder prerogative in the genes, just like I'm pretty sure there are gayness genes. Those with that makeup, are now, and will continue to be pushed out of the social nest at a very young age. And there is another nest waiting, the older youths, as sexual predators. It looks to me the choice, if there at all, if forced.

Just trying to get to the root. This means that no effort of society to accept gay, in this world has ever succeeded for very long. It is likely to never succeed. This goes even for Sparta, where guy sex was martial tool, to modern Buddhist Bangkok. In Bangkok, if you live to be an adult gay, you will be welcomed only in the red light district.

The best we can do is to contain the hate of the 12 year old breeder girls that are disgusted and say so, as a call to action to their their breeder boyfriend wannabes.

No society, so far, has accomplished this. In fact, the libertine steak is what causes the wimpitude society that eventual kills great empires. The civil strife of altruism verses pubers' breeder prerogatives to make breeder warriors, is just too much.

Just tossing out an idea.
 
Kaendar

Kaendar

Well-Known Member
Anybody with half a brain should be understanding this. If you call someone a bigot, then attack them for not agreeing with your beliefs, then that makes you a bigot, a hypocrite, and your points invalid. Gays have owned themselves by protesting Chick Fil A bcuz the restaurant is making more money then ever. Gays could have every right in the book and still would not shut the fuck up. They dont want equality, they want superiority. They wont stop until everyone bows down and submits to their way of thinking.
 
DonPepe

DonPepe

Active Member
Doer said:
I'm going to get all global-social/psycho-babble. I've gone thru various levels of understanding the issues here. I live in a gay marriage State. Bear with me please, because I'm just getting this.

It's on the question of exactly who rejects gays and why. Leave out the political. Grant that homophobia is fear, not OF gays, it's fear of BEING gay, or being even perceived that way.

So, when is this the most important issue for the survival of the species? Puberty, right? Only one brain, yet, and it's below the navel. And then, who rejects gays the most violently? Pubers. And most naturally, I might add.

What I'm beginning to see, is a gay youth will be excoriated very early in life by his peers, the breeders. What perhaps was not choice, now becomes pure. The youth must decide with only 1/2 brain, what is worth it. Suffer or change.

Yet, we think somehow, as a society we can straighten that out. Pubers have no sense of right and wrong on this. We can't straighten that. It's breeder prerogative in the genes, just like I'm pretty sure there are gayness genes. Those with that makeup, are now, and will continue to be pushed out of the social nest at a very young age. And there is another nest waiting, the older youths, as sexual predators. It looks to me the choice, if there at all, if forced.

Just trying to get to the root. This means that no effort of society to accept gay, in this world has ever succeeded for very long. It is likely to never succeed. This goes even for Sparta, where guy sex was martial tool, to modern Buddhist Bangkok. In Bangkok, if you live to be an adult gay, you will be welcomed only in the red light district.

The best we can do is to contain the hate of the 12 year old breeder girls that are disgusted and say so, as a call to action to their their breeder boyfriend wannabes.

No society, so far, has accomplished this. In fact, the libertine steak is what causes the wimpitude society that eventual kills great empires. The civil strife of altruism verses pubers' breeder prerogatives to make breeder warriors, is just too much.

Just tossing out an idea.
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I think, I agree with the majority of what your saying but admittedly lack some of the necessary vocabulary to fully grasp all of your ideas.

I would like to point out the possible offence you make be causing by referring to heterosexuals as "breeders". It seems quiet similar to the use of slang in reference to homosexuals, which has been known to cause offence. This does seem an odd tactic when advocating the rational and reasonable treatment of others. None the less a few of my gay friends also enjoy making light of the situation using said term, but in those conversations we both are typically using quiet offensive slang directed at each other so i think that a light hearted banter is very different than this situation? How would you feel if you were gay and I routinely referred to homosexuals as faggots or queers in my online posts?

see what i am saying, sometimes fighting fire with fire only ends up burning the whole forest down.
 
Doer

Doer

Well-Known Member
Look, I'm not aware of these silly slurs back and forth. And even now, you say so, I still don't care. I am trying to put it as succinctly as possible. And since we are talking about the deep genetic, manifest destiny of pubescence, Breeder is exactly what I mean.

What you mean is simply not happening. There is no fight fire with fire. There is no fire and no fight. It might be too confusing, maybe, at first read.

I'm not grinding on Homo or whatever. Are you? I say it is genetic. I'm saying the rejection by the cruelest of all humans, 11 year girls, is also genetic. That's it. No agenda. No fight. Just an idea for discussion, not debate.
 
olylifter420

olylifter420

Well-Known Member
I dont think this is family friendly and something i want my children growing up around.. I think it is a lost cause with this because there are so many examples that just aw me and those watching the program. I was flipping through channels and on mtv, they had this trulife, im in a gay foursome or something, the way those people acted was straight retarded and mtv too, for showing 4 dudes showering together all making out with each other.

I think if they had a different base which to call on, there cause would be better heard

[video]http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rgQ6OEYgVOw[/video]




DonPepe said:
It seems more and more we are abandoning the rationality and reasoning that held so much power during the first part of the gay rights movement and is turning into a shit slinging contest. As more and more effort is moved from raising public awareness to defacing and attacking individuals simply for having a diffident view the steam is quickly running out for me.

For me it was all about achieving equality for most of the gay community not about silencing and defacing all public opinions that are different. For years this country has allowed many conflicting beliefs to exist together and cohabitate this nation getting along in relative peace with only a few hurt feels here and there enjoying the same protection under the law. Yet it seems the closer we get to equality for more and more of the minority groups, the less it becomes about obtaining legal protection and the more the fight is shifted toward attacking others for being or believing different.



Antics like this just leave me with a sicking feeling in my stomach, not mention how similar it is to current political struggles. I will say props to Chick-fil-A for there closing statment welcoming all and pledging to continue to "treat every person with honor, dignity and respect –regardless of their belief, race, creed, sexual orientation or gender." which i see as a perfect example for how we should behave. We can't agree with everyone, but we can voice our disagreement while continuing to treat everyone with the same respect.

I think this is much of the same problem that has developed in our political system, where opponents attack the one another and attempt to destroy the reputation of there opponent rather than display how well they would preform in the respective office. Leaving the public to choose who is worse rather then who is better.

anyways, i just wanted to share my opinion on the subject and hope that soon we can get refocused on the actual goal, and abandon this tangent that is implicating us in the same crimes that resulted in the poor treatment of homosexuals for so many years.
Click to expand...
 
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