Some DIY LED questions....

I

IggyP

Active Member
added in an order for 3 of these 4' uvb t5's ....to put between the 2x4 strip builds...already have a ton of single 4' t5 HO fixtures so just going to use those...seems legit?

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00AQU8HRM/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

sort of thinking maybe the quality can be ok with just 3k +UVB but havent fully decided yet....thinking i can add in more blue later if im not broke by then lol....

trying to get as much out of the way before looking into this wiring/driver plan because i know there will be questions there...

i will keep with this here since ppl have been so generous to help...let everyone see how they do with a quick crop....most likey just cookies and chemdog D but we will see idk...

(#12)i guess one imp thing i am wondering is....can i get wire now? before figuring out how the layout will go regarding how many series and parallels?
which gauge and connectors do people recommend??

many thanks, nervous but excited...
 
I

IggyP

Active Member
ok, been crunching some math...got at least some farther along with the wiring part but a little im unsure on that clarification can help...

so the rough shot, ive drawn up for the 2x4 units to now have 26- 2ft f562 now...it makes for better spacing for spectral addition of some 4k or 5k strips...so there would be 20- 3k and 6-other spectrum....per 2x4 array...

the whole, F-series and low current plan, does seem to bite a little on the driver end but im not wavering, still seems like a good logic to me....seemed to take away alot of the driver options for me actually....

although i mostly was guessing around 70-80mA per diode, i still want some room to be able to ramp it up....in case i loose a contact lens or something? :D

kind of looks like by going 2' and Fseries and packing em like mad...i have no choice but full parallel...i thought about the 600w driver but ouch, expensive..the most efficient of all of them but over kill....even for "overkill"....

After trying it 100 diff ways i landed on an idea of a 480w CV driver.....for the 3k strips.....but i dont understand the dimmer options at all, i would really like a help for that if possible....i would like to be able to dim roughly a range like 50mA-150mA per diode....
(#13)can i do that?? would i need a HLG-480H-24a?? or HLG-480H-24b?? what dimmer type??

then for the sup ranges i was looking toward an economical 185w unit...i want to be able to crank those blue spectrums up in less strips...not as worried about efficiency for those....

should run something in a range of 400-600watts or so i was guessing......idk how the lumens convert on these things but if this will replace hps the way 6 quantum boards claim, im expecting about 4lbs per unit sounds right? ;P

lol
 
Humple

Humple

Well-Known Member
IggyP said:
ok, been crunching some math...got at least some farther along with the wiring part but a little im unsure on that clarification can help...

so the rough shot, ive drawn up for the 2x4 units to now have 26- 2ft f562 now...it makes for better spacing for spectral addition of some 4k or 5k strips...so there would be 20- 3k and 6-other spectrum....per 2x4 array...

the whole, F-series and low current plan, does seem to bite a little on the driver end but im not wavering, still seems like a good logic to me....seemed to take away alot of the driver options for me actually....

although i mostly was guessing around 70-80mA per diode, i still want some room to be able to ramp it up....in case i loose a contact lens or something? :D

kind of looks like by going 2' and Fseries and packing em like mad...i have no choice but full parallel...i thought about the 600w driver but ouch, expensive..the most efficient of all of them but over kill....even for "overkill"....

After trying it 100 diff ways i landed on an idea of a 480w CV driver.....for the 3k strips.....but i dont understand the dimmer options at all, i would really like a help for that if possible....i would like to be able to dim roughly a range like 50mA-150mA per diode....
(#13)can i do that?? would i need a HLG-480H-24a?? or HLG-480H-24b?? what dimmer type??

then for the sup ranges i was looking toward an economical 185w unit...i want to be able to crank those blue spectrums up in less strips...not as worried about efficiency for those....

should run something in a range of 400-600watts or so i was guessing......idk how the lumens convert on these things but if this will replace hps the way 6 quantum boards claim, im expecting about 4lbs per unit sounds right? ;P

lol
Click to expand...
Shit, brother, that's a lot of power for a fixture that's sized for a 2x4 space. I understand the desire to over-build, but I honestly don't think you'll ever be able to make good use of the extra wattage. Too much light for a 2x4, but even if you moved it into a space more appropriately-sized for that much light, the fixture's footprint would still be unsuitable, leaving the edges of (for example) a 4x4 poorly lit. Have you considered a 320 driver?
 
Randomblame

Randomblame

Well-Known Member
Do I understand this right? You plan 600w over a 4x 2'?

To the questions:
A series has build-in potentiometers for dc-voltage(±3v) and current(50-100%). The current poti is used for dimming and allows dimming down to 50%.
The B series offer 3-1 dimming(potentiometer(100k), 1-10v and PWM) but has a fixed voltage, so no voltage regulator.

HLG-185H-24A is a 200w driver and would be siutable for 6 F-strips.
 
Randomblame

Randomblame

Well-Known Member
I would go with an HLG-185(3000k) and an HLG-120(4000k) per 4x 2' area. That means 350w and +1000μMol/s PPFD and this is already too much and you will definately see signs of light stress at your first tries with LED.
700-800μMol/s/m² is the sweet spot with LED and I've seen 2x 4' grow with only an HLG-240 and they pulled up to 400g. That's ~50g/sft. and you need to be a top notch grower to beat that!
With 600w potential power you would run your light permanently dimmed down this costs a lot of the driver effiency. Usually 3-4% at 50% and even more if you go further down.

Screenshot_20180516-155429.png
 
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booms111

booms111

Well-Known Member
Randomblame said:
I would go with an HLG-185(3000k) and an HLG-120(4000k) per 4x 2' area. That means 350w and +1000μMol/s PPFD and this is already too much you will definately see signs of light stress at your first tries with LED.
700-800μMol/s/m² is the sweet spot with LED and I've seen 2x 4' grow with only an HLG-240 and they pulled up to 400g. That's ~50g/sft. and only a top notch grower can beat that!
With 600w potential power you would run your light permanently dimmed down with costs a lot of the driver effiency. Usually 3-4% at 50% and even more if you go further down.

View attachment 4136792
Click to expand...
That's what I just setup wattage wise in a 2x4 genetic test tent. HLG 240h-36a with four 132 boards, drivers putting out 280 watts and with fans 350 watts total at wall. I can't see using more light in such a small tent. This replaced a 600hps and I truly believe that yield will go up a good amount with the blanket of light in there now.
 
I

IggyP

Active Member
hmm yes, im getting a clearer picture....much thanks for all the info and stats its alot what i have been digging for....

strips came today ;P

atm i am leaning toward cutting back again to 24strips per 2x4....and just running it all evenly by a hlg-320-24a

finger is on the buy now trigger lol...i will give it a few more minutes at least tho :D ....i sort of wanted more controls but i can start with the first unit then swap things around as the clones get bigger... or change the plan up again and make some larger frames for those drivers etc....probably leave the uv out too at start just to get a better sense coming into it....

i dont think i felt like i learned so much in this since starting hydro organic runs mannny years ago...great feeling...

the chemdog will be a great test too for light sensitivity....

by my math....

65mA per diode / 585mA per strip
x24strips = 14,040mA
x23v = 14.04amps =323watts

pretty darn close to target, im having a hard time arguing against that 320w driver atm...sounds like that should be more than plenty bright from what im hearing...and i can dim down or raise them as needed so sounds like a lock eh
(btw im not using tents so have some flex on footprint)
 
welight

welight

Well-Known Member
IggyP said:
.

what i wanted to do was something like alternating 3k and 2700k strips....but since i guess 2700k strips dont exist? not sure what the next option would be.....im keen on that idea, because i would like to be able to turn "half the fixture" off for a simple veg, so to speak, then kick the 2700 to double intensity for flowering......perhaps i could do something like that but 3k only or? hmm

P
Click to expand...
we stock 2700k in strips if you require
http://www.cutter.com.au/proddetail.php?prod=cut3378
Cheers
Mark
 
boilingoil

boilingoil

Well-Known Member
Heck, my light is setup to run 17 strips in a 24"x 30" frame. 2 HLG-240H-24B divers for the 17 strips.
Right now its running 9 strips and 3 barsDSCN0865.JPG DSCN0866.JPG DSCN0867.JPG with a mix of red and deep red and 2 bars of blues and reds mixed
 
I

IggyP

Active Member
well those 2700s are cree so should assume a bit lower i think, but idk how much...could be nice just for a better spread but for me im basically locked in by now lol....hope it will be nice enough for an fun intro...

using 16ga solid wire....thats proper enough eh?

tallied up what should be total costs by now....basically marked me at $537.20 per....give or take a couple screws etc lol

as long as its no problems i will be happy with that for the even spread and better efficacy...

i know they could be taken apart and driven harder to cover double the area but its a sort of decent balance do you think? for total coverage...

the other issue i was already pondering.....about uneven spread....but i think i will have to troubleshoot that some on the fly....
at first i was going to add the outer strips to the "higher driven" sup color strips if ran by 2 drivers....

i also considered angling the outer couple rows or such....120 degree on these so it is at least a little room to consider idk...

perhaps i will tinker spacing once i can see it in front of me...or else add a perimeter ring driven harder separately....

the other thought i have is in regard to the 1k hps i have ran for a while....sort of drifted to them from 600s...lol...so its became less and less even....in some ways this can be a benefit in fact i have learned....although as a rule "even-ness" is a pretty chief principle, some genetic will really prefer a hotter spot in the canopy and some will really want to be on the sides....like the chems in my rooms...

i do not mono crop ;P

so yes, i am of a couple minds in that part but at least there is options now so for soon the fun can begin aha ;P
 
Randomblame

Randomblame

Well-Known Member
IggyP said:
well those 2700s are cree so should assume a bit lower i think, but idk how much...could be nice just for a better spread but for me im basically locked in by now lol....hope it will be nice enough for an fun intro...

using 16ga solid wire....thats proper enough eh?

tallied up what should be total costs by now....basically marked me at $537.20 per....give or take a couple screws etc lol

as long as its no problems i will be happy with that for the even spread and better efficacy...

i know they could be taken apart and driven harder to cover double the area but its a sort of decent balance do you think? for total coverage...

the other issue i was already pondering.....about uneven spread....but i think i will have to troubleshoot that some on the fly....
at first i was going to add the outer strips to the "higher driven" sup color strips if ran by 2 drivers....

i also considered angling the outer couple rows or such....120 degree on these so it is at least a little room to consider idk...

perhaps i will tinker spacing once i can see it in front of me...or else add a perimeter ring driven harder separately....

the other thought i have is in regard to the 1k hps i have ran for a while....sort of drifted to them from 600s...lol...so its became less and less even....in some ways this can be a benefit in fact i have learned....although as a rule "even-ness" is a pretty chief principle, some genetic will really prefer a hotter spot in the canopy and some will really want to be on the sides....like the chems in my rooms...

i do not mono crop ;P

so yes, i am of a couple minds in that part but at least there is options now so for soon the fun can begin aha ;P
Click to expand...

I would not turn/angle them inside at the ends. It is better, on the last ~8", to leave smaller gaps between the strips on each side. This way you increase side intensity and optimize homogenity.
In my build (see signature) the distances to the sides are getting narrower, so that I have the same intensity even at the sides.
When I set intensity to ~50klx in the center I get ~48klx at the sides(5cm from the wall) and 44klx at the outer ends. I will try to use 2 Ledil Florence 1R-Z90 lens modules(each lens has 3 modules) on the outer ends of the strips. A little focussing to 90° should increase my lux readings and with a bit luck I get also 50klx measurings there.

Screenshot_20180518-072439.png
 
I

IggyP

Active Member
sounds good....just need to wait for the rest of the stuff to get here i guess...

hmm...just wondering....are you guys going full anti-static gear assembling these?
ive already got an armband and a mat, but curious if they are needed or not....was kinda thinking it wouldnt be but im not sure if this packing warnings claiming it are generic or not...

i can like and quote privilege by now i noticed but for this late night sesh i will only want to thank everyone to be part of the conversation. peace!
 
Randomblame

Randomblame

Well-Known Member
I've not used any anti-static gear and till today I had no issues.
When you are unsure touch the heater or the earthing pole at the socket before .
That should be enough!
 
boilingoil

boilingoil

Well-Known Member
IggyP said:
well those 2700s are cree so should assume a bit lower i think, but idk how much...could be nice just for a better spread but for me im basically locked in by now lol....hope it will be nice enough for an fun intro...

using 16ga solid wire....thats proper enough eh?

tallied up what should be total costs by now....basically marked me at $537.20 per....give or take a couple screws etc lol

as long as its no problems i will be happy with that for the even spread and better efficacy...

i know they could be taken apart and driven harder to cover double the area but its a sort of decent balance do you think? for total coverage...

the other issue i was already pondering.....about uneven spread....but i think i will have to troubleshoot that some on the fly....
at first i was going to add the outer strips to the "higher driven" sup color strips if ran by 2 drivers....

i also considered angling the outer couple rows or such....120 degree on these so it is at least a little room to consider idk...

perhaps i will tinker spacing once i can see it in front of me...or else add a perimeter ring driven harder separately....

the other thought i have is in regard to the 1k hps i have ran for a while....sort of drifted to them from 600s...lol...so its became less and less even....in some ways this can be a benefit in fact i have learned....although as a rule "even-ness" is a pretty chief principle, some genetic will really prefer a hotter spot in the canopy and some will really want to be on the sides....like the chems in my rooms...

i do not mono crop ;P

so yes, i am of a couple minds in that part but at least there is options now so for soon the fun can begin aha ;P
Click to expand...
I believe the specs on the stripes say a max of 18 gauge wire for the connections to the stripes
 
I

IggyP

Active Member
boilingoil said:
I believe the specs on the stripes say a max of 18 gauge wire for the connections to the stripes
Click to expand...
hmm...i looked but didnt see the reference anywhere, link?...kind of looks like "it will fit" i am not for certain tho....i wont be pushing max current or anything with the 16ga but liked the idea to overbuild a little there...

EDIT: wow, i looked again, sure enough you are correct thank you! was able to cancel in time whew...
 
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