Thinking of a new light ..

SupraSPL said:

As much as I love that chart, it is just a general comparison of CXA curves. You have a valid concern but have no worries, if we were to plot a chart using the CXA3070 Z4 3000K 80CRI versus the CXA3050 U4 2700K 93CRI, the 40-50% boost the CXA3070 gets would overtake the high CRi in the deep red/far red range. Incidentally, I could not find any source for the high CRi CXA3050. Did they sell out or just have not been made available yet?

Click to expand...

I wish,here in Europe,we could find those 3000K ,80 cri Cree cobs ..
But for the high cri ,I think Mouser has them ,already ..
Not sure though ..

Right now ,I'm 3D designing -modelling the fixture ...

I'm trying different designs ...

Air-channelling, fan noise,drivers position,balance,light coverage and blending ......
Lots of thing to consider ...

Here is one of the first approaches ...



Aluminium angles are riveted to the sides of the heatsinks ....
These will provide support to heatsinks ...
An common DIY electronics metal box ,will accommodate the heatsinks .
3 x aluminium flat bars,riveted to the bottom of the box ,will add rigidity ..
(2x heatsinks= 8 lbs =~4 kg ).Openings are cut to the size of the heatsinks ..


The heatsinks will sit in place ...


and the aluminium angles will be attached with screws to the flat support bars ..



And there's the air inlets !

Air will be sucked in ,from the bottom side of the fixture ,from both sides of the heatsinks ...



While the lid will firmly attach to the rest of the box,having only two circular holes ,for the fans ,
to blow out hot air ,upwards ...



Seems rather cool design..Ain't so ...?
Simple ,but probably ..cool enough ...

I read ...silistors are PTC nor NTC...

GE_PTCThermistors.pdf

sensors of temperature...

Thermistor.pdf]

Thermocouple.pdf]

Tmp36-temperature-sensor.pdf]

DHT.pdf
now i can post links... thanks very much...
...but i cant give a thanks...

salmone said:

I read ...silistors are PTC nor NTC...



principales sensors of temperature...

Thermistor.pdf]

Thermocouple.pdf]

Tmp36-temperature-sensor.pdf]

now i can post links... thanks very much...
...but i cant give a thanks... botton like is missing to me?......

Click to expand...

Salmone,is this some kind of gaelic you speak ,as a mother language ?
(on a previous post ... )
Thanx for the links ...

sds... you know my bad bad english write...for these reason i post very little...

...im in Canary Islands.... spanish is my mother language...

be patience with me... sorry...

The HLP-80H-42 driver can be dimmed in three ways :
1) Via voltage (0-10 VDC )
2) Via pwm (0-100% 100Hz-3kHz )
3)Via resistor (0-100 K )

I'm thinking to make a 12 V PWM (555 & Mosfet ) dimmer for the fans ...
The dimming circuit also uses a 100 K pot for adjusting the Duty Cycle ...

So..
I'm thinking to use a double 100K pot (a single pot with two isolated sets of pins ,like two separate pots with same knob..)
in order to dim at the same time both the CXA's and the fans ...

Thing is that I need linear pots ...

Double pots (aka 'stereo pots' ) are used in audio electronics and are easy to find ...
But they are logarithmic and not linear ....

With a max of 2800mA ,if driven @ 1400mA ,the 3070's are operating at 50% of power potential ...


The driver has an output of 1950 mA max (led power pot at 100K )
at 1400mA ,the driver is operating at ~71,8 % of it's max current output / power ..
Pot must be set at ~ 71.8 K ..

Driver( at max ) can drive the 3070 at ~ 69,6 % of it's max potentional ..
( 70% is a fine max/peak for almost every electronic equipment with a range ..Starting from amplifier's volume set )


I wonder ,will a logarithmic pot operate smooth ,or it will provide abnormal/'gapped' adjustability ?

salmone said:

sds... you know my bad bad english write...for these reason i post very little...

...im in Canary Islands.... spanish is my mother language...

be patience with me... sorry...

Click to expand...

no need to apologise ..

Canary ,eh ?

It must be nice ,down there ...
Warm ..

in the way of Diy driver with PWM and more things... i go on O2surplus pcbs... Typhoon LED Controller ... or others pcbs... amaizing.... for me point of view ...great dyer...
yeah in Tenerife weather is ok... calentito

Here's a dimmer circuit ...
Skip totally the red shaded parts of the circuit ..(no need to have them in a simple fan dimming circuit ..
C7=MKT cap=47 n ( => frequency ~300 Hz ) ,must be grounded ..
300 Hz is fine to dim fans ...
It does not produce audible noise to fan (not that much )
Lm 555 can't provide stable operation above 20KHz ..
Neither full adjust range (0-100% )of Duty cycle ,with pwm frequencies above 2kHz ...
At 2Khz ,fan will make funny electronic whistling noises when dimmed ..

If the supply voltage is between 4.5 VDC - 18 VDC ,you can skip also, the green shaded part of the circuit ...
If the supply is >18 VDC (up to ~30 VDC max ),then the 7809 regulator circuit has to stay ..
(For 24 VDC fans ,for example ... )

The rough connection scheme ..
(per panel )

And this way ...
I can have dimmable up to 1950mA :

1) 1x WW 3000K -75 Watt max /panel ( 4 mother plants )
2) 2x WW 3000K -150 Watt max /panel ( 4 flowering beauties )
3) 1x NW 5000K -75 Watt /panel (4 babies / clones)
4) 1x NW 5000K + 1x WW 3000K 150 Watt /panel ( 4 growing champs )
2x panels ....
300 Watts at max ...

plus PWM dimmable & overdriven ,from a point and further !!! -thus 15 Volts PSU, 12 V fans ,which
adjust their airflow/speed/noise along / analog to the set led current/power ....

Simple,enough...
For under $500 in total ....

Example 1
Example.2
Example.3

i like something like these... arduino way or similars...

...but your way its ok to me ...like too

About drivers ....

My choice to drive the CXA 3070's is the 'bare' HLP-80H-42

http://www.meanwell.com/search/HLP-80H/default.htm

Which offers :

Universal AC input / Full range (up to 305VAC)
Built-in active PFC function
Protections: Short circuit / Over current / Over voltage / Over temperature
Cooling by free air convection
Output voltage & constant current level adjustable
Class 2 power unit
Three in one dimming function (1~10Vdc or PWM signal or resistance)
Suitable for built in LED lighting system
Suitable for dry / damp locations
100% full load burn-in test
3 years warranty

At a price of $49.50 per driver ....

This bare thing is encapsulated in an aluminium case and sold as
at least three different types (A , B , AB) as the top notch driver the HLG-80H-42 A/B/AB/BL/D
http://www.meanwell.com/search/HLG-80H/default.htm

With a price of $86.20 for the A and B types and $104 for the mixed AB type


Check the characteristics (electrical,size,even the adjusting pots placing ) between those two
drivers ...
Draw your own conclusions ..
I've already drawn mine ...
They are the one-exact -same thing ...
You get the features of the $100 AB type ,from the 'luxurious' HLG series ,
as the ~$50 ,bare / naked HLP series ....

An electronics alum box for DIY,at the drivers size ,will cost about $10 ...

HLP-80H-42 (+1mm in length ...)



Well ,not so small drivers ,like the cheap asian counterparts ....

Another idea is this .....


All four heatsinks (ex plan:two separate panels ) to be one panel ....

One only pot will adjust the current to all the CXAs (one pot for four drivers ) and the duty cycle
of the pwm controlled fans ...

One DPTP switch will handle the alteration between veg/flowering mode ...

A single pwm fan controlling pcb/circuit is needed ..
Only one pot ..And only one Amperemeter
And only one ON/OFF switch ..

That is the most economical design with least control ...

The most expensive would had 4 ON/OFF switches , for each driver
One on/off switch for the fan's 12-15 VDC psu
4x double 100K pots
4x PWM fan controlling circuits
2x spectrum change switches
4x amperemeters ..

And a really huge box to place all these inside /upon ....

I think i like the idea of one single panel ....


At max of 1950 mA ,the CXA 3070 ,has a VF of ~38.5 Volts ..
Thus 1.95 * 38.5 x 4 = 300,3 Watts ...

The 4x CXAs of the fixture will dissipate ~300 Watts at the max setting of the fixture ..
With an average of 35% efficiency , ~ 195 of those Watts are turned into heat ....

So ..
Cooling ...
Starting point : Dissipate 200Watts of heat ...

Passive Cooling Components :
Four 200x160x40mm heatsinks ,each with 16 fins .Rth = ~0.5 C/W ( aver.)
Total mass of ~8 kgs ( ~17.6 lbs ) of soft aluminium alloy ( AA 1060/1061 A )

Active components:
Four 120 mm fans 12-15 V ,
still under question of which type and speed/airflow/power/electrical characteristics ...

100 Watts of light ....
The 400 W greenpower HPS ,that once I was using ,
is one of the most efficient hps bulbs around ...
120 Watts of light ,when new ...
Would last for approx 7-10 grow cycles ( cycle: 4 weeks 18/6 ,10 weeks 12/12 )..

Now i get 100 Watts of light from 300 Watts light device ..
With way more grow-efficient spectrum ...
With no heat radiated to canopy...
With no risk of fire ..
For over 100 grow cycles ...
For under $500 ...
Power adjustable=electricity savings at veg ...
Upgradeable/spectrum customisable (due to led array holder utilisation /solderless design/ wide range of CXA led whites )
and easily serviceable ...

Leds 've became true HIDs..

High Intensity Diodes ....

Oh ,yeah ...

interesting project with cob...
for heatsink calculator see this:
heatsinkcalculator
you can set many parameter and simulate different heatsink design...

zangtumtum said:

interesting project with cob...
for heatsink calculator see this:
heatsinkcalculator
you can set many parameter and simulate different heatsink design...

Click to expand...

Thanx for the link !

Well ..Some of this calculator's results

Conductivity of 1060 alloy :234 w/mK
http://www.makeitfrom.com/material-data/?for=1060-Al99.6-Aluminum
Emissivity of polished alum : 0.05
http://www.infrared-thermography.com/material.htm
TIM : Arctic Silver 5 / Thermal Conductivity : 8.9 W/mK
Thickness 0.2 mm ( 0.001 inch )
Fin thickness :5mm

Power source : CXA 3070 / 27.3 x 27.3 mm / 50 Watts of heat @ 1950mA

passive : TC= 93.9 C

Active cooling ,fan capacity 35 CFM : TC=40.3 C

Active cooling ,fan capacity 50 CFM : TC=38.6 C



Active cooling ,fan capacity 80 CFM : TC=36.9 C




Four 120 mm fans at 40-60 CFM each ,will do the job ,more than fine ....
Even if all four fail ....
With 8 kgs of aluminium heatsinking ,still the leds will operate under 100 C (T case )
@1950 mA ..
Great !

But I should aim for a TC of 35-40 C @ 1950 mA ...
For long service life ...
For many grow cycles ...

A quick walk downtown ,and I found easily two types of 120 mm fans ,that's worth mentioning .

1 ) Sunon Maglev (Magnetic Levitation Tech ) MEC 0251V1-0000-A99
120x120x25 mm / 12 VDC 451mA / 5.4W / 3100 rpm / 108.2 CFM / 44.5 dB



1 ) Sunon Maglev MEC 0381V1-0000-A99
120x120x38 mm / 12 VDC 845mA / 10.1 W/ 3100 rpm / 138 CFM / 48 dB


5 Watts more power for -0.6 °C temperature difference at each CXA case ...

List of the parts ,up till now :

- 4x Fischer Electronik SK85 heatsinks
( NormaBox ST20 is the non-anodised 'copycat' I'm going to use. ) : $55

- 4x MeanWell HLP-80H-42 CC AC/DC led drivers : $200

- 6x Ideal CHIP-LOK CXA array holders mod. 50-22 :$12

- 2x Cree CXA3070 3000°K 80CRI bin: Z4 ( core spectrum ) :$ 90

- 2x Cree CXA3070 5000°K 70CRI ( vegetative stage accessory spectrum): $70

- 2x Cree CXA3070 2700°K 80CRI ( reproductive stage accessory spectrum ):$70

-4x Sunon MagLev MEC0251V1-0000-A99 12V ,120mm fans :$50

-1x DIY custom made PWM Mosfet fan controller : $8

-1x MeanWell PS-45-15 , 15 VDC CV 3000mA PSU : $17

- Arctic Silver 5 ,thermoconductive paste : $15

Total : $587 ( ~420 € ) for 300 Watts (max ) ,
adjustable spectrum & power ,all-white led grow light..