Week 5 flower gets me everytime.

1

10-46

Member
Rocket Soul said:
It looks like a bit of a conundrum and im not the best at spotting nute related stuff but im going to lean the way of salt build up and high calcium blocking out potasium for that yellowing tip look.

But there may be some other unfortunate stuff happening at the same time. It seems like you gone about this by correcting nutes when there is another thing to adress first: enviroment.
74F is too cold imo for a led grow. You want atleast 79 for high intensity led growing or the plant will not be able to transpire or run its metabolism properly to keep up with the light you give. Go research led grows with vpd/vapour pressure deficit. Its the way to get your led plants to drink properly to be able to keep up. Its a sort of "rising sea lifting all ships approach" rather than trying to fix the nute balance. Youll know its transpiring well when all leaves have a huge leaf boner and standing straight. Also look into if your temps are uniform up and down the plant. Some of the pics seem to show top leaves with burnt tips (nute burn) but lowers without: this to me would indicate that your plant isnt transpring uniformly: where its hot the plant drinks more and gets too much nutes while lowers dont get enough to create this problem.

Also, mixing organic nutes in soil with hydro nutes means that your runoff measurements may be off. Ive not seen you mention what ec you get, if your pen is an issue get a good one, blue lab is good.

My general led recommendation is to use good quality coco (we use canna which has workdd better than other brands) and to try to follow vpd but really looking for that desireable plant posture of no saggy leaves. Dial this in, then make a note of ec in and out at every watering, try to see how they trend and adjust.

Coco pots dont have to be big, they can handle huge plants in small containers. Your plant size would make me thing that 2 gallons should be enough. 5 gallons of coco and youll have too much water retention and salt build ups and hard to control runoff. It would waste coco and water and nutes and only create problems.
When up potting always do a extra strong feed the first time to buffer the coco. This as long as the coco is unbuffered and good quality. You can also prebuffer but thats complicated.

Try to implement some of this, especially climate for the next grow, post it with temps/rh, ec in/out and peeps around will help you out. This one i dont really know how to get you out of problems; raising temps now with media likely hot is going to create more transpiration and even more nutr burn. Once someone starts playing around with their nutes too much, adding this and that to fight deficiencies, its very hard to get back on track cause youll have what looks like lock out, deficiencies and ocer feeding all at the same time: it just gets impossible to weed out whats what from online


But next time make sure you add more heat and keep an eye on where you land in the vpd charts when starting flower
Click to expand...

Before I reply here, I'm curious to know if you happen to fly rockets? It's an old hobby of mine, and I fly high powered rockets with Tripoli... Ever try an "L" Motor? That's the largest Ive burned but I may try for my level 3 certification this year (allowing me to fly M's)...I get some pretty large rockets up to 10K ft altitude where I live, its a fun hobby... Cool name.

Temperature, your not the first to mention this and I have noticed that my leaves are not praying as you mention. I have had this happen when temps are higher, so I'm hearing you. OK, I'll invest in some type of heater for my grow tent to get temps up....I really need something small that doesnt use a lot of watts, most heaters use a lot of electricity, that been the main reason I don't use them... 97 watt light and 1500 watt heater ! (ouch). My space is small though and if I can find one with a thermostat that works, it shouldnt have to run long. Another option is to go up to a Spiderfarmer SF-2000 pro (square model of the SF2000 not rectangular) That extra 100 watts of light might get my temps up a few degrees....

I'm not knocking your recommendation to use Coco, but I prefer to stay in soil if possible. From what I've read, you have to water Coco almost daily, something I can't do. I like to make short trips to fly rockets ! I did try Fox Farm Coco Loco last grow to get my toe in the water with Coco,,, It worked OK but I felt it held too much water after a good soaking, completely opposite of what I would expect from Coco... Yes, Coco Loco is not pure Coco, its a hybrid Coco/Soil mix... Anyway, I'll consider Coco--- but was planning to use Happy Frog again. (I have a full bag). I've done much reading on "buffering" coco, especially with Cal/Mag.... I'm familiar with what your saying here. I've also read nothing but good things about Canna.. Appreciate the tip !

So far I have Salt buildup in flower (common problem) and using a rinse agent to help prevent this, and now you mentioning temperature which I've heard before. So, you all have given me something to try ! THANKS !!!!

Side note: Although the plant pics I've showed look rough, I am making it to harvest and getting really good bud, more than I can possibly smoke alone. So, its not been a total loss.... I just think I can do much better !
 
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1

10-46

Member
jimihendrix1 said:
For one, Id get the temps up to 80f-84f. They wont use nutrients like they should at cooler temps.

Weed is a Calcium/Sulfur/Magnesium hog. I myself like to use Epsom Salts for my source of Magnesium, and Sulfur. And I se it most every watering, in small amounts. I* strive for a 1-1-2 ratio. And also use Kelp, for Micros, as well as Azomite.
Sulfur has also been linked to terpene production.

While I mainly use chemicals-Master Blend
4-18-38
15.5-0-0 Calcium Nitrate, which is almost 20% Calcium
Epsom Salts.
I use it from start to finish, and Slowly, Over Time, increase the feeding amount, as I feed at every watering, I reduce the amount of fertilizer, as per full dose. I may start out with seedlings at 10% of recommended dose. And start from there.

In say an 9 weeks flowering strain, I will increase fertilizer, when I see they are growing, and tolerating, what Im giving them.

Then at around the 23 weeks in a 63 day flowering strain, I will add a small amount of
0-52-34. Monopotassium Phosphate. From week 3-4. While still, Slightly increasing, Base Formula PPM.
Week 65 MPK is stopped, and Epsom Salts, is increased for 2 weeks. Base PPM, is still slightly, going up.
Last 2 weeks, ALL fertilizer is reduced by 25% week 8, and another 25%, on week 9.
Click to expand...

Man, its crazy all the things I've tried. I went with Dolomite Lime, but stopped due to people warning me about the ratios.... Then I went with a few Cal/Mag supplements. You cant go right ! I have not tried Epsom Salt, but I do see many using it. I'll grab a bag,

I hear you about being a Calcium/Mag/Sulfur hog. Maybe I'm being too careful adding cal/mag... I really try to take it easy with that stuff. As far as sulfur, I do use a product called MagPro (Dynagrow) along with my bloom. This includes a good dose of sulfur, and I'm always amazed how strongly my plants smell after using it. No joke, and not my imagination either. When I feed sulfur, my plants start stinking in days guaranteed, its crazy...
 
jimihendrix1

jimihendrix1

Well-Known Member
10-46 said:
Man, its crazy all the things I've tried. I went with Dolomite Lime, but stopped due to people warning me about the ratios.... Then I went with a few Cal/Mag supplements. You cant go right ! I have not tried Epsom Salt, but I do see many using it. I'll grab a bag,

I hear you about being a Calcium/Mag/Sulfur hog. Maybe I'm being too careful adding cal/mag... I really try to take it easy with that stuff. As far as sulfur, I do use a product called MagPro (Dynagrow) along with my bloom. This includes a good dose of sulfur, and I'm always amazed how strongly my plants smell after using it. No joke, and not my imagination either. When I feed sulfur, my plants start stinking in days guaranteed, its crazy...
Click to expand...
I mainly use Promix BX as a Medium, and it contains both Calcitic Lime, and Dolomitic.

They use it at a 2/3 Calcitic to 1/3 Dolomite Ratio. Thats also what RATIO I use outside in East, Ky. Dolomite, in Clay soil, will turn it, into concrete.

But by combining both, you have the best of both worlds with both Calcium, and Magnesium. Calcitic is best for faster PH change, and dolomite, breaks down, and stabilizes medium, over time.
I use epsom salts, throughout the whole grow. Seedling -adult. Every watering.

Also in weeks 6-7, for a 9 weeks flowering plant, Im using about the same amount of Epsom Salts, as I do the base formula. 4-18-38.
 
Rocket Soul

Rocket Soul

Well-Known Member
10-46 said:
Before I reply here, I'm curious to know if you happen to fly rockets? It's an old hobby of mine, and I fly high powered rockets with Tripoli... Ever try an "L" Motor? That's the largest Ive burned but I may try for my level 3 certification this year (allowing me to fly M's)...I get some pretty large rockets up to 10K ft altitude where I live, its a fun hobby... Cool name.

Temperature, your not the first to mention this and I have noticed that my leaves are not praying as you mention. I have had this happen when temps are higher, so I'm hearing you. OK, I'll invest in some type of heater for my grow tent to get temps up....I really need something small that doesnt use a lot of watts, most heaters use a lot of electricity, that been the main reason I don't use them... 97 watt light and 1500 watt heater ! (ouch). My space is small though and if I can find one with a thermostat that works, it shouldnt have to run long. Another option is to go up to a Spiderfarmer SF-2000 pro (square model of the SF2000 not rectangular) That extra 100 watts of light might get my temps up a few degrees....

I'm not knocking your recommendation to use Coco, but I prefer to stay in soil if possible. From what I've read, you have to water Coco almost daily, something I can't do. I like to make short trips to fly rockets ! I did try Fox Farm Coco Loco last grow to get my toe in the water with Coco,,, It worked OK but I felt it held too much water after a good soaking, completely opposite of what I would expect from Coco... Yes, Coco Loco is not pure Coco, its a hybrid Coco/Soil mix... Anyway, I'll consider Coco--- but was planning to use Happy Frog again. (I have a full bag). I've done much reading on "buffering" coco, especially with Cal/Mag.... I'm familiar with what your saying here. I've also read nothing but good things about Canna.. Appreciate the tip !

So far I have Salt buildup in flower (common problem) and using a rinse agent to help prevent this, and now you mentioning temperature which I've heard before. So, you all have given me something to try ! THANKS !!!!

Side note: Although the plant pics I've showed look rough, I am making it to harvest and getting really good bud, more than I can possibly smoke alone. So, its not been a total loss.... I just think I can do much better !
Click to expand...
Ive been here for 8 years and your the first one who figured out my secret identity, but im pretty sure it doesn't matter, who will believe you when you say you met Elon Musk on a weed forum? 8)

Jokes aside, i will give you an answer and no im not a rocket enthusiast. Its a song i used to dj with an absolute driving pace, only up and up and up... Its something that resonated with me, ive always been of an upwards and up into space, never very grounded and living very much with my head in the skies...

Why coco? You can honestly use another substrate but the main thing is that it should be really light in nutrs, best nothing at all. That way you know the plant only get fed from your bottle. If you mix in soil organic nutes and bottle; it gets really hard to make those little adjustments your going to have to make during the grow. Coco would be my favorite but you can do any really.

Please look into vapour pressure deficit aswell, this is what makes a plant transpire, special in a light that doesnt have any heat, like leds. Alternatively you can try a low watt incandescent bulb but start really low watts, too much and youll have a lot of stretch, especially if you have your regular light dimmed. Infact this could maybe even improve your current grow. Ill leave you aswell with a good resource: vpdchart.com this will guide you towards the right environment for every stage; take your environment in that direction and look for praying leaves: this is the real goal, not any special temp/rh readings. When you see the plant happy, its happy. Usually the easiest way is just a bit more heat. Think of 78-79F as your ideal but also as the absolute floor, 80ies are fine especially in veg.



I dont know why people think that you have to water coco every day, it would likely be detrimental imo. Your the second person in a xouple of days saying this and i dont get it, it can definitely be over watered if you dont have loads of roots. The reasons i hear is hydrophobic coco (which is very handlable with hand watering, just dona slight wet on top, like 25% of what youd need for first runoff, let is settle and then water thru til runoff).
And the idea that coco is very drainy is absolutely wrong; its one of the most water retaining substrates there is. A small pot is enough. But i dont have a horse in this, you can do soil aswell just make sure that once you start getting into flower and higher light intensity you should have any of the already in the soil nutes left, all from a bottle which gives you proper control.
 
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