What is this deficiency?

This is baby GorillaGlue AF from ILGM. I've had a lot of issues with Fox Farms Ocean Forest. I wonder if it is because I am on the East Coast (different mix), or possibly because I left the bag of FFOF in the hot garage all summer (can that mess it up?). Most things I grow in it get some sort of deficiency, usually right off the bat like the below. I get good bud growth, strong stems and roots, but the leaves on my plants always look like hell.

This little plant has been growing a few weeks, feeding just tap water (~130ppm 7.0 pH) with a tiny bit of myco supp in it (I'm super conservative and put in a fraction of what they say). Light for it has been weak until about 10 days ago when I put a better grow bulb over it, and it started growing much faster.

After I saw this interveinal chlorosis start a couple days ago, I started adding a few drops of FF GrowBig, BigBloom, Cal/Mag Plus, and two drops Jackpot micronutrient mix (in case this deficiency is one of the trace nutrients ) to 1L of water. I'm probably dosing at 2% of bottle directions as afraid to burn it. What is this deficiency? I've checked the charts and MANY macro and micro nutrients, under and over fertilizing cause interveinal chlorosis. Any guesses?

It's in a small "bio-degradable" grow bag that I seeded it in. I have an old AK47 AF seed that I sprouted with this one, in same size bag, and it looks fine. I over-watered them at first and started them a little rough, but once I got that figured out, they have been growing much better. The first leaves were pretty weird and the seed pod never opened properly, the first true leaves sort of just sprouted from the cotyledon leaves that were glued together (shell had fallen off so it wasn't that).

I'm in mid-late flowering with two other plants in my 2x2 grow tent, so I need to wait for those to finish before I can transplant this and put it under the big lights.

The plastic container this bag is sitting in is one of those 16oz take out soup containers (I used a new one), to give an idea of the size. I am hoping to grow it a little more in this before I put it into the final 3 gal cloth bag but I might have to transplant sooner. Is it possible that at this size of plant and small grow bag of FFOF, it used all the soil nutrients already in just three weeks?

Looks like Mg deficiency. I think you need to chill and just give it plain water. My guess is you're giving too much crap and causing lockouts and pH issues.

It started before I gave it anything except plain tap water and the myco supplement (this myco supp), which I added at fractional dosage. Can the myco supplement cause deficiencies? So that's why my concern is that maybe its short on nutrients.

mikey9980 said:

It started before I gave it anything except plain tap water and the myco supplement (this myco supp), which I added at fractional dosage. Can the myco supplement cause deficiencies? So that's why my concern is that maybe its short on nutrients.

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Well there's your problem. It isn't just mycorrhizae. It's got other stuff in it. Says 3-0-3. Stop using that stuff, and get some plain Mykos if you want.

Very good point, I did not notice that. Thank you.

mikey9980 said:

Very good point, I did not notice that. Thank you.

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No problem. I started with FFOF and then turned it into no-till. Just give it plain water for a bit and see how it responds.

First …. What’s wrong with your FFOF ?

NOW …..
Your Ph is high … bring it down to 6.5/6.6 .
Transplant the poor thing into a proper container and new fresh medium
Stop throwing ( guessing ) bottles and supplements at it. Period.
Looks overwatered … bag have drainage ?

Autos hate stress …. Overwatering / Overfeeding / etc.
Too much of that and it will affect results of plant.

Right now … all that monkeying around with feed looks like it affecting its initial growth and size.
Autos have a short veg cycle … screw that narrow window up with goof ups sets the final size and rootmass.
Autos are run and gun …. They have no time to “ come around “ after major goofs . Once veg cycle is over about week 5 ish ( give or take ) since germ there is nothing you can do. It will drag itself to preflower and bloom just to finish. There will be some stretch before Actual flower.

Budzbuddha said:

First …. What’s wrong with your FFOF ?

NOW …..
Your Ph is high … bring it down to 6.5/6.6 .
Transplant the poor thing into a proper container and new fresh medium
Stop throwing ( guessing ) bottles and supplements at it. Period.
Looks overwatered … bag have drainage ?

Autos hate stress …. Overwatering / Overfeeding / etc.
Too much of that and it will affect results of plant.

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He overfed them with that stuff. And now he's got lockout. My guess is K toxicity.

How do you know his soil pH? And there's nothing wrong with that bag if it's a grow bag that can breathe like I'm assuming.

It's a grow bag and breaths fine, in fact better than the cloth kind because it's very thin, intended to be able to be planted in the bag. I don't have space to re-plant it yet. I was hoping it would mature another couple weeks in there while my other two ladies finish up. But good advise on the concerns of auto-flowers! I'll have to think about that and how to better time my "operation"

MAYBE overfed. I mean they give you a scoop with a quarter teaspoon end and I filled that less than one quarter of the way (less than 1/4 of 1/4 teaspoon) to the 1L. But yeah in my haste to get some root supplement, I was not thinking of the 3-0-3 right on the front of the package. I'll switch back to plain tap and see how that goes.

pH'ing water advice on this site and others is all over the map - some successful growers say there is no need to pH and that it is even harmful, and others say to pH adjust everything including plain tap water. I've gravitated to only adjust pH when I start to use flower nutrients that are very acidic. Then I give some pH up to get it into ~6.2-6.5 range. Chemically, it does not seem that important to pH water that's softish at ~130ppm. It's going to take on whatever pH the soil is buffered to I would think.

Look … FFOF is ph to 6.3 …. It helps if you can range your PH to at least match for proper uptake. ( 6.5 )
That way you have a little wiggle room in case ph swings. Your feed should be treated the same as your watering.

FFOF alone can carry an auto , with a few top dressings during later stages. I’ve grown plenty of autos this way … without bottles.
Buffers will be replenished when top dressing , medium recharged.

If you transplanted … that upsize in “ medium “ would power that plant for weeks. All by itself.

Budzbuddha said:

Look … FFOF is ph to 6.3 …. It helps if you can range your PH to at least match for proper uptake. ( 6.5 )
That way you have a little wiggle room in case ph swings. Your feed should be treated the same as your watering.

FFOF alone can carry an auto , with a few top dressings during later stages. I’ve grown plenty of autos this way … without bottles.
Buffers will be replenished when top dressing , medium recharged.

If you transplanted … that upsize in “ medium “ would power that plant for weeks. All by itself.

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It's supposed to start at 6.3, but not always. And the buffering agents can be flushed out. Or you can end up raising pH by giving water high in Ca.

If you want to know the actual soil pH you need a decent pH probe or pen. Here's the one I have.

Budzbuddha said:

If you transplanted … that upsize in “ medium “ would power that plant for weeks. All by itself.

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That's what I did with the first two I am growing, that are currently flowering. I thought it would be convenient since these little disposable grow bags can simply be planted into more soil (the roots readily stick out and they are sticking out on my little ones like the one pictured). Get them seeded in a little bag and then bury the little bag into the final bag once they are ready. However, I think with my flowering plants that caused me to over-feed them as I was not mindful that re-burying them into more FFOF was giving them lots of new nutrients. In that method of burying the original little bag, it may also create a weird situation where the very center of the soil (in the original disposable grow bag) is depleted while the surrounding soil is hot (I had some part of the plants look great and other branches not so). This time around I am thinking of just tearing these disposable bags open (they between paper and cloth), shake a little off and then replant the mass into my 3 gal cloth pots with fresh FFOF. And to your point, NOT feed anything for weeks after that.

I like the idea of just soil and dressings. It takes some faith, but the simplicity of it seems like a better route for me. Thanks for the ideas!

PadawanWarrior said:

If you want to know the actual soil pH you need a decent pH probe or pen. Here's the one I have.

Bluelab Soil pH Pen

A hardy handheld solution for measuring soil pH and temperature on the go Effective in most growing media and in water/solution Fully waterproof - not just water resistant Industry-leading one-year warranty for peace of mind Hold reading function to capture measurements with ease Simple...

bluelab.com

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Thank you for this!!! I had purchased a few in prior grows many years ago, the cheapo brown kind from hardware stores and Amazon but suspected them to be ridiculously inaccurate. I concluded that soil pH meters were just gimmicks, but maybe it was just poor meters and user error. I'll buy this one as that would be very convenient. I had been doing runoff pH tests, but I know that is not perfectly accurate either.

mikey9980 said:

Thank you for this!!! I had purchased a few in prior grows many years ago, the cheapo brown kind from hardware stores and Amazon but suspected them to be ridiculously inaccurate. I concluded that soil pH meters were just gimmicks, but maybe it was just poor meters and user error. I'll buy this one as that would be very convenient. I had been doing runoff pH tests, but I know that is not perfectly accurate either.

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You're correct. Runoff is pretty meaningless. If you stick with organics you don't even need the good pH pens really.

And those $10 meters are worthless. You're right again, lol.

PadawanWarrior said:

You're correct. Runoff is pretty meaningless. If you stick with organics you don't even need the good pH pens really.

And those $10 meters are worthless. You're right again, lol.

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Already purchased the BlueLab and arriving in hours apparently. I like gadgets, and do some other gardening so I will get use out of it even if I get so good I don't need the pen.

I'm going to research and find myself some practical instruction on the organic approach. I like the idea of not messing with all the bottles. It seems like a lot of a trial and error guessing game when working with bottles + soil, with more downside than upside.