What the F, am I doing wrong???

bloody hell why veg for 8 weeks?

I have to ask the same question, at least since you said you are using 250-watt HID lighting. Unless you topped multiple times and SCROGed you wasted your time. A 250-watt light only has about 18 inches of penetration so anything below 18 inches from your bulb will be in low light conditions. If you veg past about 8 to 10 inches max every day you veg after that is a waste of time, unless you SCROG, and then then you are pushing the envelope unless you have enough 250-watt lights to adequately cover the area the plants will cover. Most of what you end up with will usually be low quality.

You can easily grow 5 foot plants with 250-watt lighting but they will pretty much be low quality almost all of the time. The tops may be decent, not great, just decent, but once you get below that what you get will be worse and worse even if you keep fresh bulbs burning.

People like to say genetics is everything, heck I used to say the same thing, but in reality genetics is only half of what your final results will be. Top genetics gives you the chance to grow great herb but they do not guarantee high quality. In the end growing conditions count for about 50% of the success or failure of your grow. You said what your humidity level was for drying but do you know what it was during flowering? Low humidity causes increased resin production, which is good, and higher humidity causes less resin production, which is not what growers want.

You might want to consider how you grow if you stick with your current setup or you might want to consider upgrading your setup. If you can step up to a 400-watt HID lighting system, that would be very good. If you can step up to a 600-watt HID lighting system, that would be even better. Keep your temperatures in the mid to upper 70's and keep your humidity low. Use true quality genetics and learn the specific needs for the specific genetics you grow, and not the needs for any of the many knockoff strains that might exist and carry the same name but are genetically different. Keep fresh bulbs in your lights. Keep a good airflow to keep fresh CO2 rich air passing through your plants or add CO2. There is much more ... but that would be a good start.

You said you grew "White Widow" and that you flowered for 10 weeks (68 days.) Whose "White Widow" did you grow? There is the original that was renamed Black Widow and then there are about 25 or 30, or more, knockoff "White Widow" strains. Some have flowering times as short as 55 days, some are as long as 75 days.

What was the color of your trichomes when you harvested, or did you just harvest by the number of days from the breeder information or by visible signs like receding pistils and color of leaves?

Did you wait for much of the THC to oxidize and turn into CBN and have amber to dark amber trichomes? Some "White Widow" knockoffs are mostly sativa and some are mostly indica so you have to know when the "White Widow" strain you grow will reach peak THC levels and harvest then. If you wait longer you will lose THC. If you harvest earlier you will not have reached peak THC levels.

"White Widow" can be one of the most confusing strains for an inexperienced grower to grow. With there being so many genetically different knockoffs out there much advice that is given might be totally correct for the knockoff "White Widow" the person advising grew but it can be horrible advice for the different knockoff "White Widow" the person asking advice is growing.

del66666 said:

bloody hell why veg for 8 weeks?

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I have been vegging mine now for about 10 weeks now and have a 3'11'' bush that still is continuing to get bigger. Think about it, the longer you veg. the bigger the plant will be, thus a bigger yield. I have been topping mine to make more branches come out. The more thicker branches you have, the more BIG buds you will have in addition to the little popcorn buds on the lower portion of the plant.

Brick Top said:

I have to ask the same question, at least since you said you are using 250-watt HID lighting. Unless you topped multiple times and SCROGed you wasted your time. A 250-watt light only has about 18 inches of penetration so anything below 18 inches from your bulb will be in low light conditions. If you veg past about 8 to 10 inches max every day you veg after that is a waste of time, unless you SCROG, and then then you are pushing the envelope unless you have enough 250-watt lights to adequately cover the area the plants will cover. Most of what you end up with will usually be low quality.

You can easily grow 5 foot plants with 250-watt lighting but they will pretty much be low quality almost all of the time. The tops may be decent, not great, just decent, but once you get below that what you get will be worse and worse even if you keep fresh bulbs burning.

People like to say genetics is everything, heck I used to say the same thing, but in reality genetics is only half of what your final results will be. Top genetics gives you the chance to grow great herb but they do not guarantee high quality. In the end growing conditions count for about 50% of the success or failure of your grow. You said what your humidity level was for drying but do you know what it was during flowering? Low humidity causes increased resin production, which is good, and higher humidity causes less resin production, which is not what growers want.

You might want to consider how you grow if you stick with your current setup or you might want to consider upgrading your setup. If you can step up to a 400-watt HID lighting system, that would be very good. If you can step up to a 600-watt HID lighting system, that would be even better. Keep your temperatures in the mid to upper 70's and keep your humidity low. Use true quality genetics and learn the specific needs for the specific genetics you grow, and not the needs for any of the many knockoff strains that might exist and carry the same name but are genetically different. Keep fresh bulbs in your lights. Keep a good airflow to keep fresh CO2 rich air passing through your plants or add CO2. There is much more ... but that would be a good start.

You said you grew "White Widow" and that you flowered for 10 weeks (68 days.) Whose "White Widow" did you grow? There is the original that was renamed Black Widow and then there are about 25 or 30, or more, knockoff "White Widow" strains. Some have flowering times as short as 55 days, some are as long as 75 days.

What was the color of your trichomes when you harvested, or did you just harvest by the number of days from the breeder information or by visible signs like receding pistils and color of leaves?

Did you wait for much of the THC to oxidize and turn into CBN and have amber to dark amber trichomes? Some "White Widow" knockoffs are mostly sativa and some are mostly indica so you have to know when the "White Widow" strain you grow will reach peak THC levels and harvest then. If you wait longer you will lose THC. If you harvest earlier you will not have reached peak THC levels.

"White Widow" can be one of the most confusing strains for an inexperienced grower to grow. With there being so many genetically different knockoffs out there much advice that is given might be totally correct for the knockoff "White Widow" the person advising grew but it can be horrible advice for the different knockoff "White Widow" the person asking advice is growing.

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Besides all this, I find the most important part of curing is the first 24 hours after you chop them. I chop mine down at the butt and place them into reverse osmosis water for the last shift, much like someone would place a freshcut flower into a vase of water. Take care that they don't go dry because this will have adverse effects on the taste if you do. I remove them just as the lights come on for the next shift. I get compliments from old women while I'm shopping that love the smell and I wrap mine in three baggies. Remove all the fan leaves as soon as you chop them. It's not all that great with the police though.

RohanVD86 said:

I have been vegging mine now for about 10 weeks now and have a 3'11'' bush that still is continuing to get bigger. Think about it, the longer you veg. the bigger the plant will be, thus a bigger yield. I have been topping mine to make more branches come out. The more thicker branches you have, the more BIG buds you will have in addition to the little popcorn buds on the lower portion of the plant.

Click to expand...

That makes sense IF someone does not veg so long that they will outgrow their lighting capabilities. The thread starter said he uses 250-watt HID lighting. That will only give adequate light penetration down to about 18 inches from the bulb. Anything below that will be in low light conditions and produce little to nothing and possibly will die off.

If Vegging with MH, especially a 6500K MH, the closest tightest nodal spacing will be at the lower portion of a plant. If someone uses lighting that will not get adequate light to the lower portion of a plant because they vegged to such a tall height the portion of the plant that should produce heavily will either produce poorly or die off. So what is the benefit of vegging that long/tall if someone's lighting cannot make the most of the plant?

Unless someone has adequate lighting for every day they veg past a point where after their plants shoot up in flower they are adding an additional day to the overall length of time of their grow and will receive little to nothing for it. They would be better off vegging for a shorter period of time, shortening the overall length of time for each grow and maximizing the production of their plants.

If someone veges five days or a week or two weeks or three weeks or whatever period of time beyond what their lighting is capable of making the most of, that same period of time would be wiser and more productively used in the vegging of the following crop.

Going big in veg is only worthwhile if you go big with lighting too. If not it is a waste of time, a waste of electricity, a waste of ferts/nutes, and it lengthens the overall time of a grow with little to nothing to show for it.

Brick Top said:

That makes sense IF someone does not veg so long that they will outgrow their lighting capabilities. The thread starter said he uses 250-watt HID lighting. That will only give adequate light penetration down to about 18 inches from the bulb. Anything below that will be in low light conditions and produce little to nothing and possibly will die off.

If Vegging with MH, especially a 6500K MH, the closest tightest nodal spacing will be at the lower portion of a plant. If someone uses lighting that will not get adequate light to the lower portion of a plant because they vegged to such a tall height the portion of the plant that should produce heavily will either produce poorly or die off. So what is the benefit of vegging that long/tall if someone's lighting cannot make the most of the plant?

Unless someone has adequate lighting for every day they veg past a point where after their plants shoot up in flower they are adding an additional day to the overall length of time of their grow and will receive little to nothing for it. They would be better off vegging for a shorter period of time, shortening the overall length of time for each grow and maximizing the production of their plants.

If someone veges five days or a week or two weeks or three weeks or whatever period of time beyond what their lighting is capable of making the most of, that same period of time would be wiser and more productively used in the vegging of the following crop.

Going big in veg is only worthwhile if you go big with lighting too. If not it is a waste of time, a waste of electricity, a waste of ferts/nutes, and it lengthens the overall time of a grow with little to nothing to show for it.

Click to expand...

I veg my moms only, the rest goes into the system as soon as they are rooted properly. I use a 1000w/hps for budding. For veggin' I use four foot coolwhite flouresents and murcury vapour lightbulbs. Brick Top is correct, aside from your curing problem you don't have the lighting for extensive veggin'. I also skirt my flood and drain table with flouresent tubing so...

Brick Top said:

I have to ask the same question, at least since you said you are using 250-watt HID lighting. Unless you topped multiple times and SCROGed you wasted your time. A 250-watt light only has about 18 inches of penetration so anything below 18 inches from your bulb will be in low light conditions. If you veg past about 8 to 10 inches max every day you veg after that is a waste of time, unless you SCROG, and then then you are pushing the envelope unless you have enough 250-watt lights to adequately cover the area the plants will cover. Most of what you end up with will usually be low quality.

You can easily grow 5 foot plants with 250-watt lighting but they will pretty much be low quality almost all of the time. The tops may be decent, not great, just decent, but once you get below that what you get will be worse and worse even if you keep fresh bulbs burning.

People like to say genetics is everything, heck I used to say the same thing, but in reality genetics is only half of what your final results will be. Top genetics gives you the chance to grow great herb but they do not guarantee high quality. In the end growing conditions count for about 50% of the success or failure of your grow. You said what your humidity level was for drying but do you know what it was during flowering? Low humidity causes increased resin production, which is good, and higher humidity causes less resin production, which is not what growers want.

You might want to consider how you grow if you stick with your current setup or you might want to consider upgrading your setup. If you can step up to a 400-watt HID lighting system, that would be very good. If you can step up to a 600-watt HID lighting system, that would be even better. Keep your temperatures in the mid to upper 70's and keep your humidity low. Use true quality genetics and learn the specific needs for the specific genetics you grow, and not the needs for any of the many knockoff strains that might exist and carry the same name but are genetically different. Keep fresh bulbs in your lights. Keep a good airflow to keep fresh CO2 rich air passing through your plants or add CO2. There is much more ... but that would be a good start.

You said you grew "White Widow" and that you flowered for 10 weeks (68 days.) Whose "White Widow" did you grow? There is the original that was renamed Black Widow and then there are about 25 or 30, or more, knockoff "White Widow" strains. Some have flowering times as short as 55 days, some are as long as 75 days.

What was the color of your trichomes when you harvested, or did you just harvest by the number of days from the breeder information or by visible signs like receding pistils and color of leaves?

Did you wait for much of the THC to oxidize and turn into CBN and have amber to dark amber trichomes? Some "White Widow" knockoffs are mostly sativa and some are mostly indica so you have to know when the "White Widow" strain you grow will reach peak THC levels and harvest then. If you wait longer you will lose THC. If you harvest earlier you will not have reached peak THC levels.

"White Widow" can be one of the most confusing strains for an inexperienced grower to grow. With there being so many genetically different knockoffs out there much advice that is given might be totally correct for the knockoff "White Widow" the person advising grew but it can be horrible advice for the different knockoff "White Widow" the person asking advice is growing.

Click to expand...

see I had no idea that the 250 watt wasnt strong enough for a plant bigger then 18inches....basically my set up is of 2 plants in a 4 gallon dwc res. - If I stay with the 250 watt, I should only veg for a few weeks then?? or do you think its better to get a new light?? Do you think that could be part of the reason why my bud isnt up to par in the end? or am i messing up the drying process... and hows the 2500 watt HPS, is that light not enough for a bigger plant? i attached some pics of my previous crop, it seems to grrow pretty big........the conditions in my grow area the temp is anywhere from 75 to 85 degrees F, and the RH is between 40% to 50%........the seeds i used were ceres white widow, i had bought them from a website called everyone does it .com they seemed to be legit....the breeder information said to harvest between 8-10 weeks, but i harvested when i thought the trichomes were half amber and half cloudy..........If i missed any of your questions i applogize as im new really new to growing....and I really appriciate someone with your reputation takin the time out to check out my posts, any more help you can give it much appriciated

RohanVD86 said:

I have been vegging mine now for about 10 weeks now and have a 3'11'' bush that still is continuing to get bigger. Think about it, the longer you veg. the bigger the plant will be, thus a bigger yield. I have been topping mine to make more branches come out. The more thicker branches you have, the more BIG buds you will have in addition to the little popcorn buds on the lower portion of the plant.

Click to expand...

i hardly ever veg longer than 2 weeks if i even bother, i put my seedlings under a 250 enviro for around a week then under my 250 hps and 400 hps, 10-16 plants all 7-13 oz wet, no point in vegging so long with such small lights,id have 2 crops in the time you do 1

del66666 said:

i hardly ever veg longer than 2 weeks if i even bother, i put my seedlings under a 250 enviro for around a week then under my 250 hps and 400 hps, 10-16 plants all 7-13 oz wet, no point in vegging so long with such small lights,id have 2 crops in the time you do 1

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so since im using a 250 watt mh to veg, I should only veg for about 2-3 weeks then start to flower under the 250 watt hps? does the low wattage of light have anything to do with the out come of the bud, in taste or falvor?? the potency is there, but not the taste....

adam0416 said:

so since im using a 250 watt mh to veg, I should only veg for about 2-3 weeks then start to flower under the 250 watt hps? does the low wattage of light have anything to do with the out come of the bud, in taste or falvor?? the potency is there, but not the taste....

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Try a branch ot two of your bud the way I said with the reverse osmosis water.

Brick Top said:

That makes sense IF someone does not veg so long that they will outgrow their lighting capabilities. The thread starter said he uses 250-watt HID lighting. That will only give adequate light penetration down to about 18 inches from the bulb. Anything below that will be in low light conditions and produce little to nothing and possibly will die off.

If Vegging with MH, especially a 6500K MH, the closest tightest nodal spacing will be at the lower portion of a plant. If someone uses lighting that will not get adequate light to the lower portion of a plant because they vegged to such a tall height the portion of the plant that should produce heavily will either produce poorly or die off. So what is the benefit of vegging that long/tall if someone's lighting cannot make the most of the plant?

Unless someone has adequate lighting for every day they veg past a point where after their plants shoot up in flower they are adding an additional day to the overall length of time of their grow and will receive little to nothing for it. They would be better off vegging for a shorter period of time, shortening the overall length of time for each grow and maximizing the production of their plants.

If someone veges five days or a week or two weeks or three weeks or whatever period of time beyond what their lighting is capable of making the most of, that same period of time would be wiser and more productively used in the vegging of the following crop.

Going big in veg is only worthwhile if you go big with lighting too. If not it is a waste of time, a waste of electricity, a waste of ferts/nutes, and it lengthens the overall time of a grow with little to nothing to show for it.

Click to expand...

Not to thread jack but it might help the OP if he decides to up his lighting. Can you give me an idea of how tall one could veg a plant under say a 400w? 600w? 1000?

adam0416 said:

so since im using a 250 watt mh to veg, I should only veg for about 2-3 weeks then start to flower under the 250 watt hps? does the low wattage of light have anything to do with the out come of the bud, in taste or falvor?? the potency is there, but not the taste....

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taste and quality will be fine but bigger light means heavier bigger bud obviously........