whats the best spectrum

Hosebomber said:

Quoting a source that states itself that "needs improvement" and needs further siting isn't suggested.

Are you saying that a wavelength of light can not perform more than one function? Yes, 730nm has a major part in phytochrome production and the Pf/Pfr states.

Here is a link to 53,800 articles/studies on the Emerson Effect.... greatest performance is with wavelengths greater than 720nm. You know... just like the one you linked before that stated the same thing.

I have come to the full conclusion that you misinterpret/troll everything, due to the few interactions of straight shit you have spewed from your keyboard when you post. I'll disregard you from now on. It gets old proving the village idiot wrong. The best I can hope for is that you pull me down to your level of stupidity and beat my with your vast experience.

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do you even know what the emerson effect is? Basically increases activity of chlorophyll b.

you really need to go back to school. you really have zero comprehension of anything. you cherry pick a few words here and there just to support your so called findings. you call every single person and company out. use wiki as support. That's a joke. from your prior post you obviously didn't read the whole thing. you just copy and pasted the numbers you saw.You obviously did not read the other links or even one of them that fast. Thats impossible..you just argue for the sake of arguing. even in the first study it says how the emmerson effect worked at 653nm . did you skip that one too.

I have such a low tolerance for stupid people like you. on top of it I bet you have never grown anything before and have zero real world experience. I bet you never heard of emerson effect until you saw my post.

btw that first study I posted was from 1964. the other ones are very recent


Also where the hell do you get off calling me a troll. I went over every single one of your posts. Every single one is you arguing and / or trying to correct some one. The majority of them you are clearly wrong. You are the true definition of a troll. I wouldn't be surprised if you get banned from riu..

MH for veg and HPessay for bloom.

Can we agree on what the sun does?

This is purely theoretical based on what I've seen over the last decade.

Yellow penetrates and cooks evenly. Warm white leds do a great job of providing a medium-wide yellow band.

Red sears the top layer, and does not penetrate.

Wavelengths that chlorophyll absorbs the best, penetrates the least. This is a really important relationship to understand. What gets absorbed, obviously doesn't penetrate. Good penetration literally means poor absorption.

Think of yellow like putting your plant in the microwave, while red is putting it in a smoking cast iron pan.

Another, maybe better, analogy is how UV-A penetrates your eye better than UV-B. Your cornea absorbs the UV-B very well, but transmits UV-A well. This means UV-B burns your cornea, but UV-A will damage your retina.

Yellow powers the bottom of the plant, red powers the top.

churchhaze said:

This is purely theoretical based on what I've seen over the last decade.

Yellow penetrates and cooks evenly. Warm white leds do a great job of providing a medium-wide yellow band.

Red sears the top layer, and does not penetrate.

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The reason for the white's is to provide the wave lengths missing from monochromatic led's. Not just for the yellow band. More importantly the green wave lengths. Which drives photosynthesis by helping pigments absorb more photons in other regions.

I disagree about red not penetrating from what I have seen with my own eyes. Of course that also depends on the led and lense if any..

we could probably do with out 480nm -530nm though. thats the region that suppresses melatonin in people , plants and animals. Which is responsible for stress recovery and auxins.

Red doesn't penetrate as well as green or yellow. Think about it. The peak absorption of chloraphyl A is 660nm. If cannabis leafs were theater light filters, they'd be perfect for removing 660nm, assuming it doesn't burn up.

I agree with you that yellow isn't the only important area, but i do think the success of white leds is largely based on the high yellow content. It'd be hard to argue otherwise considering their phosphor is centered around yellow, and it does seem to be working well.

Since yellow also will cause %Pfr to be lower (more phytochrome in the Pr form), it helps to "calibrate" the plant so higher parts of the canopy converge at higher %Pfr than lower parts.

The top level of the canopy gets a greater percentage of red, and thus converges at a higher %Pfr. This causes the shade avoidance effect to grow more like christmas trees.

hyroot said:

The reason for the white's is to provide the wave lengths missing from monochromatic led's. Not just for the yellow band. More importantly the green wave lengths. Which drives photosynthesis by helping pigments absorb more photons in other regions.

I disagree about red not penetrating from what I have seen with my own eyes. Of course that also depends on the led and lense if any..

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churchhaze said:

Red doesn't penetrate as well as green or yellow. Think about it. The peak absorption of chloraphyl A is 660nm. If cannabis leafs were theater light filters, they'd be perfect for removing 660nm, assuming it doesn't burn up.

I agree with you that yellow isn't the only important area, but i do think the success of white leds is largely based on the high yellow content.

Since yellow also will cause %Pfr to be lower (more phytochrome in the Pr form), it helps to "calibrate" the plant so higher parts of the canopy converge at higher %Pfr than lower parts.

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with the peak at 660nm that means chlorophyll A is absorbing more light at 660 and far less light between 500nm - 600nm.


thats why leds can do so much better or equal to hps at half the watts. Leds target those peaks more so than hps

Exactly. The 660nm is absorbs the most, while the 500-600nm light is easily transmitted.

I'm basically attacking people's use of the word "penetration". Penetration (transmittance) is the opposite of absorbance.

660nm light has very poor penetration through chloraphyl A. That's it's main utility, Its poor penetration. It's a feature, not a bug. Poor penetration directly translates into great absorbance.

hyroot said:

with the peak at 660nm that means chlorophyll A is absorbing more light at 660 and far less light between 500nm - 600nm.

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churchhaze said:

Exactly. The 660nm is absorbs the most, while the 500-600nm light is easily transmitted.

I'm basically attacking people's use of the word "penetration". Penetration (transmittance) is the opposite of absorbance.

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ok I meant penetration , like most people as a distance or depth of what light can reach. technically by that definition. Penetration is irrelevant if there is high enough par and cri. Basically why we measure for par.

That's where I disagree. I think the penetration you get from the 500-620nm range is what made HPS kick LED's butt for so many years.

Another part of it is the mediocre %Pfr wavelengths between 500-620nm will cause the plant to converge at. It brings it lower than 660nm, and causes a contrast between upper and lower branches.

hyroot said:

ok I meant penetration , like most people as a distance of light can reach. technically by that defintion. Penetration is irrelevant if there is high enough par and cri.

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@chazbolin needs to step in here

PetFlora said:

HoseB, so now you have an idea what I put up with - my words misinterpreted, 'cause he reads the printed word but draws his own misguided conclusions

Probably missed his English Comprehension classes to get high

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you are so dillusional. Hose b is a professional troll. Pet do I have to repost your posts again to show you the truth. Everyone in here knows you push bml like there is no tomorrow

Re(d)garding ....


Red wls of 640-680 nm are mainly absorbed by the PhotoSystem 1 of each single leaf cell ...
These red wls provide vast numbers of photons ( >4.5 umoles/sec/ Radiant Watt ) which
get absorbed (mainly) by Chlorophyll A .Magnesium atom in the center of the chlorophyll A is
"biased" (with protein(s) ) towards absorbing light maximally at 640-680 nm range.
(Peak ~662nm ,not on alive cells,but measured at dilluted ChA ) ...

PS1 is considered the "High Energy Photosynthetic " system...
For high irradiances ..
For clean bright sky,at noon.
(Water/Vapour absorbs -thus 'filters out' mostly at red/FR wls ...
Under a cloudy sky blue and Green wls dominate (at PAR range ) )

Those wls (640-680 nm ) get highly absorbed by top layers of leaf canopy.
Where the younger leafs / shoots are ...
Older leaves ,are not able to efficiently absorb and use those wls.


Those wls also can cause Photosaturation of the PS1 in no time ...
If exposure is prolonged and or of high irradiances ....

Older leaves have to avoid the exposure ..
Younger (and more photosynthetic efficient ) leaves 'protect' thew older/deeper/lower parts of canopy ,
by absorbing the 'high Power Red wls ..."

Thus they grow like crazy ..

From the other hand ,older leaves have larger photosynthetic area ....
Thus they absorb and utilise very efficiently the Green,Yellow ,Amber and Lower red wls ...
( 500-630 nm )

They can photosynthesise for longer period of time ,than from top -young- canopy and almost in as high irradiances
,but on different wl range... (photons are also less than 640-680 nm range ,per radiant Watt ..But of higher energy each ...
That translates to heat ..Thicker older leaves ? )



The result is that plant(s) 'capture' as many 'energy quanta ' as possible and use them
accordingly -depending on 'quanta' 's characteristics (energy / wl / frequency/ numbers ) ,
to satisfy the different needs ,of different 'parts'- subsystems - of a living organism ....


Plants can adapt of course ...
To light quality and quantity ...
To altitude..
To growing techniques ..
To plenty of things ..

Warm White leds (3000K 80 CRI ) ,
do provide a 5-10% of blue wls ( all what's needed,actually ....)

About 15-20 % green wls ( 520-550 nm )
(pretty useful feature when irradiance (quanta flux ) is over ~300 umol/sec,
if irradiance is less than ~300umol/sec ,then some Shade Avoidance 'kicks in 'and that's
if only illumination used is WW leds ....)

At least 50% of their radiant power is at the range 550-640 nm ....

Some 15-20 % of power at 640-700 nm ....

And 1-3 % at 700-750 nm....

I trust that at average irradiances and above that ...(300 up to 1500-2000 umol/sec )
All what is needed ...

(And probably could not get better ..Ok ..
Maybe some ..Some UVA-UVB ..Maybe ...Some ...)

All what's needed is WW 3000K 80 CRI ....
(Or maybe NW 4000 K + WW 2700 K ,both 80 CRI )<= Another great white combo ...

No blue ,no red ,no NW ,No high CRI ...
Nothin' ...

Blast 'em with 600-800 umols/ sec / m^2 ,of WW 3000K led light ...
And just watch the SSL version of HPS ,how it ' helps' mj to grow thick dense crazy buds ...

So fuckin' simple ,is the best spectrum ...

stardustsailor said:

Re(d)garding ....

Warm White leds (3000K 80 CRI ) ,
do provide a 5-10% of blue wls ( all what's needed,actually ....)

All what's needed is WW 3000K 80 CRI ....
(Or maybe NW 4000 K + WW 2700 K ,both 80 CRI )<= Another great white combo ...

No blue ,no red ,no NW ,No high CRI ...
Nothin' ...

Blast 'em with 600-800 umols/ sec / m^2 ,of WW 3000K led light ...
And just watch the SSL version of HPS ,how it ' helps' mj to grow thick dense crazy buds ...

So fuckin' simple ,is the best spectrum ...

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So.. the A51 XGS -190 has a good configuration for both, vegatacion and bloom ? I had read that was lacking red lights .. but it seems it was not.

Power Source: 72x Warm White 3750k Create XTEAWT XTE -02 -0000- 00000BFF6

MarCus M.D said:

So.. the A51 XGS -190 has a good configuration for both, vegatacion and bloom ? I had read that was lacking red lights .. but it seems it was not.

Power Source: 72x Warm White 3750k Create XTEAWT XTE -02 -0000- 00000BFF6

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To my eyes ,it seems as a rather exceptional panel ...
It lacks absolutely nothing ...
....

Ok ...
Maybe ....
Some more power,would not have been an 'overkill' .
..Just maybe ..

Cheers .