What's up with President Bill Clinton?

NLXSK1 said:
Once the government went into debt and the welfare business, it no longer had the best interest of the people as a goal. Now the federal government works against us for it's own ends. Yes, both D & R and also I and whatever other appelation ends up at the end of the title.
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Agreed. I think it's time for a Constitutional Congress. Every time I hear about how Federal authorities treat citizens, I want to retch.
 
ttystikk said:
Sexist pig. Try refuting it on the merits.

Oh, you can't.

For the record, I have a penis and I know how to use it.
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I did refute it on the merits, but that was never going to be enough. She is saying congress should be payed min wage and that's that. It's best I moved on.

Not sure what your penis has to do with mine and sky's conversation, but if you feel the need to stick it in, I would ask first.
 
ginwilly said:
I did refute it on the merits, but that was never going to be enough. She is saying congress should be payed min wage and that's that. It's best I moved on.

Not sure what your penis has to do with mine and sky's conversation, but if you feel the need to stick it in, I would ask first.
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I didn't want to be mistaken for female, lest I get the same sexist treatment.

To be fair, I'm all about median- not mean, or average, but fiftieth percentile wages for Congress and Senate office holders- as a direct method of ensuring they gain an understanding of what 'middle America' actually IS, and what this class of people actually has to deal with.
 
ttystikk said:
I didn't want to be mistaken for female, lest I get the same sexist treatment.

To be fair, I'm all about median- not mean, or average, but fiftieth percentile wages for Congress and Senate office holders- as a direct method of ensuring they gain an understanding of what 'middle America' actually IS, and what they have to deal with.
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Your idea would have merit if it mattered. Most members of the Senate are millionaires already. Many members of the congress and senate become vastly more wealthy while they are in office. It is because people buy influence. Many ways it can be completely legal.

You are looking at a symptom of the problem and attempting to treat the symptom rather than the actual disease.

The federal congress and senate have wayyyy too much power. They perverted the commerce clause to give them influence over every aspect of our lives.

That power and influence brings in money legal or not. You have to diminish the power and influence they have over busineses and life and then the demand to pay them for the influence lessens and the corruption lessens.

Until you take the power away the money will find a pocket.
 
ttystikk said:
I didn't want to be mistaken for female, lest I get the same sexist treatment.

To be fair, I'm all about median- not mean, or average, but fiftieth percentile wages for Congress and Senate office holders- as a direct method of ensuring they gain an understanding of what 'middle America' actually IS, and what this class of people actually has to deal with.
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You keep focusing on salaries when it's actually less than most professional people make. Most of our representatives took a reduction in salary to serve.

Focus on the bribes. Why should my salary even matter to me if I can get millions in "campaign donations"?

Edit: NLXS beat me to it and said it better.
 
ttystikk said:
Agreed. I think it's time for a Constitutional Congress. Every time I hear about how Federal authorities treat citizens, I want to retch.
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And you only hear about the bad stuff. You just have to be careful. It's like working with rattlesnakes.

Of course, the worse I have been treated lately was by the Canadian Border guys. It was like Full Metal Jacket.

California? Nothing but gun nuts in California. You a gun nut? You have guns in the car, youhavegunsathome? <grrrrrrrr>

......,...... .....No Sir.

OK then. Welcome to Canada.
 
ttystikk said:
Excellent points, though I think it would be constructive for the Senate's salary to be set at the national median (50th percentile) wage. Then they would have to budget and plan like the rest of us.
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Of course, did anyone mention "...and Benefits for Life?" When you get elected you are granted a pension, as well, as soon as you leave office.
 
Doer said:
Of course, did anyone mention "...and Benefits for Life?" When you get elected you are granted a pension, as well, as soon as you leave office.
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The intention behind that was to keep people from needing to serve for life. Didn't work.

Another problem is when politics become the family business. We've seen seats passed on to the surviving spouse (in MI), we have 3rd, 4th and 5th generation reps.

We have lots of things we need to correct, the salaries are the least of my concern. I know physician assistants making more money.
 
Doer said:
And you only hear about the bad stuff. You just have to be careful. It's like working with rattlesnakes.

Of course, the worse I have been treated lately was by the Canadian Border guys. It was like Full Metal Jacket.

California? Nothing but gun nuts in California. You a gun nut? You have guns in the car, youhavegunsathome? <grrrrrrrr>

......,...... .....No Sir.

OK then. Welcome to Canada.
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Be thankful you aren't a popular musician.

Go to 1h21m for the Canada Customs routine.
 
heckler73 said:
Be thankful you aren't a popular musician.

Go to 1h21m for the Canada Customs routine.
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Love me some Zappa.

At 19 I lived 10 minutes from Canada and could drink there. We went in a friend's custom van one time and when the border agent stuck his nose in he said something smells funny. My buddy said under his breath, I didn't notice till you came in. We got the naked bend over treatment and the van was stripped. They left every cabinet and seat outside the van and told us OK, you can go. We had to put everything back together. Yes, we were humbled.
 
NLXSK1 said:
Your idea would have merit if it mattered. Most members of the Senate are millionaires already. Many members of the congress and senate become vastly more wealthy while they are in office. It is because people buy influence. Many ways it can be completely legal.

You are looking at a symptom of the problem and attempting to treat the symptom rather than the actual disease.

The federal congress and senate have wayyyy too much power. They perverted the commerce clause to give them influence over every aspect of our lives.

That power and influence brings in money legal or not. You have to diminish the power and influence they have over busineses and life and then the demand to pay them for the influence lessens and the corruption lessens.

Until you take the power away the money will find a pocket.
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I completely agree with your assessment. The suggestion about pay has to do with setting a precedent, and an expectation that we are all citizens, that some of us are not more equal merely because we've scammed our way in with buckets of cash.

I think the idea that a corporation can give money to politicians to be a cancer on the soul of our nation- one that will surely destroy us all if it isn't stopped.

So- no campaign contributions AT ALL from corporations, on pain of the C level executives and anyone else responsible going to prison for a nice long stay.

And while we're at it, let's close the country club system. Prison should be the same for everyone. If the zillionaires knew they'd be stuck in a cell with Big Bubba, maybe that would help convince them not to commit malfeasance in the first place.

Egalitarianism is decried as a bad thing only by those who think they're more equal.
 
ginwilly said:
You keep focusing on salaries when it's actually less than most professional people make. Most of our representatives took a reduction in salary to serve.

Focus on the bribes. Why should my salary even matter to me if I can get millions in "campaign donations"?

Edit: NLXS beat me to it and said it better.
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Check my response to his post, above. I dunno if it's 'better', but it would at least change the attitude of entitlement. That has to be a good thing.
 
ttystikk said:
I think the idea that a corporation can give money to politicians to be a cancer on the soul of our nation- one that will surely destroy us all if it isn't stopped.

So- no campaign contributions AT ALL from corporations, on pain of the C level executives and anyone else responsible going to prison for a nice long stay.
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Try this and see if it makes sense.

I think the idea that a politician can accept bribes from anyone to be a cancer on the soul of our nation. When the people who make the laws do so dependent on how big the legal bribery is, it will surely destroy us if it isn't stopped.

We see the same symptoms, we disagree on the cause.
 
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