1000w vert room question

[MrMeanGreen]

I remember that thread about the automatic plant movers, back in '12. I thought it was decided to be a waste of time yield wise.
https://www.rollitup.org/t/is-plant-rotation-really-necessary.703013/
So you would need to figure out the rotation as well as how long each part of the plant was exposed to the light.

I gorra stop smokin dis shit. Now that I read it, I remember it, could I remember it before?

hands on experience is invaluable and qualifies any poster to give advise but the smallest difference in grow conditions can produce 2 totally different oucomes , I doubt we would get the same results if we grew the same.. I am on an ever increasing yield and I know exactly (nearly exactly ish) how I got here and why, I know what works and what don't in my environment and will always push for more. The vibe I got from that thread was vert old timers getting a bit protective because they have been there, got the T shirt, didn't do too great and moved on. No offence intended lads, just sayin. That doesn't make a revisit with a fresh mind, wrong .

There are a lot of options with esposure times and rotations, I might be a while.

 

[m4s73r]

I gorra stop smokin dis shit. Now that I read it, I remember it, could I remember it before?

The vibe I got from that thread was vert old timers getting a bit protective because they have been there, got the T shirt, didn't do too great and moved on. No offence intended lads, just sayin. That doesn't make a revisit with a fresh mind, wrong .

There are a lot of options with esposure times and rotations, I might be a while.

I felt the same way. Any time someone says, "ill try it for a grow!" i just laugh and shake my head. Try it for a year, then come talk to me.

 

[ttystikk]

I would looooove to be proven wrong about plants on carousels.

 

[ttystikk]

Here's my problem with carousels, however; I've already done something very similar with light rotators and it didn't work out.

Help me understand what's different about this approach?

 

[MrMeanGreen]

Here's my problem with carousels, however; I've already done something very similar with light rotators and it didn't work out.

Help me understand what's different about this approach?

It dawned on me last night that this is a moot debate and we are both singing from the same hymn sheet. I move the plants, you move the light. Same same no difference. We go vert for increased canopy size, my logic is applying the silo principle to all of my plants to doubles my canopy size again. Like I said earlier, my canopy is 150ft or there abouts in a room 8x8x6. For me, the challenge now is getting as much light spread around as possible.

other bonuses

I can swap and change my plants as i choose, move the whole thing if needed.
less intensive LST and vegging. (scrogging)
access to every part of every plant, any time.
better air circulation.
Easier at chop time.
Zero heat stress.... ever.

There will be many more reasons but guess what, stoned again and brain only running at 60%.

 

[legallyflying]

Let me start by saying that i have tried just about every type of grow out there (besides the ridiculous carousels and what not) and vertical gives the best results BY FAR. We just pulled a little over 37 elbows from an 18 bulb vert room.

Here is my take on your proposed design...it won't work without air conditioning of some sort.

A thousand watt putts off a LOT of heat. Yes, a small office fan on the floor will effectively get rid of the heat in a normal size room but not with your ceiling heights. It's going to get HOT as fuck in there.

The second issue is plant height. You better flip when there 12" tall or they will be scrapping the ceiling in no time. Or be prepared to hit them with phosphoload to limit height.

Our final plants are about 12" from the bulbs at the closest. They average about 18"-20". The buds nearest the bulb are a TINY bit less frosty but the increase in yield is worth it.

I think you should really really really think about using a 600.

Good luck

 

[rickymac21]

Let me start by saying that i have tried just about every type of grow out there (besides the ridiculous carousels and what not) and vertical gives the best results BY FAR. We just pulled a little over 37 elbows from an 18 bulb vert room.

Here is my take on your proposed design...it won't work without air conditioning of some sort.

A thousand watt putts off a LOT of heat. Yes, a small office fan on the floor will effectively get rid of the heat in a normal size room but not with your ceiling heights. It's going to get HOT as fuck in there.

The second issue is plant height. You better flip when there 12" tall or they will be scrapping the ceiling in no time. Or be prepared to hit them with phosphoload to limit height.

Our final plants are about 12" from the bulbs at the closest. They average about 18"-20". The buds nearest the bulb are a TINY bit less frosty but the increase in yield is worth it.

I think you should really really really think about using a 600.

Good luck

With all do respect man, i think your firing answers at me qithout knowing all the facts. .
As for the heat, if you read one of my posts you qould see that the ambient temp is always between 60~70 depending on the time of year. . this cool air constantly being brought in the grow will help.
Also their will be more than a single office fan blowing air up. If i were relying on that to remove heat, yea id be toasted. Along with that fan blowing up on yhe bulb, ill have my can fan 6" pro pulling heat out directly above the bulb..
Ive also decided to make the room length and width to 7'x7' to make the heat more controlable.
Now as for plant height, your just guessing honestly. You dont know what strains i have , period.(All indica dominant)... Nor did you read that i would be using screens to control growth direction..
If i flowered at 12" id be wasting my time and money..

Im not doubting your knowledge. I think you just failed to see all the facts...

 

[legallyflying]

Fair enough. And BTW I was talking 12" of plant height..you have another 8-10" in container height.

Anyways..the ceiling mounted extraction fan is a great idea but I would suggest getting a powered inlet fan as well or you will NOT move enough air.

You don't have much volume and airflow is going to be pretty restricted by your canopy.

The standard convention is powered inlet of the same size or passive inlet that is 3x-4x the size of your outlet.

Even my indicas grow 1.5 times their height when I flip..but then again that is in RDWC. I would imagine soil stretch would be much less (but your going to induce stretch with hot days and cold nights)

A Dehu set to run when the lights are off can help reduce the effects of temp differential

 

[m4s73r]

Fair enough. And BTW I was talking 12" of plant height..you have another 8-10" in container height.

Anyways..the ceiling mounted extraction fan is a great idea but I would suggest getting a powered inlet fan as well or you will NOT move enough air.

You don't have much volume and airflow is going to be pretty restricted by your canopy.

The standard convention is powered inlet of the same size or passive inlet that is 3x-4x the size of your outlet.

Even my indicas grow 1.5 times their height when I flip..but then again that is in RDWC. I would imagine soil stretch would be much less (but your going to induce stretch with hot days and cold nights)

A Dehu set to run when the lights are off can help reduce the effects of temp differential

It is unfortunate that you dont have a 6ft ceiling. A 1000 watt will properly light a 5 ft plant. 600 will do a 4ft. Your bulb size has more to do with your ceiling then your horizontal space.

Rather then a dehu, just get a humidty/thermometer controller for the fans. Less power draw, more efficient. but in most cases if you have a 6inch fan and a speed controller this is unnecessary. Just turn the fan up, you only have 220 cf. A 440 fan with a inlet of 12 inches (2 6" ports) should be good. But dont quote on me on that. Never dealt with a short ceiling.

And to be honest with only 220 cf of space, I wouldnt run more then a 600 watt. If your ceiling was 6.5 ft or so, then id jump on the 1000. But with a 1000 in a 7x7x4.5 id run a 8 inch fan. 720 cfm. id rather have more fan then i need then not enough. And your going to need some time to dial that room in temp wise. But thats why were here, to help. lol

 

[rickymac21]

Looks like i have a lot of crap tp sell off then. Haha.
Ill go ahead and get myself a 10" fan to use directly above the bulb, pulling air up and out. Ill duct this elsewhere in the house to keep ambient temps as low as possible. Then just a box fan on the ground blowing up on the bulb.
Then for the inlet i could use a single 8" fan to bring cool air in.

An idea struck me though. What if i use the 6" fan under the bulb? Have it ducted under the grow room pulling in fresh air blowing up directly passed the bulb. Then the higher cfm 10" fan still on top pulling air out of the tent. This would create a more direct funnel of air passing the bulb, thus reducing radiated heat. The 6" would act as a booster fan basically since the 10" fan above would have a much higher cfm rating. Of course a 6" ~ 8" inlet fan would be used to bring in cool air as well.. What do you think ? Useful or trouble ?

 

[m4s73r]

I wouldnt do that. And the reason is your air intake is also your co2 replacement. im afraid if you put the fans/ducting so close the surrounding air wouldnt get cycled as well. but tbh, that is part of dialing in your room. you will know that answer with-in a light cycle. your plants will let you know as well. id have my intake as far from my out as possible.

 

[rickymac21]

I wouldnt do that. And the reason is your air intake is also your co2 replacement. im afraid if you put the fans/ducting so close the surrounding air wouldnt get cycled as well. but tbh, that is part of dialing in your room. you will know that answer with-in a light cycle. your plants will let you know as well. id have my intake as far from my out as possible.

Yea i tried to mention in my last post that there would be a 2nd intake fan. But i worded it funny i guess. . .
So ..
1 10" fan above the bulb pulling air out
1 6" fan below the bulb pushing air up
1 6" fan at the side of room bringing in fresh air.

Or would using both 6" fans as intakes work better as originally stated.

 

[m4s73r]

i see what u did there.
TBO, no idea. never done it. but the principal is the fan under the light runs at such a low speed that all its doing is giving a slight assist to natural heat rise.

 

[rickymac21]

i see what u did there.
TBO, no idea. never done it. but the principal is the fan under the light runs at such a low speed that all its doing is giving a slight assist to natural heat rise.

Well here's my thought process.
The bulb is the only thing creating heat within the grow room. Of course. So the idea is to remove that heat as quickly as possible. Ideally everyone would use a cooltube because it isolates the heat into a smaller air space. Making it easy to remove the heat before it has a chance to warm the room.But the loss of useable light yada yada. So the next thing you do is think how you can isolate the air around the bulb without glass. So you put the 10" fan above the bare bulb, and pull that heat right out. But that wasnt working well enough because the fan was pulling air in from all directions. So you add the box fan under the bulb to blow up towards the outlet fan. This creates a small wind tunnel and helped. But that fan is large and the air flow is now concentrated. So the air blowing on the bulb is wamed and blown through out the room. Thus increasing temps. But if the fan underneath is an inline fan ducted from outside the room and blows up pass the bulb, it creates a much more compact and 'isolated' airspace. So the heat is relativley trapped and sucked straight out the top.
Its like if your roof had a leak. You dont just put a bucket down permantly and call it fixed. (ok maybe the first couple days.). You find the source of the leak to stop it altogether.
Same principal. If the heat source can be managed by itself, thats a lot more efficient than removing the heat from the whole room.
But if you read all that, kudos lol my bad for the book. Im just gonna try it, post pictures and feedback when its tested. How about that. Hah

 

[ttystikk]

You answered your own question; don't just blow the heat around in the room, get rid of it. But how? If you're venting your room, fine. What's the intake bringing in? If that's not cool enough, there's your problem. If you're actively cooling your room, even better. Make sure it's getting rid of more heat than everything in your room is generating.

The weather is turning cold, so venting from outside is an option.

 

[rickymac21]

Well the good news is the grow room now has a height of about 7 ft. Which is just awesome. That will help with the temp control and allow for slightly larger ladies.

 

[Flagg420]

7ft? Fuck it, use the cool tubes, but stack like 3 of them, or rig a double ender n run 4 bulbs vert!

Let there be trees!
Grow a plant that could beat up Audrey II....
(I'm sorry if your all too young to get that)

 

[ttystikk]

I got your trees right here, buddy-

 

[rickymac21]

Isnt that trellis on the wrong side of the plant . lol . that is a nice large ladie though.

 

[ttystikk]

Isnt that trellis on the wrong side of the plant . lol . that is a nice large ladie though.

No.