Can someone list some benefits of vertical growing?

nomofatum

nomofatum

Well-Known Member
He has a point. For a vertical design to make sense you need more than just an overhead light. You need side lighting or lighting levels at the bottom of the plant will be but a fraction of what the top of the plant receives. Longer/bigger grows need different lighting designs than short bush grows. Side lighting would be a must for a vertical grow, IMHO, just conceptually(scientifically thinking), haven't tried a vert yet.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
zor said:
I didn't mean to imply that vert grows have TOO low of a light level intensity. I'm alluding to the fact that with a reflector, you have MORE light intensity at a given distance from a bulb. With a reflector, you are concentrating more light into a smaller canopy (albeit your losing some of that intensity to the reflector as well.) This is not to say that one way is better, i personally have had both shitty and good grows with both styles. There's a trade off when you increase the canopy size (whether it be a horizontal or vertical grow). Whether or not the trade off is worth it is in the hands of the grower. Some people kill it with more watts/ft of canopy and others kill it with more less watts/ft of canopy.

In summation, vertical growing no doubt gets you more canopy area AND more efficiency from the bulb than when using a reflector. However, ime, its up to the skills of the grower to leverage this fact for more yields.. hope that makes sense.
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Leveraging efficiency for yields is the name of the game.

Still, I've never seen someone be unable to get a desired watts/lumens per unit of surface area just due to its vertical nature.

If the wattage is low, the silo shrinks and surface area is effectively managed. If wattage is high, two options have been proven effective; either increase diameter to increase surface area out move the lamp up and down to achieve the same thing- or even a bit of both.

There is at least as much inherent versatility to vertical systems as there is in flatlander grows- and I'll be willing to bet more, because we're finally working in 3D.

Case in point; my own silos are 5' dia x pi = 16' x 6' tall = 96 ft². Lit by two HPS thouies, that's 2kW/100= 20w/ft²... yet no part of the trellis is ever more than 36" from a filament, and usually closer to 30". And then they stretch to within a foot, lol

I realize that's a lot less than the 50w/ft² recommended by overhead fixture manufacturers, but you'll notice they never, ever compare their hoods to a bare bulb. The simple explanation is that bare lamps are so much better than a sealed flashlight box that they'd be embarrassed by the comparison- and lose sales!
 
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ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
nomofatum said:
He has a point. For a vertical design to make sense you need more than just an overhead light. You need side lighting or lighting levels at the bottom of the plant will be but a fraction of what the top of the plant receives. Longer/bigger grows need different lighting designs than short bush grows. Side lighting would be a must for a vertical grow, IMHO, just conceptually(scientifically thinking), haven't tried a vert yet.
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And in fact the whole advantage to vertical growing is the ability to light the plant from the side instead of from above. This is an advantage because you'll get more working surface area than with horizontal approaches.
 
nomofatum

nomofatum

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
And in fact the whole advantage to vertical growing is the ability to light the plant from the side instead of from above. This is an advantage because you'll get more working surface area than with horizontal approaches.
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I imagine a room lined in T5HO bulbs on all sides but the floor would be ideal. Or a grid of LEDs in similar arrangement.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
nomofatum said:
I imagine a room lined in T5HO bulbs on all sides but the floor would be ideal. Or a grid of LEDs in similar arrangement.
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For a taste of how that might look, check out @RM3 and his grow chamber; it's basically a three sided 'coffinbox' of 4' HO T5 bulbs, alternating in spectra to get the perfect mix. Shit is tighter than a snare drum.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
nomofatum said:
And make the plant supports out of rope lights? Am I going too far yet?
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As long as they emit good spectrum and don't get hot... lol

I have watched the LED lighting industry go for ever higher wattages of chips in an effort to match the light intensity of other sources.

This is good, but it makes me wonder about the opposite; if you could run blankets full of cool quarter or half watt LEDs covering the plants- yes, in contact with leaves and growing sites- you could put light exactly wherever you want it. I'm even envisioning tubular light condoms for big colas!

How's THAT for far out?! And yet, I'll guarantee it's possible. I just couldn't say whether it would be effective...
 
nomofatum

nomofatum

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
As long as they emit good spectrum and don't get hot... lol

I have watched the LED lighting industry go for ever higher wattages of chips in an effort to match the light intensity of other sources.

This is good, but it makes me wonder about the opposite; if you could run blankets full of cool quarter or half watt LEDs covering the plants- yes, in contact with leaves and growing sites- you could put light exactly wherever you want it. I'm even envisioning tubular light condoms for big colas!

How's THAT for far out?! And yet, I'll guarantee it's possible. I just couldn't say whether it would be effective...
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There are a bunch of them that are actually in good spectrums. The 3000k and 6500k leds emit a spectrum that is wonderful for plant growth. I'm not going vert, so I don't expect any use in the idea, but the only space you aren't lighting well with the coffin is the middle (between plants), if it's big enough to have a middle. It's either strip/rope lights or some mystical looking orbs,lol, to bring us back to optimal.

If you pick the right light you can hit 120/lm watt and they are small enough to be in direct contact.
 
Joedank

Joedank

Well-Known Member
i set up lights both ways and my greenhouse management books put a 1000w in a 8x8' zone as a primary light source and put 10'x10' as secondary (wintersun assisted) source. i know the inverse sq law says blablabla but from experience.... 8'foot sq for 1000w horizontal is ok BUT due to the LARGE NATURE of DEEP rooted cannabis .
a 1000 WATT fixture on a 4ft light track in your greenhouse with the blackout tarps down is sososososo much better.
but you gotta plan ahead or bak into horizontal REFLECTED light they go....
 
meetjoeblow

meetjoeblow

Well-Known Member
I know Im kinda late but I would love to chime in....
pros
horizontal lighting gives you ALOT more coverage like literally more than double.
better yields
and a better heat distribution.
its also easier to run different genetics because you don't have to worry about canopy height variations
but
(cons)
horizontal grows are more difficult. and sometimes the plants stretch beyond the capacity of one bulb so you will see a lot of growers utilizing two. one hanging lower than the other.
the plants need a different prune as well imo. since the back of the plant doesn't receive light you have to ,or rather you should, prune all back branches (and when I say back im reffering to the edge for those planning to use more than 2 lights). and since the front stalks grow towards the lights big front stalks would force you to move the plant back which would put the side branches at a disadvantage (whom out number the front stalks so it doesn't really make since to keep em).
this makes it harder to apply techniques such as fimming, lst, or even a simple toping can become complex..

but in my opinion, if you can get the pruning techniques down, and set up a vertical scrogg to go along with it, your yields would go to the moon
 
listmann

listmann

Well-Known Member
Damn good thread! you guys pretty much have me convinced. Been thinking bout vert growing maybe beeing an advantage for years but never had the courage to try. Besides i am not shure my tent is suitable :(

I run a 1.2*1,2 metre tent (2metres high)
Its perfect for a horizontal grow and i've been perfecting the technique for years. I usually pull like 500 grames of dried flower, sometimes even 600! (Sometimes only 400)

Dooing a little math that tent would be too small for a vertical grow am i right?

Cant help but think the plants would need to much room from the sides of the wall and grow to close in on the light even i i DO use a cool tube (wich i do)

This whole thing is VERY interesting but i will ned some more gram/w testimonials on 600w hps because from this thread i find numbers hard to believe...
How much gram/w of good TOTALLY cured and dried bud (exclusing the mini buds too small to smoke) is it realistic to pull in a vert with a 600w light and what should the optimum room/tent size be? I am thinking something along the lines of 150*150cm and 2 metres high. (Yes i know i calculate in metres im sorry, european lol.)

My room is big enough only for two 1.2*1.2 metre tents OR one 2*2 metre tent.

I pull 800 - 1000 grams of dried bud total in the two tents - using 600w each ofcourse.

Would it be an advantage to get a 2*2 metre tent 2 metres high, get 1000w in the middle and do a vert? And if, how big of an advantage do you suppose? As opposed to my current setup?

Shit nevermind i am making a new post on it :-)
 
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B

brimck325

Well-Known Member
That would be average. There was another plant I didn't weigh due to it being seeded...on purpose. 2 lbs. is attainable if using multiple lights.
 
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