Tissue culture and cannabis?

[MikeGanja]

Hi,
I found some information on a cloning method called "tissue culture" or "tissue cloning". It has been around for some years and it looks like a possible alternative to normal cloning:

I am just curious why we don´t hear much from this method in cannabis growing. Is it because it doesn´t work or is it because normal cloning works perfect with better results?
Do you know of anybody using the tissue culture method for cloning cannabis?

 

[mudballs]

cost is astronomical for normal growers. it's not as simple as getting some agar plates and going to town on em.

 

[MikeGanja]

Ok! When something sounds to good to be true...

 

[mudballs]

add to the fact that going from cell culture to something you can put in the soil is like 6 months.

 

[MikeGanja]

6 month? Monstergardens.com did not mention the timeline in this product:

https://www.monstergardens.com/Propagation-and-Cloning/Tissue-Culture-Kits-And-Accessories/Plant-Tissue-Culture-Microclone-Kit

They did mention:

Why Micropropagation?
- Replaces Mother Plants
- No Bugs, Pest, or Care required
- Greater multiplication
- Super starts
- Vigorous, bushy plantlets
- Less space and light (eliminate your mother room)
- Unlock hidden genetics
- Jars make transportation easy and shippable
- Easy and fun


I liked the idea of eliminating the mother room and get rid of bugs but 6 month is a very long time. I guess that I after a full cycle would have plants in all stages. But doing that would mean that I still have all the problems with bugs. The only benefit would be no motherplant.

Your information have saved me $ 190.

 

[mudballs]

looks like they've come a long way from lab to diy since i looked into it. only thing that makes that remotely attractive is the 'unlocking genetics' issue and i'm not sold on that without getting back into researching it. i thought it was always a duplicate like a clone. hey if you have the expendable income go for it. but i think you're beginning to see why its got a large price tag. like any hobby that kit is just to get your foot in the door.

 

[Native Humboldt]

I experimented with tissue culture a couple of years ago and belong to a forum on the subject. Its not very expensive to get set up the forum will supply you with everything except the container and charcoal filter for around a hundred bucks. The people on the forum are so intelligent on the subject it's amazing and there are no rude comments or assholes on the site. I used a 20 gallon fish tank that I bought off CL for 10 bucks. I was able to culture roses, blueberry's , and orchards but I'll be dammed if I could find the right mix of vitamins to get the MMJ to take. The key to tissue culture is a sterile environment and the perfect combo of a vitamin mix to feed the plants while keeping them in a suspended life cycle. Most plants have a formula that is proven to work if you follow the directions to the letter they will tissue culture perfect. I messed around with it for over a year then got frustrated and gave the whole set up away.

 

[MikeGanja]

Mudballs, I agree. It looks like the process probably could be made at home to a somewhat reasonable cost but the kits like the one in the link doesn't guarantee a successful clone with cannabis. I would be more convinced if Bill Graham show us examples with cannabis instead of redwood.

Native Humboldt, great news that I could get the needed equipment for $ 100. It's less then half the price I found so far.. Sorry to hear that you didn't succeed in finding a working formula for cannabis.

Some Asian scientists have published a study on tissue cloning of cannabis. Do you think it can be useful for growers like us? --> http://www.pakbs.org/pjbot/PDFs/41(2)/PJB41(2)603.pdf

 

[Native Humboldt]

Yes I think

Mudballs, I agree. It looks like the process probably could be made at home to a somewhat reasonable cost but the kits like the one in the link doesn't guarantee a successful clone with cannabis. I would be more convinced if Bill Graham show us examples with cannabis instead of redwood.

Native Humboldt, great news that I could get the needed equipment for $ 100. It's less then half the price I found so far.. Sorry to hear that you didn't succeed in finding a working formula for cannabis.

Some Asian scientists have published a study on tissue cloning of cannabis. Do you think it can be useful for growers like us? --> http://www.pakbs.org/pjbot/PDFs/41(2)/PJB41(2)603.pdf[/QUOTE

Yes I do think it would be helpful because 100 tissue cultures cuts could be kept long term in a 3 " x 21/2" jar. Just think how many different strains you could keep in a shoe box size area. I might give it another shot later on at some point.

 

[mudballs]

Mudballs, I agree. It looks like the process probably could be made at home to a somewhat reasonable cost but the kits like the one in the link doesn't guarantee a successful clone with cannabis. I would be more convinced if Bill Graham show us examples with cannabis instead of redwood.

Native Humboldt, great news that I could get the needed equipment for $ 100. It's less then half the price I found so far.. Sorry to hear that you didn't succeed in finding a working formula for cannabis.

Some Asian scientists have published a study on tissue cloning of cannabis. Do you think it can be useful for growers like us? --> http://www.pakbs.org/pjbot/PDFs/41(2)/PJB41(2)603.pdf

i reviewed that and all that paper describes is the most expensive method to root clones.
native humbolt has the most pertinent info to proceed. sterilization and proper vitamins mix.
i'm gonna send you to this thread
https://www.rollitup.org/t/scarholes-root-pruning-sex-reversal-method-for-fem-seeds.853829/
in this thread scarhole discusses a prominent breeder culturing root cuttings. if you go down that rabbit hole you might find a way of just taking a cutting from a root and growing a plant.imagine how many more clones you could get from a mother? i'm fascinated by it but not in a position to pursue it at the moment.

 

[RM3]

Wanna get serious ,,,,,,,

http://www.christian-marijuana.org/Downloads/Miscellaneous/TheBiotechnologyOfCannabisSativa.pdf

https://www.dmt-nexus.me/users/cosmicspore/The_Biotechnology_of_Cannabis_sativa_2nd_edition.pdf

 

[Uncle Ben]

15 years ago I dicussed "mericloning" (cloning from meristem tissue) with a few Dutch growers and seedbanks. They weren't interested. It's far easier and profitable to sell and mail seeds.

25 - 30 years ago I focused my orchid purchases on AOS awarded mericlones. Probably 80% of my orchid collection were mericlones, the best of the best.

 

[MikeGanja]

Thank you mudballs and RM3 for great links and documents. I think you have answered my questions on tissue cloning and cannabis. It looks very interesting.

Perhaps not the most economic way to produce clones but I like the idea of having the favourite strains in agar instead of motherplants. And the concept is really fascinating.

 

[MikeGanja]

15 years ago I dicussed "mericloning" (cloning from meristem tissue) with a few Dutch growers and seedbanks. They weren't interested. It's far easier and profitable to sell and mail seeds.

25 - 30 years ago I focused my orchid purchases on AOS awarded mericlones. Probably 80% of my orchid collection were mericlones, the best of the best.

I have seen a lot of info on tissue cloning of orchids. Is tissue cloning used in the orchids industry because it's difficult to grow orchids from seed? Culturing roses and orchids must be the most beautiful cover for a grow op.

 

[SnapsProvolone]

http://skunkpharmresearch.com/tissue-culture/

 

[Daub Marley]

Tissue culture is just micro-cloning. It's more time consuming and expensive than regular cloning, but you can produce much more with less stock and you can remove disease and viruses. It really depends on which ones though because some are easy and others require more equipment, knowledge, and experience to remove. You cannot change the degradation of DNA with tissue culture. It will not revitalize the genetics of your old mothers and it will not replace them.

 

[Uncle Ben]

I have seen a lot of info on tissue cloning of orchids. Is tissue cloning used in the orchids industry because it's difficult to grow orchids from seed? Culturing roses and orchids must be the most beautiful cover for a grow op.

About the same difficulty. With cloning, you get a genetically identical plant, or rather a bunch of them like 50 at a time.

 

[Native Humboldt]

Tissue culture is just micro-cloning. It's more time consuming and expensive than regular cloning, but you can produce much more with less stock and you can remove disease and viruses. It really depends on which ones though because some are easy and others require more equipment, knowledge, and experience to remove. You cannot change the degradation of DNA with tissue culture. It will not revitalize the genetics of your old mothers and it will not replace them.

Tissue culture is just micro-cloning. It's more time consuming and expensive than regular cloning, but you can produce much more with less stock and you can remove disease and viruses. It really depends on which ones though because some are easy and others require more equipment, knowledge, and experience to remove. You cannot change the degradation of DNA with tissue culture. It will not revitalize the genetics of your old mothers and it will not replace them.

If I remember correctly tissue culture does restore the plants original characteristics. Its been a couple of years since I have studied tissue culture but I seem to remember reading that. I'm thinking about trying it out again this year just to see if I can get some plants to survive for a few months and then growing them out while documenting the results. Anyway it sounds fun to give it another shot, you guys inspired me I guess....

 

[Uncle Ben]

Anyway it sounds fun to give it another shot, you guys inspired me I guess....

You have a $200,000 lab complete with centrifuge, etc?

 

[Native Humboldt]

You have a $200,000 lab complete with centrifuge, etc?

No I have a small sterile home set up, I learned from a tissue culture group a couple of years ago. My wife and I have had really good success with roses and blue berries but I just couldn't get the mix right for cannabis. It would survive for a month maybe 6 weeks then the whole dish would die off. I got frustrated after several tries and lent my set up to a friend who has had a little better success than I had but still isn't there yet. I'm not sure where the $200,000 price tag came from, but yes if I needed one and was motivated I would buy it!