Finding A Second Light For My Flowering Room

[JohnCee]

Currently, I am running a Mars Hydro 192x5 Reflector in a 4x4x6 room and it only feels to be lighting about a quarter of the room effectively. I currently run 1x 5gal bucket under it and I feel there is not enough room for a second one to grow effectively.. as seen from this old picture below:

I wanted to run 3-4 girls in there at once, but I didn't know what kind of light to purchase to run in conjunction with what I already have. Think two of the same units rather high and in the middle of the room would be a good idea?

I should mention that I only have roughly a $200-$250 budget here.

 

[Stephenj37826]

Currently, I am running a Mars Hydro 192x5 Reflector in a 4x4x6 room and it only feels to be lighting about a quarter of the room effectively. I currently run 1x 5gal bucket under it and I feel there is not enough room for a second one to grow effectively.. as seen from this old picture below:

I wanted to run 3-4 girls in there at once, but I didn't know what kind of light to purchase to run in conjunction with what I already have. Think two of the same units rather high and in the middle of the room would be a good idea?

I should mention that I only have roughly a $200-$250 budget here.

On that budget I would go for a Digilume de setup if you have 220v access.

 

[JohnCee]

On that budget I would go for a Digilume de setup if you have 220v access.

And run something like that in conjunction with my current panel?

 

[az2000]

And run something like that in conjunction with my current panel?

You can use your Mars as supplmental light, or side light, or a backup. If your Mars is 380w (actual), that should cover about 7.5 sq ft in flower (50w/sq ft).

That's the problem with inexpensive epi-whatever lights like Mars. You have to use almost as much light as HID, but you pay more. The 1000w digulme should cover 16sq ft (62w/sq ft) for less than you spent for the Mars.

If you wanted to step up a little (save a little money to get there) a CMH would be a better choice in terms of efficiency. They run cooler, less w/sq ft. Google for Sun Systems LEC 315. It covers a 3x3 space I believe. That would let you use your Mars along one side. There may be a way to run CMH in an ordinary HID setup. I'm not familiar with this topic. I've seen the Sun at my local hydro store and it's nice. If I weren't in a hot environment, I would do that. For me, it's worth it to pay more for efficient LED, fewer w/sq ft.

 

[The Dawg]

Ive Been running CMH For Years Now Using A Magnetic Ballast On The HPS Setting

http://advancedtechlighting.com/p-5497.pdf

 

[az2000]

Ive Been running CMH For Years Now Using A Magnetic Ballast On The HPS Setting

http://advancedtechlighting.com/p-5497.pdf

Good info. I haven't followed this topic much. I started top save this link to use if it comes up again, and noticed I saved a link a few months ago about CMH for $150.

How does that setup (and yours) compare to Sun Systems LEC 315? What's the appeal to a $400-$500 system compared to yours and the one I link to?

 

[The Dawg]

Well For 1 The Philips Master Color is A 400 Watt CMH And Runs On The Hps Setting Oh I Have An Old School Magnetic Ballast That Runs Both Mh and Hps. I Also Run Mine In A Super Sun 4 Inch Hood. So My Setup Cost About 250.00 Including Hood Ballast And Bulb Of Course That Was Many Moons Ago Too. The Sun Systems Is A Pyramid Shaped Hood With Mirrors That Runs A 315 Watt CMD Vertical. Here's A Link To the Bulb I Use

http://www.greners.com/i/grow-lights/hid-bulbs/type/sodium-halide-conversion/Philips_400w_MH_Conversion_Lamp.html

 

[az2000]

The Sun Systems Is A Pyramid Shaped Hood With Mirrors That Runs A 315 Watt CMD Vertical.

I was wondering if there was anything to justify the price difference, if they were basically the same thing, but the Sun Systems gouges people?

Maybe the pyramid (vertical bulb) is the difference? I thought I heard that orientation is what's responsible for having so much less radiant heat. Does that sound like a possible difference and reason for the price difference? (Or, is it just gouging like Kind, HydroGrowLED, et. al. do with LED fixtures?).

Thanks!

 

[The Dawg]

IMHO Their Gouging Ppl. That Hood Well Imho A Parabolic Umbrella Would Be Better Or Just Get The Vertical Style And Plop It In The Middle. 1 Thing Is For Sure Is You Will Love Growing With The 400 Cmh

 

[JohnCee]

I was hoping to get a few more recommendations before making a purchase.. any input is welcome.

 

[az2000]

I was hoping to get a few more recommendations before making a purchase.. any input is welcome.

Your budget is the limiting factor. The HPS suggestion is about all there is. Buy a CMH bulb for it when you can (I assume the CMH bulb would work in that fixture.). Is there anything you don't like about this recommendation?

If you want to do LED, start acquring Area 51 units as you have money. They're modular and you can expand as you go. A long-term investment, lifetime warranty (cost of parts).

If you have DIY skills and more time than money: build your own COBs attached to heatsinks. I haven't done it, but there are threads here. That will give you the most light for the money.

The epi-whatever lights like MarsHydro aren't worth the money. That's a throwaway investment. The HPS will be with you forever. A51 will be upgradeable, repairable. Building your own gives you more control over the future.

 

[blowincherrypie]

The sun system uses the agro bulbs which they only make in the 315 I think. What do I know though? I'm prolly wrong.. just a stoner growing sum grade a.. Not like some these guys on here with their fancy schoolin

 

[NeilNeverSleeps]

IMHO Their Gouging Ppl. That Hood Well Imho A Parabolic Umbrella Would Be Better Or Just Get The Vertical Style And Plop It In The Middle. 1 Thing Is For Sure Is You Will Love Growing With The 400 Cmh

Hey dawg I just ran the sun system lec 315 on my first go-round ever and thought it performed pretty well but i don't really have anything to compare too considering this was my first time. 3x3x6 tent used the 4100k for veg and 3200k for flower.... Just curious if you have any experience with both or kno what the pros/cons would be between using the 3200k that I used in flower or the 400cmh (the website showed that this bulb was 4000k) you were talking about using... Any feedback is appreciated !

 

[JohnCee]

I am considering staying away from leds.. even though I've heard great things about cobs, but I just don't feel like I am going to get the light coverage that I need. I want to run at least 4x 5gal buckets in my 4x4 flowering room and I need a light that will be able to give me enough penetration regardless of where a plant might be in the flowering stage. I've been told that the 400w will give my room enough light, but a 400watt will barely cover a 4x4.. how well can I honestly expect the light to penetrate to where needed? Then stepping above that is a 600watt and I can only imagine what that will do to the electric bill. I can't seem to make up my mind between mh/cmh/hps either.. I need someone to make this choice for me or I never will be able to decide.

P.S. - Will I still be able to use my led panel with another light at the same time? Is the led going to provide just as much light as it would without the additional lighting?

 

[Rahz]

It depends on the lamp. LED comes in a variety of efficiencys. 2 brands could be equal while one uses 100w actual and one uses 200w actual. Pays to do the homework. 400w of high efficiency LED can put out more light than a 600w HPS. 400w of low efficiency LED will struggle to keep up with a 400w CFL panel.

I have read that LED makes good supplemental lighting, no reason not to use it if you think you could use the extra punch. If you're set on a bulb I would pick a 600w HPS and roll with it... though a couple LECs would be nice too.

I am considering staying away from leds.. even though I've heard great things about cobs, but I just don't feel like I am going to get the light coverage that I need. I want to run at least 4x 5gal buckets in my 4x4 flowering room and I need a light that will be able to give me enough penetration regardless of where a plant might be in the flowering stage. I've been told that the 400w will give my room enough light, but a 400watt will barely cover a 4x4.. how well can I honestly expect the light to penetrate to where needed? Then stepping above that is a 600watt and I can only imagine what that will do to the electric bill. I can't seem to make up my mind between mh/cmh/hps either.. I need someone to make this choice for me or I never will be able to decide.

P.S. - Will I still be able to use my led panel with another light at the same time? Is the led going to provide just as much light as it would without the additional lighting?

 

[az2000]

I need someone to make this choice for me or I never will be able to decide.

Unless you need to save energy or fight heat in a hot climate, and you're not willing to build your own COBs, CMH is probably the best choice.

You can supplement with LED. But, I think smaller, modular lights like Area-51 would be better than a large monolithic fixture. You could use those to fill in the corners, eventually replace the CMH if/when you have enough of them. (They join together to make a panel).

Stay away from the inexpensive Chinese imports (Mars, and almost anything on eBay). And, don't believe money = quality. There are some predatory brands like Blackdog, GrowBlu, Kind, Lush, HydroGrowLED. They're essentially rebranded Chinese lights sold for 5x the price.

 

[JohnCee]

Unless you need to save energy or fight heat in a hot climate, and you're not willing to build your own COBs, CMH is probably the best choice.

You can supplement with LED. But, I think smaller, modular lights like Area-51 would be better than a large monolithic fixture. You could use those to fill in the corners, eventually replace the CMH if/when you have enough of them. (They join together to make a panel).

Stay away from the inexpensive Chinese imports (Mars, and almost anything on eBay). And, don't believe money = quality. There are some predatory brands like Blackdog, GrowBlu, Kind, Lush, HydroGrowLED. They're essentially rebranded Chinese lights sold for 5x the price.

I lack the ability to build my own COB lighting, which essentially leaves me with CMH based off recommendations. I am on a phone so browsing the web for research is difficult, however is it possible to get an entire 600 watt CMH setup for under $250-$300.. if so.. could you provide me with links? I want to do away with running my marshydro as supplemental lighting and just give the room enough light for all of the ladies. I would use the marshydro for supplemental lighting if I can only get the CMH setup in 400watt.

Heat is not an issue. Actually, it might get too cold at some point soon.

 

[az2000]

If you look a few posts before you began, there were some links.

 

[GroErr]

Here's some options to run the 315w Elite Agro CMH which will cover 3.5 x 3.5 well. The heat is between hps and LED's and produces some nice bud. Some are 240v only, some offer both 120/240. If you're flowering only with it I'd recommend going with the 3100k bulb, they have a 4200k bulb also.

Cheapest option:
http://advancedtechlighting.com/cdmmw.htm
$200 for a bulb/ballast, with this one you'll need a down converter for 120v if you need 120v, default is 220/240
You can add a parabolic reflector to this for cheap if you want a hood

Kits (w/hoods/ballast/bulb) available using the Elite Agro 315w bulb:
Fixtures (growershouse has a 10% off all lighting sale right now)
http://growershouse.com/phantom-cmh-reflector-ballast-and-bulb-kit
http://growershouse.com/nanolux-cmh315-fixture-120-240v
http://growershouse.com/sun-system-lec-315-light-emitting-ceramic-mh-fixture-120v (available in 240v)

 

[az2000]

Cheapest option:
http://advancedtechlighting.com/cdmmw.htm
$200 for a bulb/ballast, with this one you'll need a down converter for 120v if you need 120v, default is 220/240
You can add a parabolic reflector to this for cheap if you want a hood

I'm confused about ballasts for CMH. I thought CMH required an electronic/digital ballast.

1. It sounds like it will work with ordinary magnetic ballasts (hyroot, dawg). What you linked to (the Advanced ballast kit) looks digital. In what ways would digital or magnetic make a difference?

2. Dawg (above) said he runs his CMH bulb on an HPS ballast. In what way would that matter (compared to using an MH ballast)?

3. Yesterday this guy found a $90 120v/240v switchable (MH/HPS) digital ballast system. Could a person use an Agro All-Start CMH bulb in this?

Thanks.