when an how sould I add nutrients if soil mix already has nutrients inside?

[bluesky73]

Hey everybody,

I would like to start by saying that this is my first post so, please, excuse my ignorance in typing a proper thread (unfortunately, ignorance is also the level of my knowledge upon growing and nutrient feeding, in paticular, too).
I am currently using a pretty decent (as far as i believe and told) soil mixture that contains the following elements inside:

80-280 mg/l (CaCl2) Nitrogen (N)
100-350 mg/l (CAL) Phosphate (P2O5)
200-400 mg/l (CAL) Potassium Oxide (K2O)
pit-lime and nutrients.
i will conclude with the soil's PH which is 6.5-7.0.

my question is: is this adequate enough to cover veg stage and if so should i add a biobizz fish mix that i already have?. I also have the grow and bloom of the biobizz series (bio). I was told that when using bobizz you should start in flower (both grow and blomm) and an addition of a tablespoon of epsom salts per 2lit of water during 3rd to 4th week of flowering but i am not so sure about the frequency and quantity of additional feeding.

i woud like to thank everybody for viewing my post. Peace among all!!!!

 

[GrowingTheDream]

Youre going to have to fo off how the plant looks. If its bagged soil it most likely will not have enough nutes to get you past a month or so. You will.need more nutes

 

[OldMedUser]

Hold off on extra feed until you see how it goes for a while. You can tell when the soil nutes are getting low. Growth will slow but you'll likely see the oldest bottom leaves begin to yellow before you notice the growth slowing. At that time if you're going to move it into a larger pot of the same stuff hold off feeding for a while again then after a couple weeks start feeding at about 1/2 full strength to see how that goes. Then skip one feeding by giving plain water and feed the next time. On and on like that is the way many do it. Let the pot dry out well between waterings and hoist it to feel the weight so you get used to it wet and dry.

The amount you feed plants depends a lot on other factors like light, fresh air etc. The more light there is the faster the plant can grow so needs more food. Less light means less food too or it builds up and can start burning the plants. That Biobizz should be pretty forgiving but try not to push too hard.

Pay attention to how your plants react to different things like feeding and watering. If you listen they will speak to you.

 

[Boston Mike]

Soil that has nutes is ok and adding nutes wont hurt it. Ide go by the recommended feeding schedule and continue until there is signs of a deficiency. Most important thing is making sure and adjusting the ph level of your water. You can have all the best soil and nutes bit it wont matter amd will be a waste of time and money and material. So yea go with it what it recommend

 

[Boston Mike]

Soil that has nutes is ok and adding nutes wont hurt it. Ide go by the recommended feeding schedule and continue until there is signs of a deficiency. Most important thing is making sure and adjusting the ph level of your water. You can have all the best soil and nutes bit it wont matter amd will be a waste of time and money and material. So yea go with it what it recommend

Oh and always make sure that the bottom of your pot does not stay sittin in the runoff the roots can rot

 

[TacoMac]

That will get you completely through the veg stage with no problems at all provided you're not planting in very small containers. (If you're doing 3 gallon or larger containers, you're good to go.)

You'll need to start feeding about week 2 of flower in all likelihood.

Again though, if you're planting in containers less than 2 gallons in size, you might wind up having to start a bit sooner. The smaller the planter, the faster the plant will suck the soil dry of nutrients.

 

[bluesky73]

thanks for your help and your valuable info guys. i think we all agree that the amount shoulb be bellow recommended dosage (i was thinking something like a 0.5 ml each, as a start, and then gradually increase up to 3 ml Fl and 1 ml Gr if needed). Could fish mix make any differennce or it is not a big deal?

 

[Indacouch]

Soil that has nutes is ok and adding nutes wont hurt it. Ide go by the recommended feeding schedule and continue until there is signs of a deficiency. Most important thing is making sure and adjusting the ph level of your water. You can have all the best soil and nutes bit it wont matter amd will be a waste of time and money and material. So yea go with it what it recommend

That makes no sense .....why add nutes to soil that already has it ,,,especially if those nutes aren't used up in the soil already .....further more several good bag soils actually buffer PH themselves so adjusting PH is pointless except for personal fun I guess .......soil with food can go at least a month usually ,,,,,and when starting nutes ,,,they should be started at quarter to half strength like mentioned above ......not trying to fight ...just stating the truth/facts from personal experience .....adding full strength nutes to soil already packed with nutes ....is asking for issues .

 

[TacoMac]

thanks for your help and your valuable info guys. i think we all agree that the amount shoulb be bellow recommended dosage (i was thinking something like a 0.5 ml each, as a start, and then gradually increase up to 3 ml Fl and 1 ml Gr if needed). Could fish mix make any differennce or it is not a big deal?

You're WAY over thinking it.

The number one cause of death of any plant is over feeding it. This forum is RIFE with people that just can't stop adding nutrients...and their plants burn all to hell because of it.

 

[Indacouch]

It's always better to have to feed a slightly hungry plant than to have to try to correct a nutrient nuked plant ....some advice you received above must be your competitor or someone with very little grow EXP....

KISS method is the best policy IMO

 

[bluesky73]

Hold off on extra feed until you see how it goes for a while. You can tell when the soil nutes are getting low. Growth will slow but you'll likely see the oldest bottom leaves begin to yellow before you notice the growth slowing. At that time if you're going to move it into a larger pot of the same stuff hold off feeding for a while again then after a couple weeks start feeding at about 1/2 full strength to see how that goes. Then skip one feeding by giving plain water and feed the next time. On and on like that is the way many do it. Let the pot dry out well between waterings and hoist it to feel the weight so you get used to it wet and dry.

The amount you feed plants depends a lot on other factors like light, fresh air etc. The more light there is the faster the plant can grow so needs more food. Less light means less food too or it builds up and can start burning the plants. That Biobizz should be pretty forgiving but try not to push too hard.

Pay attention to how your plants react to different things like feeding and watering. If you listen they will speak to you.

thank you very much for your detailed answer. i thought that the lower leaves (in general) were turning yellow cause of the hihger (and bigger leaves) ones (bloking the light).

 

[OldMedUser]

thank you very much for your detailed answer. i thought that the lower leaves (in general) were turning yellow cause of the hihger (and bigger leaves) ones (bloking the light).

Once a leaf is green it will stay green if nutrient levels and pH are within a healthy range even if the light levels are lower tho if it's really dark they may atrophy and fade then drop off. That usually won't hurt until the plant is getting pretty big and totally shades the lower leaves.

Some of the nutrients are "mobile". N, P, K, Mg and Zinc are all mobile. They can be relocated within the plant if the plant needs it elsewhere. That's why older leaves will exhibit symptoms first when any of those get too low. The new growing tips demand those and can steal them from the older growth to remain healthy for a while tho more and more leaves begin to show signs as the deficiency gets worse.

All the rest of the nutrients are "immobile". Ca, Fe, S etc are needed in small amounts but once used by the plant remain in the tissue where they are deposited. When any of these are lacking symptoms will first appear in the new and/or middle growth or buds if the plant is flowering as they can't steal them from other areas of the plants. Discolouration, twisting and distorting and yellowing of new leaves are some of the symptoms seen.

Diagnosing sick plant symptoms are hard enough sometimes with your own plants and even harder with pictures and someones description of what the problem is. CalMag doesn't fix everything as some think and too much can cascade into lots of other problems. Always best to go easy with any nute or change in feeding.

 

[bluesky73]

Those are all very valuable informations guys. What do you think about the addition of epsom salts during week 3 (fl)? I hve read that if you decide to start nut during flower then a tablespoon of epsom in 2 or 3 ltr of water is the best thing you can do, is that correct (I totally aggree with everyone that says it is much better to control the dosage even lower than proposed)?.

i've also read that during the first week of flower, the best thing is to start wth is 1ml of grow (claims that you dont need flower, not till pistils are shown). Then up this to a maximum of 3ml grow over the next couple of weeks and then drop it down to 1ml of grow and 1ml of bloom on your third week of flower and rise up to 3ml of bloom (keeping the 1ml of grow). Around this time (week three) you may get a mag def using just grow and bloom, treat with epsom salts and that will be the last you see of mag def

Keep upping the food to a max of 3ml over the next few weeks but only up it when its hungry.

Towards the last couple of weeks, completely skip the grow
Last week before flush pure bloom food, possibly drop the dosage to 2ml (maybe up it, its all down to the plant).

Final week pure water for a week ""

this was an interesting feeding model that i have read during my search. Although quite confusing...looks good to me...any suggestions?

 

[bluesky73]

I was also wondering ...what happens when your water has a ph of 7.8....do you have to adjust plain water?

 

[OldMedUser]

You can add all your nutes first then adjust the pH. No use doing it twice as the nutes will often drop the pH some and it may end up just where you want it after nutes are put in. Check it after an hour as it can change once all chemical reactions have completed. A lot of tap water will go back up after adjusting with pH down or up depending on the minerals in the original water. Using RO or distilled water gets rid of a lot of problems.

i've also read that during the first week of flower, the best thing is to start wth is 1ml of grow (claims that you dont need flower, not till pistils are shown). Then up this to a maximum of 3ml grow over the next couple of weeks and then drop it down to 1ml of grow and 1ml of bloom on your third week of flower and rise up to 3ml of bloom (keeping the 1ml of grow). Around this time (week three) you may get a mag def using just grow and bloom, treat with epsom salts and that will be the last you see of mag def

The first 3 weeks of flowering, (the stretch), is when your plants will feed at the highest level of their whole lives and is when they are setting up bud sites for flowering. They need all nutrients at higher amounts and particularly N, P and K. I dose my plants with flowering nutes a few days before flipping to get them ready. After the 3 weeks you can cut out the grow portion and about week 5 feed 1/2 as much micro as bloom like the Lucas Formula. Epsom salts supply Mg and S. It's the S that promotes resin development and is used in most bloom boosters. I use Big Bud for my bloom booster and recently tried Bud Ignitor tho I didn't notice much difference with it so likely won't buy any more once this small bottle is finished.

 

[bluesky73]

You can add all your nutes first then adjust the pH. No use doing it twice as the nutes will often drop the pH some and it may end up just where you want it after nutes are put in. Check it after an hour as it can change once all chemical reactions have completed. A lot of tap water will go back up after adjusting with pH down or up depending on the minerals in the original water. Using RO or distilled water gets rid of a lot of problems.



The first 3 weeks of flowering, (the stretch), is when your plants will feed at the highest level of their whole lives and is when they are setting up bud sites for flowering. They need all nutrients at higher amounts and particularly N, P and K. I dose my plants with flowering nutes a few days before flipping to get them ready. After the 3 weeks you can cut out the grow portion and about week 5 feed 1/2 as much micro as bloom like the Lucas Formula. Epsom salts supply Mg and S. It's the S that promotes resin development and is used in most bloom boosters. I use Big Bud for my bloom booster and recently tried Bud Ignitor tho I didn't notice much difference with it so likely won't buy any more once this small bottle is finished.

thanks for the ifo my friend. However, i only have biobizz bio grow, bloom and fish mix (i dont have any micro).can you tell me how and how much i can do with them? So, what you are saying is (despite the type of nutrients) start just before flowering and after three weeks stop the grow. the problem is that i dont know the amounts that must be used.

-can you tell me a detailed plan that goes with the biobizz nuts (quantities whould be great too). that is of course if there is something to be done with the nutes that i mentioned.
-You also said that epsom salts is something to be used during flower for resin production. i have read that with biobizz grow and bloom (especially when starting just before flower) you can use them once during the 3rd week of flower. how often should i use them? are they going to be used more than once? and if so...along with the nutrients (in the same bottle) or seperatly? sorry for my ignorance (and ongoing questions) but i am affraid to be burned again...i really apriciate your help man...thanks

 

[OldMedUser]

Wish I could help more bluesky but I'm not familiar with the Biobizz line. Depending on how the plants are growing just when you flip I would give them about 50% more than you do with a regular feeding and split it between the grow and bloom. I'm not sure what's in the fish stuff like it's NPK but it shouldn't hurt to add some of that as well. After the stretch then you want to go with just the bloom and a bit of the fish.

In your first post you mention using 1 Tbsp of epsom salts per 2L of water but that's a real heavy dose. For just maintenance it's used at 1 tsp/gal or 4L every 2nd feed or so. Twice that amount should be plenty for a dose beginning the 4th week of flower and maybe on it's own at the end of the 6th week to hopefully pump up the resin glands a bit more. It can be mixed in with your water first then nutes added when feeding. It doesn't have to go first but if added to just a bit of water and mixed until it's all dissolved it should be easier than shaking a whole jug of water.

 

[bluesky73]

Wish I could help more bluesky but I'm not familiar with the Biobizz line. Depending on how the plants are growing just when you flip I would give them about 50% more than you do with a regular feeding and split it between the grow and bloom. I'm not sure what's in the fish stuff like it's NPK but it shouldn't hurt to add some of that as well. After the stretch then you want to go with just the bloom and a bit of the fish.

In your first post you mention using 1 Tbsp of epsom salts per 2L of water but that's a real heavy dose. For just maintenance it's used at 1 tsp/gal or 4L every 2nd feed or so. Twice that amount should be plenty for a dose beginning the 4th week of flower and maybe on it's own at the end of the 6th week to hopefully pump up the resin glands a bit more. It can be mixed in with your water first then nutes added when feeding. It doesn't have to go first but if added to just a bit of water and mixed until it's all dissolved it should be easier than shaking a whole jug of water.

Dont mention it oldmeduser...your assistance was valuable. especially the amount warning regarding epsom salts. do you happen to know anyone that can help for the community? i seek info's on the matter cause time is running out...the thing that troubles me most is frequency (i dont know how often). all others you can control by providing less and very slowly increase....at least that is what i want to believe.

 

[OldMedUser]

I generally just feed one time then just water the next time. After some practice you can read the plants and just feel when they want more or if you should maybe just water twice then feed again. It's really not critical or something you can put specific amounts or times on. Better to give too little and have to add more than too much and burn your plants.

Search the forums for Biobizz and I'm sure you can find others using it and talking about how much and when they use it.