PJ Diaz
Well-Known Member
I've got some LED fixtures which use high powered diodes. I can hang them the same height as a 600watt HPS. Now what?
HPS vs. LED Grow Lights — Which is Better for Growing Weed?
- Thread starter MarsHydrofactory
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Horselover fat
Well-Known Member
Doesn't matter if they are high, medium or low power diodes. What matters is the size of the light cone. A large led fixture spills a lot of light and you get losses. It isn't a big deal, because the lights are so close to the tops and often they are in tents. You will have signicant losses if you take away the walls and raise your light higher. The light coming from spread out leds is in no way less energetic, but more wall losses means they shouldn't be raised too high. Add a good reflector or lenses to the led fixture and you can raise it high up, because you made the light cone smaller and reduced spillage.
Op's logic says two 1kw hps are no more light than one. Doesn't make much sense.
You are right, I was trying to explain the basics of it, not say you will x outta y
Im not lying, on page 14 it says 4 MH bulbs are tested and are similar to HPS, I will read the whole study when I can, my Adobe is crashing every 2 min on my win XP lol
Thank you again for sharing this info you can never learn too much
Even with the strongest diodes (Currently available, not future stronger ones) and the best lenses you can’t put them at those heights, the Lm is not enough to reach effectively to these distances, I welcome you to try, but reality suggest it will not be worth the time and money
Like I said before, there is a company that sells 5000w led panels that claim 5000umol, and if you understand anything from this thread you will understand that even the 5000w fixture can’t be more then 12 inch from canopy.. well they can and will grow but at what cost of quality ?
People take words too hard, like they are black and white, I’m not saying your buds won’t grow at all at that heigh (Several FT away) and that you won’t have trichome, I’m saying you will have both, just at a very low level
Now to the avg grower that needs to balance qty with quality it’s very hard, and people go to the route that work best for them, but who is to say it can’t be better then the best ?
Kassiopeija
Well-Known Member
No, I share my thoughts and knowledge with other people so they can see beyond the lies and blurring, trolling.. well, so be itI see you keep trolling Mars Hydro
What an old-school patriot
Kassiopeija
Well-Known Member
So what are the facts?
If we compare your 4*250W HPS vs that 780w LED.
How is the raw photon output PPF each second?
If we compare your 4*250W HPS vs that 780w LED.
How is the raw photon output PPF each second?
lusidghost
Well-Known Member
It feels a little like Fight Club in here all of the sudden.
bk78
Well-Known Member
Only 1 can log in at once
Nah we are all good
Kassiopeija - both science and reality say that the 4 x 250 will do a much much better job if you can handle the heat,
What are the terms for a “better job” well that is grower subjective, as some will know the difference between veg times and high quality flower better then others, some will have more branches at the same time some will have more node length (making them same height but different characteristics)
So I keep saying this, maybe veg the difference is not worth mentioning, that will require more testing and comparing Between the two, not as standalone testing
But in flower it’s a no brainier, if you accept the theory that trichome are a defensive measure of the plant, you must be able to find the source for it in our own world
And it’s very simple
Our world is based on 1 high intensity light
THAT IS FACT
The other thing is that the strongest MJ is found in the tropics, as the intensity there is beyond most places in our realm
So you can keep believing it’s bugs or it’s uv or Santa Claus, it’s all of them !
but at the end the most high qty thing that is found in the tropics is - high intensity sun with uv aswell and bugs as the eyes can see
Indoor doesn’t have bugs, also doesn’t have uv like the tropics, not until recent years that is
And still you grow some crazy ass stuff... how can that be.. Asking for a friend
PS, I keep repeating it, LED is better if 1 diode can push very high Lm count, way better then any HID, but they still don’t push enough, maybe some day.
Kassiopeija
Well-Known Member
Is there an echo in there?Nah we are all good
Kassiopeija - both science and reality say that the 4 x 250 will do a much much better job if you can handle the heat,
What are the terms for a “better job” well that is grower subjective, as some will know the difference between veg times and high quality flower better then others, some will have more branches at the same time some will have more node length (making them same height but different characteristics)
So I keep saying this, maybe veg the difference is not worth mentioning, that will require more testing and comparing Between the two, not as standalone testing
But in flower it’s a no brainier, if you accept the theory that trichome are a defensive measure of the plant, you must be able to find the source for it in our own world
And it’s very simple
Our world is based on 1 high intensity light
THAT IS FACT
The other thing is that the strongest MJ is found in the tropics, as the intensity there is beyond most places in our realm
So you can keep believing it’s bugs or it’s uv or Santa Claus, it’s all of them !
but at the end the most high qty thing that is found in the tropics is - high intensity sun with uv aswell and bugs as the eyes can see
Indoor doesn’t have bugs, also doesn’t have uv like the tropics, not until recent years that is
And still you grow some crazy ass stuff... how can that be.. Asking for a friend
PS, I keep repeating it, LED is better if 1 diode can push very high Lm count, way better then any HID, but they still don’t push enough, maybe some day.
>>Fixture photon efficacy PLEASE <<
You are echoing yourself, what does it matter the efficacy of a photon in the PAR range If your plant can’t even see it ?
Thats the whole problem.
Look up google for 600 hps ppfd chart and see for yourself the data.
you will see that no LED (at the moment) can push those numbers, at those heights, and even if so, and u get good number of PAR from a certain height with them, it still don’t matter because all you prove is that the photons are more efficient in the PAR spectrum but not driven more intense.
A PAR reading although sounds sexy is just checking the quality of a spectrum, and if a light source is giving its light in the PAR range and how much in that range
It does not measure intensity !
Hence there are two different equations here.
And they will always lead to the same conclusion, HID will bud decent from massive heights, because even though PAR readings are low, the actual PAR and other waves hid produce will make it to the plants and are driven with 150K intensity, so it makes up for lack of PAR in enabling the plant to see any light at all opposed to the same setup with LEDs that only has 300 Lm, the plants will barley know they are there.
It does not measure intensity !
Hence there are two different equations here.
And they will always lead to the same conclusion, HID will bud decent from massive heights, because even though PAR readings are low, the actual PAR and other waves hid produce will make it to the plants and are driven with 150K intensity, so it makes up for lack of PAR in enabling the plant to see any light at all opposed to the same setup with LEDs that only has 300 Lm, the plants will barley know they are there.
Billy the Mountain
Well-Known Member
It seems you have a fundamental misunderstanding of spectrum, penetration, efficiency, and PAR
LEDs have both a superior spectrum and roughly double the mmol/watt than an HID light
Welcome to 2022!
Thank you, but don’t confuse things,LEDs are more efficient at making light then HID, but are still very small in voltage and Lm output,
So, welcome to 2022, nothing has changed drastically.
Kassiopeija
Well-Known Member
Billy the Mountain
Well-Known Member
You're factually wrong and a bit delusional
Perhaps you have some factual data to back your erroneous assertions?
Just because you keep repeating the same bullshit, doesn't make it true
Well I it’s LEDs data, and HID data
Look it up if it perks your brain
I didn’t make this stuff up
It’s nice that you laugh and say I don’t understand basic light concepts lol
But never counter what I say with nothing but horses pics and smiling faces
So I will continue educating the ones who are willing to learn basic concepts of light and are not subjected to pre biased information or people who spend a lot of money and are looking to justify their investment lol
I’m not against anybody, just showing data and facts.
if you are too lazy to check it that’s your thing and I can respect that, not everyone has the time and desire to go beyond what THEY qualify as best for them
You are welcome to add or share or just learn.
Look it up if it perks your brain
I didn’t make this stuff up
It’s nice that you laugh and say I don’t understand basic light concepts lol
But never counter what I say with nothing but horses pics and smiling faces
So I will continue educating the ones who are willing to learn basic concepts of light and are not subjected to pre biased information or people who spend a lot of money and are looking to justify their investment lol
I’m not against anybody, just showing data and facts.
if you are too lazy to check it that’s your thing and I can respect that, not everyone has the time and desire to go beyond what THEY qualify as best for them
You are welcome to add or share or just learn.
bk78
Well-Known Member
Tomorrow is the big reveal?