INCOME TAXES ARE ILLEGAL: so don't pay.

[TheBrutalTruth]

And, that is exactly the ruse they used to gain popular support for the 16th Amendment. Hey, envy is a terrible disease.

Now just watch. You know that the next prize for the Obama fascists will be to take over the health care system and nationalize it. Here's the ruse they'll be using this time: "We will cut back on the income tax and apply it to only those who make a million dollars a year, or more. In addition, in order to afford national health care, we will be instituting a 25% VAT tax. All citizens, other than the super rich will be getting a "wash" because of no income tax."

Two years, three years ... five years after that, the income tax will be back in full force. This is exactly the way the people in Europe were duped into the VAT tax.

Vi

True about the ennui that lead to it being passed, "Tax the rich." Never mind that to some one who has nothing everyone is rich...

I hope you're joking about the consideration of a VAT...

 

[Rob Roy]

Ok.. so you want to abolish and if I follow that logic then there goes a central government (which is critical to a vital economy..). Then the state governments take over??? Do you have any idea what a bad idea that is?


We need a central government. This government needs funds to pay for military, crisis mgt, infrastructure etc.. Someone needs to collect those funds. you can change to a flat tax, fair tax, whatever, someone needs to collect that money. Or do you just want to change to name from IRS to RSS (revenue strongarm service), or some such thing?

I guess I kinda don't understand the idea of getting rid federal tax. Or do you just mean shirking paying taxes yourself, or scrapping of the entire system? And in that case, then what?

We need a central government?
Yes we need them to manage every aspect of our lives too.

Critical to a vital economy?
Hey I know let's give ALL of our money to the government because umm they're fiscally responsible and will take good care of us.

Pay for military ? We spend almost as much as the rest of the world combined on military...that might be related to why we have the highest debt.

Infrastructure ? Gas Tax?

Crisis Management ? You're funny.

 

[CrackerJax]

Frankly, federal tax or no federal tax, the US screwed up when it went off the gold standard and began a fiat currency. The bloat began right after and is now in high gear and out of control. It's a matter of degrees, not right or wrong.

 

[TreesOfLife]

Sorry to be a bother, TOL ... but I'm using an old computer that doesn't have a sound card. So, with that in mind, would you be kind enough to recap the film in your own words, being very specific about what makes Glenn Beck "scum?"


Thanks ...

Vi

There is a clip from his Cnn days where he says Ron Paul supporters are terrorists for raising money on the 5th of November in memory of Guy Fox, he strawmans FEMA camps, he says how he is SO sick of 9/11 Victims families and didn't know he could hate a group so much, there is another sound clip from his radio show you can find easily where he makes a caller sound like a loony toon for mentioning Bohemian Grove and leaves you with well it could be true after that, and he is just a flat out liar he baits you in with bits of truth.

 

[ilkhan]

Beck pissed alot of people off with his treatment of RP people.
He will never be fully forgiven for that.
Beck=Judas Goat, media shill, controled opposition, IMO

When the chips are down he will support a McSame over a real canidate.

 

[DirtyDog420]

What a bunch of anti America Americans we have here.. shut the f$$$ up and pay... Otherwise get the hell out.. The country needs money to run...

 

[TreesOfLife]

What a bunch of anti America Americans we have here.. shut the f$$$ up and pay... Otherwise get the hell out.. The country needs money to run...

Dissent is as American as it gets sir. Like I said with my info I posted if you want to HATE, post LINKS to the LAW that states you MUST PAY.

 

[Rob Roy]

What a bunch of anti America Americans we have here.. shut the f$$$ up and pay... Otherwise get the hell out.. The country needs money to run...

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free" -JW Goethe

 

[NoDrama]

What a bunch of anti America Americans we have here.. shut the f$$$ up and pay... Otherwise get the hell out.. The country needs money to run...

Hate to tell ya buddy, but I am pretty certain that the Boston Tea Party was precisely how "America" got started. Unfair TAXATION was what that was about. Would you care to know that this country had NO income tax longer than it has had one? Whats so American about the income tax? Are we the only country that pays it? Whats so UNamerican about wanting fairness? We only want our country to be better than it is, we love our country just as much as you do. The ultimate patriot is not someone who blindly follows the leader, but one who dissents and questions authority.

This isn't about taxes in general, I don't mind paying taxes on items, like sales tax and stuff. No this is about the INCOME TAX. The income tax pays for Nothing except for the interest. In no way does your tax dollar go to pay for any government service or to help build roads or bridges or to wage war against others.

 

[kubrickzghost]

There is no threatening, the bank accounts are dry. Every department is forced to make major cuts, EVERY DEPARTMENT. That means your losing people from everywhere.

The problem is that california voted for all of these expendatures and they don't want to pay for them.

Thats a problem caused by the people. Its like we went to the grlocery store and said, "I'd like the filet, salmon, this expensive ass wine, and here is my credit card." The credit card does not go thru and you try to tell the cahsier that you'll pay for it later. (Lack of lendable credit because of everextension) You tell the cashier i'll pay for it later, and shes like ??????? (this recent voting where we voted higher taxes down, this would have created money to pay for education, firefighters) So now you gotta start taking shit outta your basket (in this case departments are required to cut their budget by say 30% and that means job loss.

But don't get shit wrong, the people wanted all these nice social programs and now that the economy is bust and there is no credit to aquire the expensive programs. It our fault. Its so easy for us to sit back and blame gov't but I hate to tell you, the individual as mush to blame or more for voting in there bills that baloon spending. Its just alot easier to blame politicans than to blame us Americans ourselvs.....

You couldn't be more wrong. Get off the bandwagon and stop blaming prop 13.

 

[kubrickzghost]

Beck pissed alot of people off with his treatment of RP people.
He will never be fully forgiven for that.
Beck=Judas Goat, media shill, controled opposition, IMO

When the chips are down he will support a McSame over a real canidate.

That's opinionated. Either way, he's a barking dog for the right causes.

 

[olosto]

That's opinionated. Either way, he's a barking dog for the right causes.

He's a liar and a sensationalist.

 

[what... huh?]

Well in a nut shell you do not legally owe any taxes if derived within US borders.

The 16th amendment which does clearly give authority to the federal govt. to collect all taxes was never ratified correctly.

However, the courts will not address this issue since it is a piece of legislation and out of their perusal powers.

So...it is up to Congress to fix their own mistake. Need I go on? That is NEVER

going to happen. So, while technically you do not owe the monies, just try and not pay. The courts will be deaf to your arguments.

Purdy much.

Forty-two out of forty-eight, six more than required...

Borrowed
"Of the 48 states, here's the story:

• 
  [*]Eight states (Rhode Island, Utah, Connecticut, New Hampshire, Kentucky, Florida, Virginia and Pennsylvania) did not approve or ratify the amendment.
  [*]Texas and Louisiana were forbidden by their own state constitutions to empower the federal government to tax.
  [*]Vermont and Massachusetts rejected the amendment with a recorded vote count, and only later declared it passed without a recorded vote after the amendment was declared ratified by Knox.
  [*]Tennessee, Ohio, Mississippi, California and Washington violated their state constitutions in their ratification procedures.
  [*]Minnesota did not send any copy of its resolution to Knox, let alone a signed and sealed one, as required.
  [*]And Oklahoma, Georgia and Illinois made unacceptable changes in wording. (Some of the above states also made such changes, in addition to their other unacceptable procedures.)

Take 48 states, deduct these 21, and you have proper ratification by only 27 states -- far less than the required 36."

Hate to tell ya buddy, but I am pretty certain that the Boston Tea Party was precisely how "America" got started. Unfair TAXATION was what that was about.

Unfair because it lacked representation.

We have representation. They just don't give a sh1t, because there is no consequence to their misrepresentation. It is the nature of our system.

 

[Loftiest]

Purdy much.



Borrowed
"Of the 48 states, here's the story:

• 
  [*]Eight states (Rhode Island, Utah, Connecticut, New Hampshire, Kentucky, Florida, Virginia and Pennsylvania) did not approve or ratify the amendment.
  [*]Texas and Louisiana were forbidden by their own state constitutions to empower the federal government to tax.
  [*]Vermont and Massachusetts rejected the amendment with a recorded vote count, and only later declared it passed without a recorded vote after the amendment was declared ratified by Knox.
  [*]Tennessee, Ohio, Mississippi, California and Washington violated their state constitutions in their ratification procedures.
  [*]Minnesota did not send any copy of its resolution to Knox, let alone a signed and sealed one, as required.
  [*]And Oklahoma, Georgia and Illinois made unacceptable changes in wording. (Some of the above states also made such changes, in addition to their other unacceptable procedures.)

Take 48 states, deduct these 21, and you have proper ratification by only 27 states -- far less than the required 36."



Unfair because it lacked representation.

We have representation. They just don't give a sh1t, because there is no consequence to their misrepresentation. It is the nature of our system.

Doesn't matter if they may have violated their state constitutions or not. What bearing does that have on the amendment itself, if that's indeed true? Kansas could amend their state constitution to declare that they'll not send their National Guard soldiers abroad. What would that do? Absolutely nothing.

Could you please provide a link as to where that information came from?

http://www.gpoaccess.gov/constitution/html/conamt.html

Amendment XVI.

The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on
incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or
enumeration.

The Sixteenth Amendment was proposed by Congress on July 12,
1909, when it passed the House, 44 Cong. Rec. (61st Cong., 1st Sess.)
4390, 4440, 4441, having previously passed the Senate on July 5. Id.,
4121. It appears officially in 36 Stat. 184. Ratification was completed
on February 3, 1913, when the legislature of the thirty-sixth State
(Delaware, Wyoming, or New Mexico) approved the amendment, there being
then 48 States in the Union. On February 25, 1913, Secretary of State
Knox certified that this amendment had become a part of the
Constitution. 37 Stat. 1785.

The several state legislatures ratified the Sixteenth Amendment
on the following dates: Alabama, August 10, 1909; Kentucky, February 8,
1910; South Carolina, February 19, 1910; Illinois, March 1, 1910;
Mississippi, March 7, 1910; Oklahoma, March 10, 1910; Maryland, April 8,
1910; Georgia, August 3, 1910; Texas, August 16, 1910; Ohio, January 19,
1911; Idaho, January 20, 1911; Oregon, January 23, 1911; Washington,
January 26, 1911; Montana, January 27, 1911; Indiana, January 30, 1911;
California, January 31, 1911; Nevada, January 31, 1911; South Dakota,
February 1, 1911; Nebraska, February 9, 1911; North Carolina, February
11, 1911; Colorado, February 15, 1911; North Dakota, February 17, 1911;
Michigan, February 23, 1911; Iowa, February 24, 1911; Kansas, March 2,
1911; Missouri, March 16, 1911; Maine, March 31, 1911; Tennessee, April
7, 1911; Arkansas, April 22, 1911 (after having rejected the amendment
at the session begun January 9, 1911); Wisconsin, May 16, 1911; New
York, July 12, 1911; Arizona, April 3, 1912; Minnesota, June 11, 1912;
Louisiana, June 28, 1912; West Virginia, January 31, 1913; Delaware,
February 3, 1913; Wyoming, February 3, 1913; New Mexico, February 3,
1913; New Jersey, February 4, 1913; Vermont, February 19, 1913;
Massachusetts, March 4, 1913; New Hampshire, March 7, 1913 (after having
rejected the amendment on March 2, 1911). The amendment was rejected
(and not subsequently ratified) by Connecticut, Rhode Island, and Utah.

As you can see, that's forty-two states.

 

[what... huh?]

We the People Foundation for Constitutional education. Same guy that the OP was referring to founded the org... and these were the results of his research. Feel free to research. I do not post the original link because it is not relevant in that it offers no links to the evidence or documents. I am familiar only through history.

 

[Loftiest]

We the People Foundation for Constitutional education. Same guy that the OP was referring to founded the org... and these were the results of his research. Feel free to research. I do not post the original link because it is not relevant in that it offers no links to the evidence or documents. I am familiar only through history.

So just to clarify, we're six pages in and none of you have really provided evidence that it's illegal.

 

[TreesOfLife]

WAKE UP PEOPLE I POSTED THE DEFINITION OF INCOME THAT STATES YOU MOST LIKELY WILL NEVER PAY INCOME TAX EVER. BREAK YOUR SLAVE CHAINS PLEASE.


END RANT!

 

[Loftiest]

WAKE UP PEOPLE I POSTED THE DEFINITION OF INCOME THAT STATES YOU MOST LIKELY WILL NEVER PAY INCOME TAX EVER. BREAK YOUR SLAVE CHAINS PLEASE.


END RANT!

What's great is that you actually provided proof that income derived from labor is taxable. The thing is, you don't know how to comprehend what you read. So you linked to this: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode26/usc_sec_26_00000861----000-.html

So it begins with this heading: (a) Gross income from sources within United States
The following items of gross income shall be treated as income from sources within the United States:

(1) Interest
(2) Dividends
(3) Personal services

It's within section three that you misread what it states:

(3) Personal services Compensation for labor or personal services performed in the United States; except that compensation for labor or services performed in the United States shall not be deemed to be income from sources within the United States if-

The first sentence reads "Compensation for labor or personal services performed in the United States;" There's a semicolon there to show the end of the sentence. So the sentence reads that compensation derived from labor or personal services is taxable, given it's a subsection of (a).

The second sentence goes on to show that there are some exceptions from labor being taxed. The exceptions are listed as A, B, and C:

(A) the labor or services are performed by a nonresident alien individual temporarily present in the United States for a period or periods not exceeding a total of 90 days during the taxable year

(B) such compensation does not exceed $3,000 in the aggregate, and


(C) the compensation is for labor or services performed as an employee of or under a contract with (i) a nonresident alien, foreign partnership, or foreign corporation, not engaged in trade or business within the United States, or
(ii) an individual who is a citizen or resident of the United States, a domestic partnership, or a domestic corporation, if such labor or services are performed for an office or place of business maintained in a foreign country or in a possession of the United States by such individual, partnership, or corporation.

This political forum consists of very little more than conspiracy theories and idiocy.

 

[cream8]

ok but where is the law that says i have to file federal tax? show it to me. that 16th ammendment doesnt say it

 

[Loftiest]

ok but where is the law that says i have to file federal tax? show it to me. that 16th ammendment doesnt say it

http://www2.law.cornell.edu/uscode/uscode26/usc_sec_26_00006151----000-.html

(a) General rule Except as otherwise provided in this subchapter, when a return of tax is required under this title or regulations, the person required to make such return shall, without assessment or notice and demand from the Secretary, pay such tax to the internal revenue officer with whom the return is filed, and shall pay such tax at the time and place fixed for filing the return (determined without regard to any extension of time for filing the return).

(b) Exceptions (1) Income tax not computed by taxpayer If the taxpayer elects under section 6014 not to show the tax on the return, the amount determined by the Secretary as payable shall be paid within 30 days after the mailing by the Secretary to the taxpayer of a notice stating such amount and making demand therefor.

(2) Use of government depositaries For authority of the Secretary to require payments to Government depositaries, see section 6302 (c).


(c) Date fixed for payment of tax In any case in which a tax is required to be paid on or before a certain date, or within a certain period, any reference in this title to the date fixed for payment of such tax shall be deemed a reference to the last day fixed for such payment (determined without regard to any extension of time for paying the tax.)

There it is. This thread is basically done.