Atheism

[doc111]

IT appears as if the practice of atheism is as closely linked to deity bashing as the practice of monotheistic religion is linked to atheist bashing.

I notice this as well Hippie. Everybody thinks that their way of thinking is the best. I wonder why that realization alone doesn't give more of us pause and enable us to open our minds more. I thought atheists would be more open minded but this site has taught me that they are no different from religious types at all. I guess human nature doesn't change much regardless of what you believe.

 

[Stoney McFried]

I'm a woman and I'm an atheist. Now, I'm from Iowa, and from my town and some of the surrounding towns at least, I've observed that in general the population around here tends to be pretty backwards when it comes to religion. Still plenty of superstitious fear to be found around here,even from people you'd think would know better...i.e. doctors,lawyers,and other "educated" folks. When visiting my mother in a nearby small town,there was a billboard on the highway by the gas station that simply said "JESUS",and I just imagined the hell all those fucking Christians would raise if some other religious organization did the same thing and put "BUDDHA" or "HABONDIA".
But anyway, to answer your question,I can honestly say that outside of a few folks in my family who at least qualify as agnostic, I have never met another atheist in my immediate area. But I don't get out all that much, so I could be all wrong.

Just to throw this thought out here,

and to maybe rive up a discussion.
But do you guys think that the people who claim themselves athiest, out of these. That its mostly a male dominated catagorie??

I dont know if there is data on this, or anything. or reasoning.

My based on little prediction, is that women generally careless anyway, whether its religion or no religion. I know my mother is like that, she really doesnt give a shit?

What do you guys think? women athiests a-large? or what?

 

[growwwww]

I notice this as well Hippie. Everybody thinks that their way of thinking is the best. I wonder why that realization alone doesn't give more of us pause and enable us to open our minds more. I thought atheists would be more open minded but this site has taught me that they are no different from religious types at all. I guess human nature doesn't change much regardless of what you believe.

Hmm not so much, Monotheistic religions bash each other about to a much bigger degree... And aswell how can you say its a practise of athiesm...When you drop god and get on with other stuff, kick the bullshit and realise monotheism ( or belief in god ) isint your thing, essentially become an athiest you get attacked...Literally attacked by the believers, you need to be able to gun back at them and tell you why you have these views. Its more defence, its not athiests bouncing on religion, its athiests regularly being handed shit and religious thinkers not getting the idea...that we dont think there is a personal god and we dont religion, so we want to better ourselves off and just fucking enjoy life and get own with shit, go to labs and work and whatnot. Atleast its been this way for me and many otherrs ive heard the same.

Fuck you, you mongrels who are trying to indoctrinate me, ive made up my mind and the second i start speaking my mind, made up of more facts and more proof than you guys can offer me on a plate, my plate seems much more real and substantual to me, and truthfully to most others. They try hide the plates or force theirs down my throat. Fuck off.

A women today whilst i was waiting at the bus stop came up to me to ask me if i believed in god, she was a fucking nutcase riding her bycicle this young blonde girl with glasses i swear down her eyes were dialated like shit. I said no and she tried speaking to me, and i said no im not interested. She Persisted to ask me why i have morals and i explained to her, because we are physiologically programmed to be empathetic and to imitate what happens to others she just didint understand and went up to put a massive sign on the bustop to tell everyone to come to church on sunday and i just accepted a leaflet from her, because SHE WOULDNT GO AWAY. She cycled off and tore down the poster on the bustop ripped it in pieces and threw it in the bin.

 

[growwwww]

I'm a woman and I'm an atheist. Now, I'm from Iowa, and from my town and some of the surrounding towns at least, I've observed that in general the population around here tends to be pretty backwards when it comes to religion. Still plenty of superstitious fear to be found around here,even from people you'd think would know better...i.e. doctors,lawyers,and other "educated" folks. When visiting my mother in a nearby small town,there was a billboard on the highway by the gas station that simply said "JESUS",and I just imagined the hell all those fucking Christians would raise if some other religious organization did the same thing and put "BUDDHA" or "HABONDIA".
But anyway, to answer your question,I can honestly say that outside of a few folks in my family who at least qualify as agnostic, I have never met another atheist in my immediate area. But I don't get out all that much, so I could be all wrong.

Cool, really good to hear. Truthfully speaking to my mother whos really quite a tough cookie and normally gets shit right. She just thinks and i think its true, women just have better shit to do in there time than bother with religion...Because mostly it doesnt involve them and athiesm they just dont care. Im in Britiain so the situation is diffferent from you guys in the U.S but cool to hear

 

[Stoney McFried]

Well, my mom was a Jehovah's Witness.She couldn't go back to the church now if she wanted to, I don't think, because she broke down and had a blood transfusion when a bleeding ulcer was threatening to kill her. She still believes in a lot of the bullshit she learned from there,and is certain that after "Armegeddon",she will not be able to come back and live in the "New System" because she didn't attend church and was not a "good" witness. Once she began speaking to me of GAWD and started crying as she spoke, and I said,"Now how is this god of yours such a good thing if you break into tears because you're so afraid of him and his wrath?" But mom,well, she's never been big in the brains department.....(and I'm not saying that to be mean),she was just a really beautiful woman who didn't have to get by on much more than that through most of her life.And she's had a hard life, too.When you think about it,if this god of hers existed, he did the cruelest thing he could ever have done to her.....he took away her beauty and dinged her up pretty bad in a car wreck so she can't even really get physically fit. Now she's done some shitty stuff in her life,and maybe some folks would call it karma.....but I really don't think a lot of her shit was malice(though she could be vindictive), just ignorance.She really loved being young and beautiful.....and for her time,and in this state,she was a sexual pioneer(She once wrote down a list of over 200 lovers)....and now she's a wrinkled old lady with bad teeth and a pin in her knee and elbow and a bad hip.What kind of loving god would take a butterfly and rip off its wings like that?But still, she clings to these beliefs out of fear.Sad.

Cool, really good to hear. Truthfully speaking to my mother whos really quite a tough cookie and normally gets shit right. She just thinks and i think its true, women just have better shit to do in there time than bother with religion...Because mostly it doesnt involve them and athiesm they just dont care. Im in Britiain so the situation is diffferent from you guys in the U.S but cool to hear

 

[growwwww]

Well, my mom was a Jehovah's Witness.She couldn't go back to the church now if she wanted to, I don't think, because she broke down and had a blood transfusion when a bleeding ulcer was threatening to kill her. She still believes in a lot of the bullshit she learned from there,and is certain that after "Armegeddon",she will not be able to come back and live in the "New System" because she didn't attend church and was not a "good" witness. Once she began speaking to me of GAWD and started crying as she spoke, and I said,"Now how is this god of yours such a good thing if you break into tears because you're so afraid of him and his wrath?" But mom,well, she's never been big in the brains department.....(and I'm not saying that to be mean),she was just a really beautiful woman who didn't have to get by on much more than that through most of her life.And she's had a hard life, too.When you think about it,if this god of hers existed, he did the cruelest thing he could ever have done to her.....he took away her beauty and dinged her up pretty bad in a car wreck so she can't even really get physically fit. Now she's done some shitty stuff in her life,and maybe some folks would call it karma.....but I really don't think a lot of her shit was malice(though she could be vindictive), just ignorance.She really loved being young and beautiful.....and for her time,and in this state,she was a sexual pioneer(She once wrote down a list of over 200 lovers)....and now she's a wrinkled old lady with bad teeth and a pin in her knee and elbow and a bad hip.What kind of loving god would take a butterfly and rip off its wings like that?But still, she clings to these beliefs out of fear.Sad.

Damn, sorry to hear about all of that. but yeah my mums been through lots of peeps dieing when she was a child. And similarly to ur mother i suppose? but not really. My mum has always said to me when i was growing up, if god does exist, hes an absolute wanker.

Anyway, peace too all!

 

[CrackerJax]

You know what Karma is? It's a pseudo replacement for religion by ppl who don't profess to need any.

Karma is another mind cheat, no different from religion.

Ur mom is no different from Patty Hearst. She has been damaged by her own church (her captors). They have instilled a FEAR in her that will be difficult to remove.

Have pity on her, but I'm sure you already do. Ur a good person Stoney.

 

[growwwww]

Oh btw this is what i was talking about, with the ways humans phsyically imitate and empathise,

watch his other talk aswell, this man is fantastic!!!!

http://www.ted.com/talks/vs_ramachandran_the_neurons_that_shaped_civilization.html

This is a fucking nutts discovery, think about it? Research into this can be so cool, and will specifty and make drug research so much more specific as it adds to the element of this unconsious brain activity that is mimicing what happens to other people, when its not happening to us? Its nutts and he also puts it into evolutionary perspective and why we are so good at spreading ideas horizontally and so quickly, truly fantastic!!!

 

[doc111]

Hmm not so much, Monotheistic religions bash each other about to a much bigger degree... And aswell how can you say its a practise of athiesm...When you drop god and get on with other stuff, kick the bullshit and realise monotheism ( or belief in god ) isint your thing, essentially become an athiest you get attacked...Literally attacked by the believers, you need to be able to gun back at them and tell you why you have these views. Its more defence, its not athiests bouncing on religion, its athiests regularly being handed shit and religious thinkers not getting the idea...that we dont think there is a personal god and we dont religion, so we want to better ourselves off and just fucking enjoy life and get own with shit, go to labs and work and whatnot. Atleast its been this way for me and many otherrs ive heard the same.

Fuck you, you mongrels who are trying to indoctrinate me, ive made up my mind and the second i start speaking my mind, made up of more facts and more proof than you guys can offer me on a plate, my plate seems much more real and substantual to me, and truthfully to most others. They try hide the plates or force theirs down my throat. Fuck off.

A women today whilst i was waiting at the bus stop came up to me to ask me if i believed in god, she was a fucking nutcase riding her bycicle this young blonde girl with glasses i swear down her eyes were dialated like shit. I said no and she tried speaking to me, and i said no im not interested. She Persisted to ask me why i have morals and i explained to her, because we are physiologically programmed to be empathetic and to imitate what happens to others she just didint understand and went up to put a massive sign on the bustop to tell everyone to come to church on sunday and i just accepted a leaflet from her, because SHE WOULDNT GO AWAY. She cycled off and tore down the poster on the bustop ripped it in pieces and threw it in the bin.

See, you automatically disagree with me which more or less proves my point. You think you are right, they think they are right. To deny this is to deny fundamental human nature. I didn't mean to say this was an absolute but it is definitely the norm. Tell me that you don't know you are correct. My dear grandmother, whom I love wholeheartedly, is very religious and she will tell you to your face that she knows she is correct. And for anybody to deny this is to deny a look at their own self and way of thinking. Stop for 2 seconds and open your mind. Allow yourself to think: maybe I am wrong about everything I think about religion. It's a fact of human nature. We all think our way of thinking is the correct one.

 

[CrackerJax]

I've come to believe that religion is a Darwin effect, and we are hard wired to be superstitious.

Breaking free from ur hard wiring is the most difficult thing you can do. Few achieve it.

 

[growwwww]

See, you automatically disagree with me which more or less proves my point. You think you are right, they think they are right. To deny this is to deny fundamental human nature. I didn't mean to say this was an absolute but it is definitely the norm. Tell me that you don't know you are correct. My dear grandmother, whom I love wholeheartedly, is very religious and she will tell you to your face that she knows she is correct. And for anybody to deny this is to deny a look at their own self and way of thinking. Stop for 2 seconds and open your mind. Allow yourself to think: maybe I am wrong about everything I think about religion. It's a fact of human nature. We all think our way of thinking is the correct one.

Your just annoying, im not saying its absolute either. The truth is, if they are fucking right they cant say theres been much wrong with athiests, we arent violently doing much we arent keeping kosher or going to church or rapping our women up in burqas no. but we are still being charitable and thers a large proportion of them working high up in science ( richard dawkins gives the percentage in his talk i think less than 10percent of the top 400 chemists and biologists believe in a personal god? i cant remember exactly ) and all im saying is, as athiests when we are showing the proof we think is admirable and sufficient we will be the first ones to admit we are wrong.

Oh and well done, it is a fact of human nature, watch Dan Denettes speech about the mind, he talks about how everyone thinks they are an expert on the consciousness etc... I think you get the right idea but i always think you are tied up in some weird fence sitting maybe directional?? I really dont know. but at the end of the day, its what i think and you shouldnt care much because its not that important.

http://www.ted.com/talks/dan_dennett_on_our_consciousness.html

this talk doesnt explain consciousness well or his ideas, but u get what i mean just in teh first few minutes which his humurous intro. Hes really brilliant. Watch hsi talk on memes after which is more on topic to wht he actually talks about in that speech

 

[CrackerJax]

Religion is one of the most successful memes ever created. It's also the most damaging to society.

 

[growwwww]

Religion is one of the most successful memes ever created. It's also the most damaging to society.

Yup, thats where the whole evolutionary perspective comes into play. We can see that religion once was of utmost importance, when people went to war and when people were in famine it was religion thta kept their hope and possibly led them on to survive/defend from people. But, this is all big phoney ball shti im on gonna speak about...Like terence says, like aldous says and like as we see and the world is showing...We are speeding up and become increasingly complex, religion is slowly loosing importance and is having a negative effect.

When shit gets heated we often loose apt and sight of the truth, we need to drop out and stand back. Kick the bullshit and re-assess. Enjoy life innit!! dont stress about whether ur next door neighbours a fucking muslim or a jew just get on with tings isint !!!! ahh im so high right now and listen to big tunes! enjoy life brothers!

 

[doc111]

Your just annoying, im not saying its absolute either. The truth is, if they are fucking right they cant say theres been much wrong with athiests, we arent violently doing much we arent keeping kosher or going to church or rapping our women up in burqas no. but we are still being charitable and thers a large proportion of them working high up in science ( richard dawkins gives the percentage in his talk i think less than 10percent of the top 400 chemists and biologists believe in a personal god? i cant remember exactly ) and all im saying is, as athiests when we are showing the proof we think is admirable and sufficient we will be the first ones to admit we are wrong.

Oh and well done, it is a fact of human nature, watch Dan Denettes speech about the mind, he talks about how everyone thinks they are an expert on the consciousness etc... I think you get the right idea but i always think you are tied up in some weird fence sitting maybe directional?? I really dont know. but at the end of the day, its what i think and you shouldnt care much because its not that important.

http://www.ted.com/talks/dan_dennett_on_our_consciousness.html

this talk doesnt explain consciousness well or his ideas, but u get what i mean just in teh first few minutes which his humurous intro. Hes really brilliant. Watch hsi talk on memes after which is more on topic to wht he actually talks about in that speech

If I'm annoying you then I must be doing something right................making you think! OUCH!!! It hurts my brain! Look man, you don't have to agree with me just like I don't have to agree with you. I share many of your feelings about organized religion but when I see things like "Christianity is dangerous" or "Religion encompasses everything wrong with the world" it gives me pause. It's a blanket statement, a generalization being made. Which is a stereotype. To make blanket statements is to deny the reality of what religion is and does. Is religion perfect? Of course not but show me any human institution which is perfect. Can religion be dangerous? Of course it can but do churches feed the hungry and clothe the poor? Do priests molest little boys? Of course but does every priest molest? Come on! You are all intelligent people..............start behaving like it for a change.

 

[CrackerJax]

Here's a perception Doc....

Man someday will leave religion behind. But not anytime soon. Man still needs it. At least for the foreseeable future.

(?)Perhaps(?) someday we will travel deep space, and one of 2 things will happen:

1.) We will discover for ourselves that superstition is no longer needed for us to be happy beings.

2.) We discover that there is a Galactic church (at which point all the atheists will commit suicide).

 

[Stoney McFried]

Mom was just dirt poor growing up,and as she became a woman, she was really beautiful.All the old timers talk about it, and I've seen pics...she could have been a model.She also had a hell of a singing voice.However, like I mentioned, not a lot of common sense. Over the course of her life, she was raped three times,went though a string of bad relationships,partied hard,neglected her kids(I think the guilt gets to her a lot),was abused severely ( I mean, like, concentration camp level abuse...my dad was crazy),is a five pack a day smoker,got into a head on collision in 78 that fucked her up pretty good....But she just gets her mind stuck on something and you can't get her out of that way of thinking.Like I said, mom's not terribly smart, so the brainwashing religion offers was a little more effective on her than her kids.

Damn, sorry to hear about all of that. but yeah my mums been through lots of peeps dieing when she was a child. And similarly to ur mother i suppose? but not really. My mum has always said to me when i was growing up, if god does exist, hes an absolute wanker.

Anyway, peace too all!

I do have pity on her,even though she wasn't exactly super mom.After dad died,we went hungry a lot while she went out partying....and I got beat on a bit there by her...I think it was a way to get back at my dad for the things he did to her and my half brothers,because I was his favorite and wasn't mistreated.I used to resent her for it,but I don't anymore.However, I will bring it up if she starts running her mouth and trying to tell me how to raise my kids...basically letting her know she has no room to talk,because I may yell a bit sometimes, but it's nowhere near what she did as a mother.I think we end up being our own instrument of "karma".We become on the outside what we think we are on the inside a lot of the time. Imagine being one of the great beauties of your town, if not your nation,and ending up the complete opposite of what you were.And I'm sure she feels she deserves it sometimes.

You know what Karma is? It's a pseudo replacement for religion by ppl who don't profess to need any.

Karma is another mind cheat, no different from religion.

Ur mom is no different from Patty Hearst. She has been damaged by her own church (her captors). They have instilled a FEAR in her that will be difficult to remove.

Have pity on her, but I'm sure you already do. Ur a good person Stoney.

 

[doc111]

Here's a perception Doc....

Man someday will leave religion behind. But not anytime soon. Man still needs it. At least for the foreseeable future.

(?)Perhaps(?) someday we will travel deep space, and one of 2 things will happen:

1.) We will discover for ourselves that superstition is no longer needed for us to be happy beings.

2.) We discover that there is a Galactic church (at which point all the atheists will commit suicide).

Ha! Perhaps your are correct. The point is though is that nobody really knows. One can suspect, believe, or even srumise, but nobody can really know. Which brings us full circle in our logic.............Thank you and goodnight!

 

[doc111]

Mom was just dirt poor growing up,and as she became a woman, she was really beautiful.All the old timers talk about it, and I've seen pics...she could have been a model.She also had a hell of a singing voice.However, like I mentioned, not a lot of common sense. Over the course of her life, she was raped three times,went though a string of bad relationships,partied hard,neglected her kids(I think the guilt gets to her a lot),was abused severely ( I mean, like, concentration camp level abuse...my dad was crazy),is a five pack a day smoker,got into a head on collision in 78 that fucked her up pretty good....But she just gets her mind stuck on something and you can't get her out of that way of thinking.Like I said, mom's not terribly smart, so the brainwashing religion offers was a little more effective on her than her kids.

I do have pity on her,even though she wasn't exactly super mom.After dad died,we went hungry a lot while she went out partying....and I got beat on a bit there by her...I think it was a way to get back at my dad for the things he did to her and my half brothers,because I was his favorite and wasn't mistreated.I used to resent her for it,but I don't anymore.However, I will bring it up if she starts running her mouth and trying to tell me how to raise my kids...basically letting her know she has no room to talk,because I may yell a bit sometimes, but it's nowhere near what she did as a mother.I think we end up being our own instrument of karma.We become on the outside what we think we are on the inside a lot of the time. Imagine being one of the great beauties of your town, if not your nation,and ending up the complete opposite of what you were.And I'm sure she feels she deserves it sometimes.

Isn't that a bit superstitous for somebody who is an atheist?

 

[Stoney McFried]

I should have placed quote marks around the word karma.EDIT:There, fixed it.

Isn't that a bit superstitous for somebody who is an atheist?

 

[CrackerJax]

Ur right DOC, no one knows. Something I maintain like a daily vitamin.

The problem is we have an institution called the church which sometimes upon pain of death INSISTS it DOES KNOW.... and that's the problem.