Wow so now me getting 1600-1900 grams consistantly on one light without using CO2 is considered "Average" .. LOL =)
Pruning - When do you take all the leaves off?
- Thread starter John Stevens
- Start date
Wow so now me getting 1600-1900 grams consistantly on one light without using CO2 is considered "Average" .. LOL =)
OZUT
Active Member
You don't get it.....If you have to use 64 plants to get that much than yeah, that's not too good. That's why I said you're letting the grams per watt calculation fool you. I can put 1,000 plants in my bedroom and just use my 8 recessed lights, then claim I got 200 grams per watt (or whatever amount) but that's not a good measurement of how good I grow or how good my operation is. You might be pulling 1,500 grams off of one light, but at the same time you're only pulling 23 grams per plant. What would you say to someone that says he gets less than an ounce per plant using 1,000 watts? There are a lot of variables that you need to consider to establish a grow as efficient and grams per watt is not the only way. You might be limited on how much power you can run and how much space you have, in which case a SOG set up like yours might work. 1 light with a lot of plants in a small space. But if you got 12 lights going, your setup isn't really the best option. You would end up needing 768 plants. Make sense?
What I said about your "SOG" grow is that you do need to trim off a lot of leaves just because you crowd 64 plants under 1 light but that doesn't mean removing fan leaves increases production on a grow that's not a SOG operation. Get it?
You're trying to compare 2 completely different styles of growing that are not really comparable as far as this issue in concerned and then trying to use your results to argue your position.
LOL are you being serious? Sounds like you got a little lost in your logic to me. Pulling anything over 2 lbs a single light is very good. Pulling over 3 lbs is as good as it gets. I have read these forums for a long time and know fact only a tiny percentage gets even 2 lbs a light and only a couple percent if that get anywhere near the realm of 3+ lbs. Doesnt matter how you are growing it is about how efficient your grow space is. If I am getting more yield in my 4X4 grow space then you my grow is being more productive hence more successful. To make it simpler if Grower A: gets 20 lbs a year and grower B: gets 10 lbs a year both in the same sized space with the same amount of lighting grower A: is much more efficient and productive then grower B: . My bloom trays also stay in full bloom 52 weeks a year. Have to say I am very surprised anyone would actually try and say this yield isnt good when it for a fact is in the top few percent.
I do however agree that removing leaves on a non SOG isnt necessary. I never said it was and dont do it outdoors either. I never once said to remove fan leaves from a non SOG grow. Clearly though to make a blanket statement as others have done that removing leaves hurts the plants and decreases yield is flat out wrong. I proved that it is not always the case with actual MJ grows including pics, they just quote books they read and that it "shouldnt" work.
OZUT
Active Member
You're considering everything except the number of plants you're using. 3 pounds a light is fantastic, no doubt. 3 pounds from 64 plants is not that great. For instance, you said you're getting 2 pounds a light and you think that's great. You need 64 plants to get those 2 pounds. I get just over 2 pounds from 12 blue dreams under a single 1,000 watt light. Now you tell me which is more efficent? I run 12 lights. 9 are 1,000 and 3 are 600's. To style my grow like yours, I would need 768 plants flowering. Why would I do that, when I can pull the same weight with only 110-130 plants? I have a separate veg room that is constantly running and my flower room gets absolutely no down time. I won't even go into the work involved with caring for 768 plants. My point is, you can't just judge the grow by grams per watt. You must consider all the other elements including the number of plants you're using. The reason I gave you the 1,000 plants in a bedroom example is to show you that grams per watt is not the most accurate way to judge it. If I have 1,000 plants in a room with nothing more than (*8* 30 watt bulbs....that's 240 watts for 1000 plants. If every plant give me 1 lousy gram, then I would have 1,000 grams off of 240 watts which is 4.1 grams per watt. By your logic, that's a great grow, but it's not.
As for the 2nd part of your response, you just said what everyone has been saying on this thread. Removing the leaves is not necessary. What everyone else isn't getting is that you're talking about a SOG grow and everyone else is talking about a regular grow. I also agree with you that most people just quote books and of all the people that say the "leaf pickers" are just following baseless forum theories, that just as many people are following the "non leaf pickers" without really understanding shit about the subject.
OZUT
Active Member
You can easily pull 2-3 pounds a tray with SOG. I've got a friend that only does SOG and he averages 5 pounds per 4x8 tray....
64 plants on a 4X4 tray
Good yielding strain from a known mother if possible I hit 1900 with Chronic White Widow AKA Fruity Chronic. Averaged 30 grams per plant dried and cut. Most others will hit about 25 gram average including Super Skunk, Agent Orange, ICE, Sweet Tooth etc.
Lots of fresh air or CO2. I use atleast double the suggested air volume in my room.
1000 watt Hortilux bulb and air cooled hood
I use 5 inch pots with hydroton. Ebb and Flow
1300 PPM from week one up to 1500 PPM after about week 3.
I use MAxibloom by GH, Gravity, Snow Storm Ultra, MOAB and Floracious Plus
I get the plants into a healthy veg state where they are just starting to take off and put thme in the bloom room from 6-8 inches tall. They end up 18-20 inches tall.
Oh and most importantly cut all the fan leaves off at day 21 of bloom or you will end up with a leaf grow instead of the bud grow =)
LOL I dont think you really know what you are talking about no offense. I am talking about up to 8.5 lbs on a 4X8 tray. No it isnt easy to get 2-3 lbs on a 4X4 tray. Sorry but most people run closer to a 1 to 1.5 pounds on a 4X4 tray. Seen LOTS of threads talking about yields in here and other boards to know this to be true. Most people HOPE to get 1 gram per watt let alone almost 2 grams per watt. Not trying to be offensive but when you talk about being "easy" it couldnt be further from the truth.
OZUT
Active Member
I said I have a friend that pulls 5 pounds per 4x8 tray. I'm posting what I have seen while you're talking about what you've read on the internet. You're so wound up and lost with your grams per watt logic that you really can't see or acknowledge anything past that. If you need 64 plants in a 4x4 tray with a 1,000 watt light on them and all the effort that comes with a grow to simply pull 16 ounces then you really need to reevaluate things. You can get the exact same results with 7 or 8 or even 10 plants so why would you take on 64? The entire purpose of SOG is to use limited space as efficiently as possible. Isn't 10 plants yielding the same as 64 plants in the same space more efficient? Do you see how flawed your arguments are in all this? The only thing you have to say is gram per watt. You're like a parrot that hasn't developed it's vocabulary and library of phrases. No offense
leftreartire
Active Member
i can see removing a large leaf that could be covering up 20 smaller leafs. i can see removing that one, but as far as to remove all the leafs just stupid. god doesnt have little elves that go around removing all the leafs on tomatoe plants for them to fruit....leave the leaves alone unless they are yellow, wilted blocking 20 other leafs, or covered in mites...
Wow you must be REALLY stoned for this to make sense to you.... I am posting what I grow, pay attention son. I get a lot more yield then you or your friend in the same space but somehow that is perceived by you as a negative ??? LOL When you or your friend start yielding over 8 lbs on a 4X8 tray then feel free to say something. Your math is very off dude what else can I say. Wasnt trying to start something with you but for you to actually say that nearly 2 grams per watt or over a quarter pound per SQ foot or over 4 lbs per 4X tray is average is a complete joke as is your very fuzzy math. Where are you getting that you or your friend is yielding as much let alone more ? Stoner math for the loss bro. You keep trying to make sense of it and keep coming up emtpy. Glad I dont post in here while stoned or I would look as bad as you do right now....
Just shy of 60 lbs per year on a single 4X8 tray with Chronic White Widow and you are actually trying to make that somehow look bad. Best laugh I have ever had on this board I must admit =)
Here are some 2 inchers shooting blanks in Uncle Bens world. Yep you are right cutting them thar leaves rally messed them plants up Billy Bob .... Gotta love people that spout their argument with ZERO proof, nothing at all then actually critique the people who do saying it isnt proof enough. In what world does your logic seem sound Ben ? Its like saying someone didnt cheat while they are being shown a video of themselves cheating. You two must smoke the same stuff I guess.
These ladies are only 5 weeks in t bloom as well.
No one ever said to remove all the leaves just the fan leaves and only after 3 weeks in to bloom. See pictures above to see how stupid it is.
808toker
Active Member
3 weeks into bloom is pretty early to me....especially if your growing a strain with some sativa inside it...
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
Ahhhhhhh, more chest beating. I can cherry pick photos too to make my case.
What's your point other than your insatiable need to argue against the laws of nature? Here are some indica dom plants with dark green, large photon collectors left intact as mama nature intended it to be. There have been many others posted here and over the years, you'll just have to search out my attachments, not that your mind isn't already made up. These were crammed into a small space without any side lighting.
Last shot is a secondary harvest from one of the plants. You know the area, the bottom where no light reaches.
So you're removing the most efficient collector of photons, THE photosynthesis aficionale, and 3 weeks into bloom when the plant needs all the simple and complex carbos it can get until harvest! Gawd, this is too funny! 3 weeks eh? Not 1.5 or 6.25? Now that's some good ol' forum voodoo magic.... yess sah tis.
Being that this was erroneously posted in 'Advanced Techniques' by someone who doesn't understand what makes a plant tick (but has been sucked into inaccurate but trendy forum popular thought).....all I can say is it's typical Advanced Stupidity. Come on people, get away from cannabis forums for a while and get your fanny into some regular gardening forums where you might learn something bonafide. The basic lessons learned in a solid gardening forum just might be your shortcut to success.
UB
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jeffbelize
New Member
Uncle Ben...Stop wasting your time with these people!..They dont know any thing!