Poll: Solving The Debt Issue:

[PeachOibleBoiblePeach#1]

BiBle print,,,Again',,,Please state your point.

 

[newbforlife]

if the bible thing was meant towards me yea i know like i said its wiki the most generalized thing on the planet its the global how to for dummies
but none the less
i would love for this problem to be solved and by a bunch of pot heads that includes the medicinal people too
i just think it would rock to goto the goverment and say hey hey come here i've got something to show you and then fire the vast majority of them

 

[Ernst]

google communisim before you say hell no ,---its more or less like star trek or smurfs or care bears


yea communisim is not what you were brought up to belive

"Isms" Yep...

I don't really know what Cap on private wealth falls under.
My Cap on private wealth isn't a prohibition on private wealth just that it seems that those who are really really wealthy are so far detached that they are not part of society anymore.
So we are splitting into Lords and Serfs even in the USA.
I don't like that for my USA. It's not what I grew up believing in.

What ISM is cap on private wealth in?
Mind ya the upper limits would be voted on democratically as well as the lower limits If I could wave a magic wand. No one would be pointing a guns at you to take your beer and shotgun away.

I'm thinking a life time of 10 million dollars max? That would be a lot in my mind. Anything more than that and you can be a part of the Public wealth system.
See in my version of private wealth cap we all can invest in public wealth at any time.
Say you want to help the starving in Africa or New York then you can put your money in and let it do some good. It should be a system where you are insured so some interest or fees will need to be charged for the loan but that too should be more humanitarian than not.

Nice post I enjoyed reading your Wili Links.. Good work..

The idea is to get people using their imaginations not their guns.

 

[BudMcLovin]

So you are relying on businesses to drop their retail pricing 28% and pass that on to the consumer and once you add the 28% back in taxes, the price is the same as it is today? there is a problem with the core of that logic and that is businesses are owned by shareholders that expect a return on their investments. Do you honestly believe that the $4 gallon of milk will drop to nearly $3 after the IRS is abolished? No, the new tax savings will go on the balance sheet as a win for investors, not consumers.... And therein lies part of the problem with the fair tax.... It's a rich man's dream and everyone is being told to get on board.... Be careful what you wish for...

Competition will force prices down. That’s why computers don’t cost $1000 or why most people have cell phones. Sure companies could get together and agree not to drop their prices but then they’ve committed collusion which is illegal.

Let’s say Company A doesn’t drop the price of their product after the fair tax is enacted but Company B drops their price by 1/2 the amount they saved. Company B starts taking Company As customers. Company A then drops it’s prices by 3/4 the amount saved. Company B then counters with 90%. Add on it goes. Sure there will be areas that don’t see an immediate reduction but other companies will noticed the large profits in the industry and they will want in eventually force the price down.

 

[incognegro999]

The head of the NFL Roger goodel(however the hell u spell it) agreed to take a $1 annual salary while the league was locked out. I think the pres. and all of congress should follow suit until we have a budget surplus. I know it would just be a drop in the bucket but WTH right. Or at least put a cap on it. if your net worth is five million dollars or higher you get this amount. Its called public service for a reason, and doing it shouldnt get you three times the avaerage working mans salary. Especially when all those bastards use the inside information they get from having such jobs to make themselves even richer

 

[Serapis]

And in the middle of it is the consumer, paying out the ass while competition works out a new pricing scheme.... sounds like a great plan. You expect this to happen rather quickly do ya? that isn't the way corporations stay in business... they'll realize a tax savings and the board will issue themselves new raises. They'll tack on parachutes, medical plans, and maybe give employees a raise for retention purposes, but drop retail prices 50%? I'm not buying what you are trying to sell...

. now i know why super rich are all for it...

Competition will force prices down. That’s why computers don’t cost $1000 or why most people have cell phones. Sure companies could get together and agree not to drop their prices but then they’ve committed collusion which is illegal.

Let’s say Company A doesn’t drop the price of their product after the fair tax is enacted but Company B drops their price by 1/2 the amount they saved. Company B starts taking Company As customers. Company A then drops it’s prices by 3/4 the amount saved. Company B then counters with 90%. Add on it goes. Sure there will be areas that don’t see an immediate reduction but other companies will noticed the large profits in the industry and they will want in eventually force the price down.

 

[Mr Neutron]

So you are relying on businesses to drop their retail pricing 28% and pass that on to the consumer and once you add the 28% back in taxes, the price is the same as it is today? there is a problem with the core of that logic and that is businesses are owned by shareholders that expect a return on their investments. Do you honestly believe that the $4 gallon of milk will drop to nearly $3 after the IRS is abolished? No, the new tax savings will go on the balance sheet as a win for investors, not consumers.... And therein lies part of the problem with the fair tax.... It's a rich man's dream and everyone is being told to get on board.... Be careful what you wish for...

Not all businesses are controlled by shareholders, mine certainly was not. But when the burden of "withholding" is lifted, not to mention the personal income taxes, businesses will either keep their prices (now, artificially) high or will drop their prices in an attempt to attract more customers. When I was growing up, back to the late stone age, gas was .25/gal and I remember the four service stations we had in our little town used to have "gas wars" from time to time. It wasn't the attendants going out to hose down the competition, it was each station trying to under bid the competition. But then we used to wash your windshield, check your oil and tires, as well as pump the gas. Now, the price is UP and the service is DOWN (doing my best attempt at an Al Gore imitation)
Amazing when you think about it. How much prices have risen. As much good as abolishing income tax would be, ending the Federal Reserve is equally important. Inflation is the cruelest tax of all, because it affects us all. Especially the poor.

(edit) It takes me a long time to post because I type so slow and my internet connection is just one step up from two cans connected by a string, so Bud, you're exactly right. As a business, if you can sell more product at a lower cost and still keep your profit... that's a no-brainer.
Free markets, less regulation, less taxation and competition will make us a great nation again and along with a reasonable foreign policy, we will have more friends and less enemies.

 

[Serapis]

There are many good aspects to Fair Tax, however I fear it places a larger burden on the lower class. The rich will be encouraged to put off luxury purchases and the poor will keep paying 28% at the register when buying gas to get to work, buying clothes, and the every other daily spending they do. 100% of their income will be taxed at 28%. How much of a millionaire's fortune is taxable? Only the amount he chooses to spend, but certainly not 100%....

Again, I support abolishing the IRS, I just don;t think the Fair Tax dot ORG people have all the answers.... but take a look at who is involved in that organization.... a lot of wealth... you have to stop and wonder why...

 

[chillwills]

Number one, Social Security is NOT an entitlement, like any other retirement plan, it is funded by the employee and the employer.

Number two, The Department of Education is an investment in tomorrows.... without it, your tax base is going to shrink up and all jobs requiring degrees will be held by B1 foreigners...

other than that, i agree with most of what your saying.

Thats right. Social Security is the same thing as an annuity. You pay into it for years and then at the end you get a monthly check.

 

[beardo]

It's all a scam until they actually spend less than what they take in I declare Shenanigans on all of the politicians. And the key to this isn't raising taxes, Import taxes and tarrifs yes, but otherwise No New Taxes

 

[BudMcLovin]

And in the middle of it is the consumer, paying out the ass while competition works out a new pricing scheme.... sounds like a great plan. You expect this to happen rather quickly do ya? that isn't the way corporations stay in business... they'll realize a tax savings and the board will issue themselves new raises. They'll tack on parachutes, medical plans, and maybe give employees a raise for retention purposes, but drop retail prices 50%? I'm not buying what you are trying to sell...

. now i know why super rich are all for it...

Corporations stay in business by making a profit but they have to have customers. If large corporations want to keep their current prices I’m sure some smaller companies will be more than glad to take away their customers.

You need to reread what I wrote. I didn’t say 50% of the price I said 50% of the savings. Yes it will happen rather quickly. In highly competitive markets like soft drinks, restaurants, cigarettes, gasoline, clothing I think it will happen quickly, in as little as a day in some cases, but other areas will take longer.

Economies of scale will little or no competition will take the longest but it will eventually come down. Which sucks because people will pay more for power and water for a little while but we’ll be better off in the long run.

 

[Illegal Smile]

Here's a crazy idea - how about making the federal government produce a balanced budget like states have to. Let congress deal with the budget as a revenue problem (raise taxes) or a spending problem (lower spending). But we need to STOP letting them kick the can down the road by simply spending money we don't have and printing more as they go. Everybody from states down to each family has to balance their budget, but not the feds.

 

[Ernst]

Here's a crazy idea - how about making the federal government produce a balanced budget like states have to. Let congress deal with the budget as a revenue problem (raise taxes) or a spending problem (lower spending). But we need to STOP letting them kick the can down the road by simply spending money we don't have and printing more as they go. Everybody from states down to each family has to balance their budget, but not the feds.

So raise taxes or cut social services because we run on debt.

Maybe eliminate the debt by capping private wealth?

Balance budget. That's fine just balanced in what way?

 

[Serapis]

I understand your points, I really do... but economics is a real hobby of mine and I don't see the events laid out so nice and smooth as you do. You didn't address the fact that 100% of lower class incomes will be taxed while that won't be the case with the rich. You also have not addressed the fact that some very wealthy people are behind this push for "fair" taxation?

And 28% is not set in stone, there are figures as high as 34% with the current economy...

Corporations stay in business by making a profit but they have to have customers. If large corporations want to keep their current prices I’m sure some smaller companies will be more than glad to take away their customers.

You need to reread what I wrote. I didn’t say 50% of the price I said 50% of the savings. Yes it will happen rather quickly. In highly competitive markets like soft drinks, restaurants, cigarettes, gasoline, clothing I think it will happen quickly, in as little as a day in some cases, but other areas will take longer.

Economies of scale will little or no competition will take the longest but it will eventually come down. Which sucks because people will pay more for power and water for a little while but we’ll be better off in the long run.

 

[beardo]

It's all a scam until they actually spend less than what they take in I declare Shenanigans on all of the politicians. And the key to this isn't raising taxes, Import taxes and tarrifs yes, but otherwise No New Taxes

Here's a crazy idea - how about making the federal government produce a balanced budget like states have to. Let congress deal with the budget as a revenue problem (raise taxes) or a spending problem (lower spending). But we need to STOP letting them kick the can down the road by simply spending money we don't have and printing more as they go. Everybody from states down to each family has to balance their budget, but not the feds.

Yeah they need to stop fronting...they shouldn't spend any money untill they have it and then they should try to spend less than they took in....If that means things need to change big time, then so be it, it is the only solution that makes sense.

 

[Ernst]

It's odd that we think lower classes have to go without to solve things and then we say they have to accept lower pay, not union rights, no rights to health care no rights to housing , no rights to social security but Vote republican in 2012.

Seems to me it will be a Democrat victory in 2012.. Maybe for many decades to come.

 

[beardo]

Maybe eliminate the debt by capping private wealth

Hell No !!!!

 

[beardo]

It's odd that we think lower classes have to go without to solve things and then we say they have to accept lower pay, not union rights, no rights to health care no rights to housing , no rights to social security but Vote republican in 2012.

Seems to me it will be a Democrat victory in 2012.. Maybe for many decades to come.

If you and the majority of people are still seriously thinking along these lines we will lose either way
Remember... Douche VS Turd?
Both sides are screwing us just from a different position.

 

[Ernst]

Yeah they need to stop fronting...they shouldn't spend any money untill they have it and then they should try to spend less than they took in....If that means things need to change big time, then so be it, it is the only solution that makes sense.

I just watched the Fractional Reserve Banking video.. They actually never had the money to start with. Fractional Reserve means I have $10 but I lend out $100 and collect interest on $100 and make that $100 out of thin air since I never had it to start with.
Bernie Madoff ran a successful ponzi scheme and essentially it was the same as Fractional Reserve except the Federal Government didn't bail him out.

 

[BudMcLovin]

Amazing when you think about it. How much prices have risen. As much good as abolishing income tax would be, ending the Federal Reserve is equally important. Inflation is the cruelest tax of all, because it affects us all. Especially the poor.

I couldn’t agree more.

(edit) It takes me a long time to post because I type so slow and my internet connection is just one step up from two cans connected by a string, so Bud, you're exactly right. As a business, if you can sell more product at a lower cost and still keep your profit... that's a no-brainer.
Free markets, less regulation, less taxation and competition will make us a great nation again and along with a reasonable foreign policy, we will have more friends and less enemies.

I’m a terrible typist and the world’s worst speller, well I may be better than Dan Quayle so I have to run everything through spell check myself.
[video=youtube;Wdqbi66oNuI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wdqbi66oNuI[/video]