Zimmerman sues NBC

[Carthoris]

a rock in the grass would be consistent with zimm's scratches and witness descriptions of where the fight took place. makes sense to me.

So you are saying that Zimmerman might not be lying, he just might not know what happened exactly and knew his head was being beat against something hard?

 

[Harrekin]

So you are saying that Zimmerman might not be lying, he just might not know what happened exactly and knew his head was being beat against something hard?

Hell, I can tell you, after even just a fist fight you won't end up where you started off.

We love our drinkin', fightin' and smokin'...so I'd know

 

[Carthoris]

Sooo...your neighbor's black?....lol

Not anymore Seriously, I am one of the least racist people you can imagine. My imagined racism is simply because I said private companies should not be compelled to run their businesses a certain way for their customers and that their customers could go start their own companies if they wanted. We were talking about PRIVATE bus companies that had already desegregated, and I have always held that racism and government segregation is wrong but that people have the right to live how they want. My personal beliefs allow people to be racist, but I don't support it.

 

[Carthoris]

Hell, I can tell you, after even just a fist fight you won't end up where you started off.

We love our drinkin', fightin' and smokin'...so I'd know

I didn't get in any fights when I was there, and I was surprised to find out smoking in pubs was illegal. I got high with Polish people while I was there a few times. I drank a lot of Murphy and Bulmers while I was there. I carried gallons of Bulmers home

 

[Harrekin]

I didn't get in any fights when I was there, and I was surprised to find out smoking in pubs was illegal. I got high with Polish people while I was there a few times. I drank a lot of Murphy and Bulmers while I was there. I carried gallons of Bulmers home

Do you not get Bulmers/Magners over there?

I must say, it starts to taste like cold puke after a while.

And you primarily fight friends/family, it's not serious, you want to win obviously but you party together afterwards.

Its like MMA but out on the street

Sadly it's primarily for those yet without families tho, tends to stop after that.

 

[desert dude]

zimm said so, doesn't matter that every last witness saw or heard it happen in the grass.

How do you hear something happen in the grass?

 

[desert dude]

i meant to aim that at the knuckleheads who repeat what zimm says. zimm has proven himself to have zero credibility by now.

Zimm has proven to me that he is not very bright and he is subservient to authority, especially cops. He was a fool to talk to the cops beyond his initial statement.

Not knowing every detail of the fight is not surprising, he was being beaten after all. I know, his nose was barely broken and the overall beating was only marginally life threatening, but such an experience can be traumatizing to people who don't know how to take their beating like a man.

 

[desert dude]

Florida isn't like Ireland. Your country is all rock. Florida is sand in that area and the area looks to have been landscaped with a thicker type of grass. Most likely St Augustine. I would assume they tested for skin on the sidewalk and looked for blood. I am unsure why anyone is suggesting they weren't on the concrete at some point. The area where Martin died is a couple feet off the sidewalk and both people were roughly 6 foot tall. Even from the spot they found Martin's body after Zimmerman pushed him off of him it appears that if turned the right way someones head would touch the sidewalk. There is also what appears to be a water line shut off cover in the ground very close(painted white in the images, looks like a piece of paper on ground) that sometimes have metal covers.

Look at the photo of Martin's body covered by a tarp. It is about six feet from the sidewalk. You can tell because Martin's body is about the same distance from the sidewalk as the length of Martin's photographed body. Martin was 6'2" tall.

Martin decked Zimmerman, breaking his nose, while they were standing on the sidewalk. Zimmerman fell, landing partially in the grass with his head on the sidewalk. Martin climbed aboard and bashed Zimm's head against the sidewalk while Zimmerman screamed for help. This went on for about 45 seconds and was recorded. Martin was annoyed and alarmed at all the screaming and clamped his hand over Zimm's mouth to shut him up. Zimm's nose was broken at that point so he could not breath through his nose, hence he felt like he was being smothered. Zimmerman was panicked and reasonably believed he was in danger of being beaten to death. He had already sustained significant damage to his body.

The struggle ended when Zimm shot Martin through the heart. Martin straightened up in surprise and fell off of Zimmerman and away from the sidewalk, landing about one body length away, six feet or so from the concrete.

All of this is consistent the physical evidence, the circumstantial evidence and eye witness accounts.

 

[desert dude]

Not anymore Seriously, I am one of the least racist people you can imagine. My imagined racism is simply because I said private companies should not be compelled to run their businesses a certain way for their customers and that their customers could go start their own companies if they wanted. We were talking about PRIVATE bus companies that had already desegregated, and I have always held that racism and government segregation is wrong but that people have the right to live how they want. My personal beliefs allow people to be racist, but I don't support it.

Don't fret about Buck's racism accusations, and Cheesus parroting Buck. That eventually happens to everybody here. You just have to roll with it.

 

[Canna Sylvan]

Zimm has proven to me that he is not very bright and he is subservient to authority, especially cops. He was a fool to talk to the cops beyond his initial statement.

Not knowing every detail of the fight is not surprising, he was being beaten after all. I know, his nose was barely broken and the overall beating was only marginally life threatening, but such an experience can be traumatizing to people who don't know how to take their beating like a man.

Zimmerman is a dumb fuck liberal Democrat. Yet his fellow dumb fuck liberal Democrat brethren hate him!

 

[Carthoris]

Do you not get Bulmers/Magners over there?

I must say, it starts to taste like cold puke after a while.

And you primarily fight friends/family, it's not serious, you want to win obviously but you party together afterwards.

Its like MMA but out on the street

Sadly it's primarily for those yet without families tho, tends to stop after that.

We get Magners, but it doesn't taste the same. It could just be in my head, but that's OK. Bulmers has a special place in my heart. Bulmers is strictly in Ireland. Cider is one of my favorites. I usually get a 12 pack of cider, a 12 pack of IPA, and a 12 pack of stout when I buy beer. Ill drink a couple black velvets, an IPA, a cider, a stout, then repeat. Some times I substitute a tripel or something else. Lately, I have been going with Guinness variety packs and Sam Adams variety packs. I don't see why people drink the same thing over and over.

We slap box and/or wrestle.

[video=youtube;Qqs4EbU02As]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qqs4EbU02As&feature=player_detailpage[/video]

 

[Carthoris]

Don't fret about Buck's racism accusations, and Cheesus parroting Buck. That eventually happens to everybody here. You just have to roll with it.

It is funny because like a page before he started calling me a racist he said "I don't believe you are a racist." lol.

 

[Harrekin]

We get Magners, but it doesn't taste the same. It could just be in my head, but that's OK. Bulmers has a special place in my heart. Bulmers is strictly in Ireland. Cider is one of my favorites. I usually get a 12 pack of cider, a 12 pack of IPA, and a 12 pack of stout when I buy beer. Ill drink a couple black velvets, an IPA, a cider, a stout, then repeat. Some times I substitute a tripel or something else. Lately, I have been going with Guinness variety packs and Sam Adams variety packs. I don't see why people drink the same thing over and over.

We slap box and/or wrestle.

[video=youtube;Qqs4EbU02As]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qqs4EbU02As&feature=player_detailpage[/video]

It's not a good night unless you come home with chipped teeth and bruises...only vaguely remembering the night before and wondering "how the fuck did I not lose my phone?!"

Fact.

(Ahh...the days before having responsibilities...).

 

[cannabineer]

The burden of proof is on the prosecutor to prove Zimmerman did something illegal. All Zimmerman has to do is show that he could of reasonably not did something. The point was that how something looks (A nose not broken, a fractured skull, a ruptured spleen, appendix bursting.) doesn't have any relevance on how you feel or what you think when it is happening.

Unless the prosecutor can prove Zimmerman beat himself up or that Zimmerman started the physical confrontation there is no way they are going to convict him of murder 2. Wouldn't it be manslaughter regardless?

I agree about the burden of proof. And I also think that that argument shifts the question away from how badly hurt was Zimmerman? to how did he get into that position? as you've pointed out.
I think it would be manslaughter only if Z can't successfully plead defense. This one will be "outcome-based" imo. cn

 

[cannabineer]

How do you hear something happen in the grass?

If it's good grass ... cn

 

[desert dude]

I agree about the burden of proof. And I also think that that argument shifts the question away from how badly hurt was Zimmerman? to how did he get into that position? as you've pointed out.
I think it would be manslaughter only if Z can't successfully plead defense. This one will be "outcome-based" imo. cn

Not according to the law in Florida. The only questions are these:

1. Did Zimmerman reasonably believe he was in danger of great bodily harm, or death?
Looking at the situation and his injuries I think it was reasonable to fear GBH/death.

2. If Zimmerman is deemed the aggressor, then did he make every attempt to escape?
I don't see how he could have escaped, he was on his back being beaten.

 

[cannabineer]

Not according to the law in Florida. The only questions are these:

1. Did Zimmerman reasonably believe he was in danger of great bodily harm, or death?
Looking at the situation and his injuries I think it was reasonable to fear GBH/death.

2. If Zimmerman is deemed the aggressor, then did he make every attempt to escape?
I don't see how he could have escaped, he was on his back being beaten.

Your point 2 presumes that the situation went immediately to Zimmerman being beaten. You and I both know that that has not been established. If Zimmerman is indeed deemed the aggressor, it will be for the actions during the uncovered minutes, and it will be on the strength of evidence not revealed to us at this time. I won't speculate on what that evidence supports. cn

 

[Carthoris]

I agree about the burden of proof. And I also think that that argument shifts the question away from how badly hurt was Zimmerman? to how did he get into that position? as you've pointed out.
I think it would be manslaughter only if Z can't successfully plead defense. This one will be "outcome-based" imo. cn

Yet they decided to charge him with Murder 2 which really wouldn't apply even if there wasn't the question of self defense with the evidence available. I don't think he has to plead self defense as much as the prosecutor has to prove it wasn't self defense. Unless there is something awesome the prosecutor is holding in reserve it isn't going to happen. The reasonable doubt applies not only to whether or not someone was doing it, but whether it was a legal action. Following people and calling the police is a legal action, so if there isn't any evidence to the contrary the verdict must be innocent or if there is a black person/UB type on the jury it will be hung.

 

[cannabineer]

Yet they decided to charge him with Murder 2 which really wouldn't apply even if there wasn't the question of self defense with the evidence available. I don't think he has to plead self defense as much as the prosecutor has to prove it wasn't self defense. Unless there is something awesome the prosecutor is holding in reserve it isn't going to happen. The reasonable doubt applies not only to whether or not someone was doing it, but whether it was a legal action. Following people and calling the police is a legal action, so if there isn't any evidence to the contrary the verdict must be innocent or if there is a black person/UB type on the jury it will be hung.

It will depend also on what they can demonstrate about Zimmerman's intentions and actions. Zimmerman has said some outrageous things before and after the event. It depends on what they have, don't have andor can make fly in the courtroom. The jury will be working with a different, larger set of evidence than the scraps we're chewing here until they're gray and flavorless. cn

 

[Carthoris]

It will depend also on what they can demonstrate about Zimmerman's intentions and actions. Zimmerman has said some outrageous things before and after the event. It depends on what they have, don't have andor can make fly in the courtroom. The jury will be working with a different, larger set of evidence than the scraps we're chewing here until they're gray and flavorless. cn

I think the nature of this case makes it a hung jury without evidence that is overwhelming.