Eveything you need to make Rick Simpsons/Wernard Bruinings Oil !

[thatguywhogrows]

After finding out about Rick Simpson and Run from the Cure a couple of years ago i decided to get on it myself as my dad has cancer and im sure like a lot of you on here are affected by cancer to some degree !

So i started to make it with success but it wasnt 100% consistant in its effects (which Rick himself admits)
I then went to the C.C in dam for my usual anual trip and i was amazed to see Wernard Bruining (started first coffeshop in dam mellow yellow and first grow shop and seed bank in europe)
Giving a talk on the very subject! so i made sure i went and spoke to him told him my story and got information on a new method which is safer and provides you with a workable medicine (the effects are consistant = medicine)

So i moved onto that !
After speaking to him he has recommended buying the "Smartstill" made in UK a water distiller that can be used for distilled water - epic in itself for health and wellbeing !
You can also use it to make home brew alcohol and the make the oil - with a 75% return on your alcohol (iv got around 60% with the bottle method)

So as i am upgrading i am selling my old kit to make this stuff:

2 x glass baby bottles
1 x dual baby bottle warmer
2 x air pump
2 x aluminium tubing
lots of silicone tubing

Just looking for what i paid its all in perfect condition as new and has only been used half a dozen times at most ! cheers

Any questions just ask !

cheers x

 

[nameno]

Would like to hear more about this new way? I've been putting off making any,I tell myself I don't know enough yet about what to use for what disease,but I think I'm just lazy.

 

[thatguywhogrows]

Mate its one of those to be honest - dive in and learn whilst doing its the only way to REALLY learn !

Iv heard that high THC is better for some conditions and high CBD is better for others but if you have the luxury of having a few different strains on the go a mix is always a good bet and recommended by those in the know !
What is it you want to know ?

From what i understand and have been told - the difference in Rick's method is just a little less exact with regards to temperature control - which leads to different effects. (no air is used either)
The first time i did it (Ricks way) my mum tried a bit and got her so baked she rang a ambulance out of panic - she was fine just threw the worlds most epic whitey as she hadnt eaten anything all day and had been drinkin alcohol (definate no no) - slept it off for 2 days and woke up never feeling better lol

With Wernards method its slow and steady, you have a constant air feed going in to keep uniform evapoaration of the alcohol along with a very accurate and controlable temperature - this produces the 'medicine' ie. the effects are always consistant ! Its also mixed with another oil to help preserve and provide added benefit. Iv used pure organic olive oil as thats what wernard advised but others can be used. Im gonna experiment with flax seed oil and coconut oil - both have amazing medicinal benefits!

Iv been taking it daily for a month or so now and am having no adverse side effects - my dad is on it for his cancer - which he got high one time but emptied a full pipette at once so his own stupid fault (against my instruction i might add) And im hopefull to see his medical assessments after being on it for a similar time !

Iv also given to a friend who suffers from acute back pain - he was in a car crash and had to have a battery put in his spine - after being on the oil he has been sleeping again and regularly - which he hasnt been in over 6 months prior !

heres link to the start of Wernards development - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sse-NFWJv8c

And now we've moved on to the 'smartstill' which im ordering mine this week ! just makes it easiler still, allows for more to be processed (upto 4 litres at a time) and more efficient, giving back upto 75% of the alcohol used in the process !

Hope this helps any more questions ask away if i can help i will ! x

Much love

 

[Sir.Ganga]

All that equipment and time just to save a little achohol? I am now on my second round of Ricks method and I use the rice cooker like him. Being a perpetual grow once a week I wash my sugar shake, once I have washed 500g of sugar shake through the same achohol, 1 liter, I cook it off in the rice cooker.

From that litre I usually get a return of 18-20g and it only takes about 20 minutes to cook down then into is final container and places in a double boiler until all bubbles have stopped surfacing.

Real quick, real easy, real safe if you set it up right.

Just to let you know my cancer, lymphoma, has now gone into remission and tumors are shrinking, which is blowing my doctors mind!

 

[thatguywhogrows]

Thats awesome man hats off !!! yeah man if you know what you're doing Rick's method is still a cancer cure no one can argue with that shit ! Keep blowing minds lol x

 

[The Yorkshireman]

You get a far superior product by not using an alcohol but a non polar solvent like Heptane or Butane gas (Butane preferred).

In Wernard's video his Ethanol solution is green (Ricks also but Rick uses Iso or Naptha) and this is due to the alcohol stripping all the chlorophyll and unwanted crap from the bud, this can be eliminated by using a non polar solvent that only dissolves the good stuff leaving the crap behind. This also means the product is purer. more potent and needs a smaller dose to be effective

Both Wernard's and Rick's methods are considered quite primitive these days as we become more scientific in our approach to producing medicinal cannabis products.

The best way to produce oil is to make BHO, vacuum purge it in a pressure cooker (optional if made competently) then decarboxylate it in a slow cooker or on a glass roasting dish over a hot plate. Once the BHO has been decarboxylated properly (when dry it should go hard and shiny) it can then be dissolved in the oil of choice ready for administration (of course the oil of choice should be hemp oil) or into a very small amount of Ethanol/glycerine to make a tincture that can then be used in all other products (sweets, cakes, drinks) unlike the black oil.

Although Wernard's oil will decarboxylate THCA to THC to some degree with the warmth of the bottle warmer his process doesn't have a solid decarb step, proper decarboxylation is the key to consistent medicine.



If you do want to use an alcohol you'll have a job finding Ethanol in England now mate, the government banned commercial import about 6 months ago.
I have to bring back my 95% Ethanol personally from Poland (Spyritus), you used to be able to buy it in Polish deli's over here but like I say the job's fucked now.

Good luck in your quest and say hi to your Dad for me.........

 

[thatguywhogrows]

Now then dude can you explain some stuff a bit more if you can !

I understand that alcohol stripping all the chlorophyll turns it green but what are reffering to when you say all the "unwanted crap"?
From what i understand its all fairly pure anyway and anything that could be reffered to as "crap" isnt harmful for humans !?

Iv been using 99.9% pure ethanol and you can get it shipped online no problems at all - this was last month !

Also wanted to say dont use hemp oil to mix it with - its been tried and tested although it is good and can be used. In comparison with other oils - anything you buy commercially now wont be the most beneficial form of hemp oil anyway but it turns the mix sour after a short while so isnt the best preserver ! Thats why olive oil has been recommended ! You can use it by all means! Iv not tried it because i was told of other options - olive, flax seed etc ! And from what i have tried they do the trick very well and it maintains all of the benefits talked about !

I know what you're getting at with the "primitive approach" but try look a bit deeper into Wernard or ill try get hold of some stuff to post because medically they have been getting better results than most carried out these days and for what is available to most people this appears to be the most cost effective !

I can see how other methods may be purer but certainly not more potent??? - the plant is responsible for that alone before this process is done. All this process does is extract what is already there......

Either way all good information and cheers for your input! More things to help us all further our understanding !

 

[VladFromOG]

OP - Just to chip in with my two cents: Dont use a commercial water steam distiller, just get a generic steam distillation kit on Ama for like 150 bucks, or assemble your own from a couple flasks, a condenser, and some stoppers/tubing for only 50. Either way, youll get a higher quality steam distillation kit for a third of the price. Yes, you can steam distill hash oil from herb, and it is of fine quality, but it takes forever and I prefer butane myself.

Take anything Rick says with a huge grain of salt. He makes terrible extracts using crude outdated methods, but hes so self aggrandizing that whenever he speaks he makes it sound like hes found something awesome and new. Yes, cannabinoids cure cancer and extracts of cannabis have proven fairly effective against gliomas and melanomas. No, RSO (or ISO and similar) is not anywhere near a pure extract of cannabinoids. They have harmful tannins and chlorophyll, which is fine topically or orally, but breaks down into carcinogens when vaped or burned. Total cannabinoid percentage of RSO is often less than bubble hash because of all the extra crap the iso or ethanol pulls out. Really, the time it takes and the cost of materials are both higher for shitty crude concentrates like RSO than they are with pure cannabinoid concentrates like BHO and CO2 extract. If you're going to put in all that effort and materials/equipment cost, you might as well go witht he process that leaves you with pure cannabinoids for your trouble. I know, I know, Rick says otherwise and has a million blog posts about how his hash dick is bigger, but listen: I've been making butane/CO2 oil for a decade, and so has the rest of the medical community, because its astoundingly purer. ISO extracts identical to the RSO process have been around since the seventies, and there is a reason all the old timers moved on to different methods; they consistently perform better. NMR analysis agrees; the worst BHO is far purer than the best RSO/ISO.

For a complete rundown, sans any mysticism and BS, of the different types of extracts including RSO, check out the link in my sig. Cannabinoids can be a great tool, but Rick is just out to make a name for himself, and everything he says is to make himself or his oil sound more fantastic than they really are.

 

[Sir.Ganga]

You get a far superior product by not using an alcohol but a non polar solvent like Heptane or Butane gas (Butane preferred).

Any solvent that does not require heating will NOT work for the medication. Im not sure about the properties of hemptane but butane made oil does not have the same effect or outcome due to the fact that it is not heated in the vapping process.

Look.... BHO is an awsome product to smoke, for the purpose of meds I would stick to the tried and true methods. This has saved my life(or at least gave me a few more years)and was safe and easy.

I eat a full gram of oil, 15 capsules of dried material and I juice my fresh greens every day! Stripping a little Chlorophyll from something I'm already ingesting is no big deal to me.

I will endorse this method until the day I die.

 

[Sir.Ganga]

OP - Just to chip in with my two cents:

Take anything Rick says with a huge grain of salt. He makes terrible extracts using crude outdated methods, but hes so self aggrandizing that whenever he speaks he makes it sound like hes found something awesome and new. Yes, cannabinoids cure cancer and extracts of cannabis have proven fairly effective against gliomas and melanomas. No, RSO (or ISO and similar) is not anywhere near a pure extract of cannabinoids. They have harmful tannins and chlorophyll, which is fine topically or orally, but breaks down into carcinogens when vaped or burned. Total cannabinoid percentage of RSO is often less than bubble hash because of all the extra crap the iso or ethanol pulls out. Really, the time it takes and the cost of materials are both higher for shitty crude concentrates like RSO than they are with pure cannabinoid concentrates like BHO and CO2 extract. If you're going to put in all that effort and materials/equipment cost, you might as well go witht he process that leaves you with pure cannabinoids for your trouble. I know, I know, Rick says otherwise and has a million blog posts about how his hash dick is bigger, but listen: I've been making butane/CO2 oil for a decade, and so has the rest of the medical community, because its astoundingly purer. ISO extracts identical to the RSO process have been around since the seventies, and there is a reason all the old timers moved on to different methods; they consistently perform better. NMR analysis agrees; the worst BHO is far purer than the best RSO/ISO.

This mans method has saved not only my life but many others as well so...keep your 2 cents because its just gonna confuse the people that are looking for facts at a time where they really need it! BHO is far less effective than any other solvent that requires a higher temp to vape off. It is the temp. that contributes to making the med.

BHO IS FOR SMOKING...and your right its as clean as it can get.

Do a little research, BHO may be purer as you say and if your smoking it, that is what you want, but this med is ingested if your looking for good results and ingesting additional plant matter, like Chlorophyll, is no big deal and may also be part of the reason this medication works.

Rick is out to make a name for himself?...well after being kicked out of Canada and being stripped of everything for spilling the beans about this med and its importants, having pharma companies start a bashing campaign of mis-information and then have guys like you muddying the waters?

He'll never be able to make a name for himself and that is very sad because, he may not be the first, he is the one that got the ball rolling and after all the shit settles he will not get the recognition he rightly deserves.

RESPECTS for the man HERE!

 

[The Yorkshireman]

Any solvent that does not require heating will NOT work for the medication. Im not sure about the properties of hemptane but butane made oil does not have the same effect or outcome due to the fact that it is not heated in the vapping process.

Look.... BHO is an awsome product to smoke, for the purpose of meds I would stick to the tried and true methods. This has saved my life(or at least gave me a few more years)and was safe and easy.

I eat a full gram of oil, 15 capsules of dried material and I juice my fresh greens every day! Stripping a little Chlorophyll from something I'm already ingesting is no big deal to me.

I will endorse this method until the day I die.

Sir.Ganja I think you have your wires crossed here, you can't vapourise something without heating it!

You have also quoted the first line of my post out of context when the rest goes on to explain the need for decarboxylation of THCA synthase to THC for consistent medicine, this is what happens at the point of vapourisation and what you mean when you refer to it being 'heated'.

We are not talking about vaping or smoking it, we are talking about oral ingestion which is why I put the decarb step with the slow cooker or hot plate in.
Although I have added a decarb step if you understand a little high school chemistry then you will know that it's not actually needed providing your cannabis buds have been properly dried, the carboxyl group (carbon/oxygen) is removed over time as the buds dry (carbon and oxygen leaving the matter as evaporating water and carbon dioxide) converting THCA into THC.
As we are interested in only harvesting cannabionoids and not the vegetable matter then decarboxylation occurs much much sooner in the trichome heads than it does the rest of the plant (simple surface area to air ratio evaporation), therefore no need to decarb BHO but a very real need to decarb alcohol extractions.

You can endorse whichever method you like but it's advisable to understand the subject fully before attempting to correct somebody who does.

 

[The Yorkshireman]

Now then dude can you explain some stuff a bit more if you can !

I understand that alcohol stripping all the chlorophyll turns it green but what are reffering to when you say all the "unwanted crap"?
From what i understand its all fairly pure anyway and anything that could be reffered to as "crap" isnt harmful for humans !?

Iv been using 99.9% pure ethanol and you can get it shipped online no problems at all - this was last month !

Also wanted to say dont use hemp oil to mix it with - its been tried and tested although it is good and can be used. In comparison with other oils - anything you buy commercially now wont be the most beneficial form of hemp oil anyway but it turns the mix sour after a short while so isnt the best preserver ! Thats why olive oil has been recommended ! You can use it by all means! Iv not tried it because i was told of other options - olive, flax seed etc ! And from what i have tried they do the trick very well and it maintains all of the benefits talked about !

I know what you're getting at with the "primitive approach" but try look a bit deeper into Wernard or ill try get hold of some stuff to post because medically they have been getting better results than most carried out these days and for what is available to most people this appears to be the most cost effective !

I can see how other methods may be purer but certainly not more potent??? - the plant is responsible for that alone before this process is done. All this process does is extract what is already there......

Either way all good information and cheers for your input! More things to help us all further our understanding !

Lol, I think Vlad has beaten me to it concerning the unwanted crap.

You want a solution of pure cannabinoids with nothing else and this can't be achieved with solvents like Ethanol.

Concerning the Ethanol I meant just walking into a shop and buying it, but to be honest it's absolutely pointless paying a premium price for lab grade 99.9% Ethanol unless you have a lab and chemical drying agents because of it's hygroscopic properties. As soon as you open the bottle it starts to absorb moisture from the air so doesn't stay 99.9% pure for very long at all, this is why we use the most stable ABV% possible which is 96.4% (labelled as 95%).


100% cold pressed hemp oil can be bought pretty much anywhere, even ebay.
It's not the hemp oil that's turning the solution sour it's the chlorophyll, cellulose, tannins and other crap that shouldn't be there that are responsible.
The reason why it goes sour is because the unwanted crap that the ethanol has stripped out (and is now in your oil) starts to decompose as it's attacked by microbes.
All solutions produced with such methods will start to decompose at some point and it's only a matter of time, the different oils used for the solution (hemp, flax, coconut) will allow decomposition to occur at different times hence you being advised not to use hemp oil (although they don't realise this).
If you extract pure cannabinoids with a solvent like Butane or Heptane then there are no unwanted contaminants to decompose, high quality BHO can be dissolved in Ethanol and stored for a surprisingly long time if not indefinitely.


I'm sorry mate but it's simply untrue that Wernard is getting better results medically than others and that it's the most cost effective process, Wernard's (and Rick's for that matter) oil is simply an inferior product in every way.
I will bet my left testicle that there's not one dispensary in the US that sells oil produced like that yet nearly all of them sell BHO/Bhudder.
I can make BHO ready to vape/consume (without a vacuum purge) in less than 10 mins and have it turned into an Ethanol solution/tincture in less than 5, I can even make plain old bubble hash with my bubble bags, dried and pressed ready to consume in about 20-30 mins (you're more than welcome to come and see both for yourself....). You can even fill gel capsules with bubble hash and take them like tablets, 'Subcool' (who happens to be a moderator here) has been medicating like this for a few years now.
A BHO/Ethanol solution is also far more bioavailable than an oil made by Wernard or Rick's methods, whether this be orally or topically.
And if the BHO is dissolved into hemp oil you get all the benefits of hemps amino acid profile as well, which is pretty much complete (all the human body needs to sustain life).


This is my BHO tool kit, there simply isn't an easier and cheaper way to make it.....

Some butane gas.



A jam jar with two holes poked in the top, the one in the middle for the Butane nozzle and the other for air to escape under pressure.



A glass roasting dish.



A hair dryer for purging the Butane under heat (you can also decarb with this if you can be bothered to sit there for ages).



And a stanley knife/razor blade for scraping your product from the dish.



10 mins and job done, simple.


Yes it is more potent, by definition.
It takes less of the final product to have the same effect, the cannabinoids extracted from the plant are not any more potent as you say but the final product is due to it being purer.

 

[The Yorkshireman]

Later this year or early next I want to invest in a Tamisium extractor (http://www.tamisiumextractors.com/) so that I can produce medicinal sweets of the highest quality, I believe when it comes to medicine there can be no compromise especially if it's intended for someone other than me.





......

 

[VladFromOG]

Ganga-
Reason, science, and logic are no match against a fanatic religious convert. And thats what one becomes after dealing with and beating cancer - its a deep spiritual event that changes you.

I am very glad that marijuana cured your illness, and even glad that someone as shady as Rick made you aware of marijuanas healing powers.
My problem with Rick is that he creates this religious devotion in himself, he seeks and even demands it. Marijuana healed you, not Rick. Marijuana deserves your devotion, not Rick. Rick didnt discover marijuanas anticancer effects, Rick didnt create a new type of extract, Rick, didnt even find a new use for said extract, the *only* thing Rick did and ever does is misdirect people about his shitty extract with sciencey BS in order to create this cult around him. The big problem with that is that is stifles real future research by the community bc theres this small portion of religious converts to Rick demanding his inferior crud and refusing to research anything else. Thats the reason he got kicked out of Canada (gotta be real shady to get kicked out of friggin Canada) - not because he was shilling MJ as a cure (MJ has been completely decriminalized and medicinalized since long before Rick showed up, the Canadian government provided most of the pro pot studies cited by American MMJ proponents), but because he was lying to cancer patients about how his overpriced extract was better than the purer concentrates. He got kicked out for practicing without a license, and for medical malpractice (by forcing his shitty crude concentrate on some of the sicker patients they died, whereas if they had used a stronger extract they may have been healed). He then moved to america, started scamming the local dispensaries, and went on a blogging crusade, blasting anyone against him, fabricating many initial success stories (yes there have been real ones since then), and now theres this small group of sick people who refuse to learn or try anything that hasnt been spun through the Rick BS profit machine. I know, his blog says otherwise, but look for real news sites articles about him (CNN, APwire, Reuters) not those authored by Rick and his pseudonyms, if you want the real story. He absolutely did and does supply his crap extracts to patients and even a couple shady dispensaries

Seriously, go right now and check one of the snapshots of overgrow.com. That was a giant pot forum from before Rick ever appeared, that was busted about a decade ago. It was an info nexus for the medical community when MMJ legalization was just a dream in CA and OR. In it you'll find a ton of posts about various methods for hash making, some discussing the shitty method Rick uses, except this was well before he ever claimed to invent it. You'll also find a ton of posts about the medicinal qualities of MJ, including its anticarcinogenic effects, and even some of the studies Rick claims support his extracts efficiency, but upon reading state that the "extracts" used in the study were pure isolates, not crude chlorophyll laden 30% cannabinoid extracts like Ricks (Rick not even being around at the time. And you'll also find a ton of posts by me, explaining this new fangled butane extraction we were doing way back then. And you'll also find a nice general timeline of the medicinalization movement, the studies used and the big proponents and doctors (Dr Jay Cavanaugh, may you RIP) who have actualy progressed the science and studies of marijuana and its curative effects and helped bring its medicinalization into being, and you'll also notice Rick isnt one of those people. Seriously; thousands upon thousands of posts about MJs anticancer effects, various extracts including ISO, isomerization, and the like, all these things Rick claimed to discover, invent, and promote to the public for the first time, beign discussed by doctors and patients and almost a million users and being carried over into public and medical policy, *all without the help of Rick, long before he claimed to create it*

All of this info was amassed, created, and diseminated without Rick at all. As the above poster said, there is a reason that every dispensary stocks BHO and not the Rick type oil. Despite what he says, theres nothing special about his oil. There is something special about pot, and it gets more special the purer it gets, but RSO is simply not very pure. Every postive effect from RSO that is geniune can be had with *any* other extract. He likes to lie and say the pressure and heat are needed to decarbpoxylate THC and thats why his oil is miraculous etc, but this is BS - dried cured herb is fully decarboxylated already (or it would'nt be psychoactive), and THC decarboxylates super fast in just isopropanol alone or even just spread thin on a plate in oxygen. All the pressure and heat does is burst the cell walls, releasing more of the secondary cannabinoids and a shit ton of extra crap. Butane also bursts the cell walls and extracts the secondary cannabinoids from within but doesnt extract out the crap.

All Im trying to get you to see is that this guy is misdirecting you, so you can learn some facts and maybe advance yourself. The majority of people aged 30+ know that this guy is a come lately huckster, remember that they made an oil using the same method in the seventies before Rick supposedly invented it, and know enough general science to see that his "science" is just mumbo jumbo jargon misapplied, its just a small but fanatic and vocal group of patients who first learned about extracts and the anticarcinogenic effects of pot from Rick whose fervor is preventing themselves from actually getting quality medicine and learning. The snake oil salesman of last century sold opiate tonics for pain, and they may have worked quite well for pain indeed, but we still call them snake oil peddlers because of the dishonesty, misdirection, and sciencey mumbo jumbo they used to sell their products. Crappy isopropanol extract does have curative powers, but you need to realize the magic is in the weed, not some dick named Rick.

Yorkshireman, may I suggest you use a hot water bath instead of a blow dryer? In my experience a blow dryer can strip away some of the lighter eesential oils and even caanabinoids very easily, while a hot bath is gentler. Its as easy as resting your dish on top of a smaller pot of boiling water. Works faster too bc of larger heated area.

 

[The Yorkshireman]

Seriously, go right now and check one of the snapshots of overgrow.com. That was a giant pot forum from before Rick ever appeared, that was busted about a decade ago.


Yorkshireman, may I suggest you use a hot water bath instead of a blow dryer? In my experience a blow dryer can strip away some of the lighter essential oils and even cannabinoids very easily, while a hot bath is gentler. Its as easy as resting your dish on top of a smaller pot of boiling water. Works faster too bc of larger heated area.

I have a copy of the overgrow.com archive, for the time that's was one damn big site for sure!

Of course but the hair dryer I have has various speed/heat settings and cool functions to be honest, it's not a case of me just blasting it with hot air.
I need to invest in a decent hotplate stirrer for the lab soon anyway so that will most probably be the tool of choice.

 

[thatguywhogrows]

Now then matey am well interested in seeing this other method ! Let me know when you're on it ! How does it work ?? Am always willing to try somehting new and know a lot of people on here have a lot of information to share !

Iv made myself some bubble hash too (only got small bags) but does the trick - never thought of using that in capsules for medicine ! lol

I just want the best method too so i can give this shit out for free ! Needs to be easy though lol

And are those sweeties the same thing - cancer cure etc ? thats sick im all over that ! epic

 

[The Yorkshireman]

Now then matey am well interested in seeing this other method ! Let me know when you're on it ! How does it work ?? Am always willing to try somehting new and know a lot of people on here have a lot of information to share !

Iv made myself some bubble hash too (only got small bags) but does the trick - never thought of using that in capsules for medicine ! lol

I just want the best method too so i can give this shit out for free ! Needs to be easy though lol

And are those sweeties the same thing - cancer cure etc ? thats sick im all over that ! epic

Sure no problem mate, all ways welcome as you know.
It'll be a couple of months yet but if you get some product before me than get in touch and I'll show you with your gear, it's absolutely no skin off my nose at all as I want everybody to be able to grow/produce better ganja/meds.
And yes this is the biggest and best site (apart from the elusive invitation only's) on the net, you just have to sift past the bullshit hype and ill informed folk to get to the good stuff these days.

You can type BHO into Youtube and get 100's of videos, some are OK, some are good, some are exceptional but ALL are better than Rick/Wernards oil.

Rather you than me giving it away for free mate, lol. Cancer stricken family members is one thing but growing illegal plants to produce a high quality product only to give it away is nuts!
Bubble hash goes for £25 a gram and BHO up to £50 a gram! Plus I personally would rather vape BHO than bud, it's hands down better and more enjoyable.

Yeah, anything with THC in will cure cancer.
THC kills ALL mutated cells, clinically proven (all though the powers that be will have you believe otherwise and you know yourself about the 'Cancer Act' we have in the UK, this is the biggest hurdle in my eyes).


£8 for 1000 gel caps (these size 0 are a little large, size 1 would be better but it's an example).
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1000-PCS-Empty-Gelatin-Capsules-SIZE-0-Gel-Caps-0-FREE-SHIP-/281103050366?pt=UK_Health_Beauty_Natural_AlternativeTherapies&hash=item41730c267e

Capsule filler.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Cap-M-Quik-capsule-filler-and-tamper-/281102429068?pt=UK_Health_Beauty_Vitamins_Supplements&hash=item417302ab8c

.......

 

[Sir.Ganga]

Sir.Ganja I think you have your wires crossed here, you can't vapourise something without heating it.

What do you mean? Eating a pill of oil doesn't vaporize anything, Vaporizing is one way and your right it will heat the thc and transform the acids into meds.

You have also quoted the first line of my post out of context when the rest goes on to explain the need for decarboxylation of THCA synthase to THC for consistent medicine, this is what happens at the point of vapourisation and what you mean when you refer to it being 'heated'.

That's kinda my point there is no heating BHO extraction. 180-220 degrees is the recommended heat range not vaporization. Vapourizing and smoking are the least effective way to ingest the meds and actually has less than half the effect.

Although I have added a decarb step if you understand a little high school chemistry then you will know that it's not actually needed providing your cannabis buds have been properly dried, the carboxyl group (carbon/oxygen) is removed over time as the buds dry (carbon and oxygen leaving the matter as evaporating water and carbon dioxide) converting THCA into THC..

It is the HEAT in the process that transforms the cannabinoids, and has nothing to do with dry material or other factors.

As we are interested in only harvesting cannabionoids and not the vegetable matter then decarboxylation occurs much much sooner in the trichome heads than it does the rest of the plant (simple surface area to air ratio evaporation), therefore no need to decarb BHO but a very real need to decarb alcohol extractions..

Well actually CBD's and CBN's can be found in the actual plant matter, THC also but in such smaller amounts. These are also a huge part of the medication.

You can endorse whichever method you like but it's advisable to understand the subject fully before attempting to correct somebody who does.

Sorry its not me that does not have a grasp of things. Decarbing can be done at a temp of a min of 185 degrees, a far cry from vaporizing, and yes decarbing is an absolute step to make these meds which unless you cook your oil, BHO has the least amount of meds when compare to other methods. If your using BHO to treat cancer or other dieases you are losing a big chunk of the meds.

 

[VladFromOG]

Ganga, you keep going on about heat beeing needed to decarboxylate THC, which is only partially true to begin with (regular old air and time does that as well), but when you are processing oil from dried cure bud, it is already almost fully decarboxylated. THC is inactive in its natural state; if the THC wasnt decarboxylated in your starting material (dried bud), no one could consume it for psychoactive effects before heat treating, which is clearly not the case. If you are starting from fresh, wet leaf/bud, then a simply drying beforehand is enough to decarboxylate.

You correctly mention that CBD and CBN make an important contribution to the extracts effects, and that these are (percentagewise) more in the cell walls. You incorrectly assume butane doesnt rupture cell walls. The extreme cold of liquid butane does do just that. Which is why if you want a pure THC isolate its best to butane extract keif (trichome glands) only, whereas if you like CBD and the other goodies you process whole leaf.

You incorrectly state that BHO is less pure. While that may be possible if one were to use contaminated butane (you should be doing a clean plate test every batch anyway), think about the impossiblility of that: You have one method (RSO) which leaves chlorophyll behind in the extract because the solvents used dissolve tannins chlorophyll and a ton of light oils like glycerin (and a lot of it, THC is white-yellow and CBN and CBD are light brown, so guess where that green black color is coming from; it cant be cannabinoids bc its the wrong color!), and another (BHO) that has a much higher affinity for cannabinoids, lower affinity for thin plant oils like glycerin, and no affinity for tannins and chlorophyll: which is why BHO regularly tests as pure cannabinoids, it only extracts cannabinoids. I've never seen a third party lab of any RSO that was over 60%.

As BHO is pure cannabinoids, and every *single* legitimate and published study done by the american and canadian cancer associations which indicate apostasis in gliomas and carcinomas were done using only pure isolated cannabinoids (not black/green sludge made of watered down cannabinoids), and considering that several of these studies administered a *a single dose* of said pure cannabinoids, its safe to expects that purer extracts (like BHO) will be more effective than lower strength concentrates. Which is why most docs recommend BHO.

Now, I now, ganga, youve got some evidencial writing from some blog run w=by Rick Simpson which negates all Im telling you and blah blah blah, but I tell you what - I'm lucky enough to be in a medical state, and around here we have a lot of business that exist solely to test weed and concentrates for their cannabinoid content. And dispensaries and folks send in a ton of samples, every batch, to get certified and to better help target specific illnesses. Such places are open to the public and some are as cheap as 20-40 bucks. If you want to put you money were your mouth is, feel free to tests some of your RSO. Then ask the lab to compare it with the average BHO they get. Seriously, just go see for yourself. I'd tell you about the ones that post results online so you can see how poorly RSO stacks up, but I want you to have your own batch tested so you dont just think that everyone is doing it wrong. But yes, there is a reason every dispensary carries BHO and not Rick Simpson (yes not just for vaping, in caps for oral too)

The simple physical fact is that a solvent that poorly dissolves lipids and wonderfully dissolves chlorophyll and tannins cannot create an extract with a higher percentage of lipids than a solvent that only dissolves lipids and not cholorophyll or tannins. To repeatedly insist otherwise (and to insult others who calmly and kindly point this out) only reveals that your ingorance is willful...

 

[Sir.Ganga]

Ganga, you keep going on about heat beeing needed to decarboxylate THC, which is only partially true to begin with (regular old air and time does that as well), but when you are processing oil from dried cure bud, it is already almost fully decarboxylated. THC is inactive in its natural state; if the THC wasnt decarboxylated in your starting material (dried bud), no one could consume it for psychoactive effects before heat treating, which is clearly not the case. If you are starting from fresh, wet leaf/bud, then a simply drying beforehand is enough to decarboxylate.

Im sorry but you only have half the facts and your mixing it all up? Naturally decarbing would take way to long, you do realize its the heat fluctuation of the day that causes decarbing. As your room air warms up it drys out naturally, this daily heat cold cycle is what you speak of I think? This process takes not months but years. For this reason its not a practical application for producing meds. Needless to say decarbing your oil and eating greens(not decarbed) is the only way to assure you are getting everything you can from this plant. I think the difference between us is you smoke your oil and I ingest it. Your BHO has no physoactive effect(or very little compared to once heated). Once you put a flame to it or vaporize is when the transformation happens. Give me a 5er of your BHO oil that hasn't been heated and I will eat it in one sitting, feeling very little(not because of your oil but my tolerance), do the same with any other oil including yours and heat it past 110 and I will sleep for 2 days.

You correctly mention that CBD and CBN make an important contribution to the extracts effects, and that these are (percentagewise) more in the cell walls. You incorrectly assume butane doesnt rupture cell walls. The extreme cold of liquid butane does do just that. Which is why if you want a pure THC isolate its best to butane extract keif (trichome glands) only, whereas if you like CBD and the other goodies you process whole leaf..

Incorrect, CBD'S and CBN'S are the major factors in this med. THC is the least effective of the actives.

The simple physical fact is that a solvent that poorly dissolves lipids and wonderfully dissolves chlorophyll and tannins cannot create an extract with a higher percentage of lipids than a solvent that only dissolves lipids and not cholorophyll or tannins. To repeatedly insist otherwise (and to insult others who calmly and kindly point this out) only reveals that your ingorance is willful...

Until you realize it not how clean it is, its whats in it that make the medicine. This last statement shows you are after the buzz not the meds, everything you just mentioned is all part of the medicine and if your only after the thc then yes BHO makes kick ass oil but for meds it does not have what us as patients need or require. Believe what you want, but honestly keep some ISO ready for when you get ill because your BHO is doing nothing but getting you high. You should have your BHO tested against ISO, you will see the ISO oil is packed with all the goodies your BHO doesn't have. These goodies are the lifes blood of this medicine. Im not here to argue, its my belief that everyone should be ingesting cannabis in any form. Do some more research its obvious you believe that BHO is a medicine but actually without decarbing and the other ingredients you have a very weak medicine.