Monsanto cannabis yes or no? The DNA Protection Act of 2013

[st0wandgrow]

Cannabineer. I disagree with you on this, but you do make a compelling argument.

Trousers, you just don't get it, or you're being intentionally obtuse. Labels don't=health risks. They can, but not always. You are trying your damnedest to frame this a certain way, and in the process ignoring simple logic. Food manufacturers are required to list ingredients of their products on labels. Most of those ingredients are perfectly safe, but it's a requirement none the less. I don't view GMO products/ingredients any differently. It wouldn't require a special label, or a warning tag ..... just full disclosure that the soy contained in this product is derived from gmo crops.

You act as though people wanting to know what's in their food is a ridiculous proposition. If I decide that red dye #5 is bad for me and my family, shouldn't I have the right to know what products contain it? Even if my fear is unfounded?

I have a healthy distrust of Corporate America, and our government which is in bed with them. I don't care what studies are trotted out by either group. People should have a right to know exactly what they are eating. For you to wish for anything less than that is mind boggling.

 

[Doer]

Thank you. You left me out. I like you too.

But, there is nothing "in" this food.

And you are ignoring how the Organix business would never exist if the opposition got their way with Labels.

And I will recognize that you don't seem to be such a Luddite that you wish to kill the GMO industry.

But, guys like youse are few and far between seems to me.

So, GLY can understand the widely place fake here, as well as, the widely placed block.

Label is just a battleground for the attempt to stamp out GMO. You are simply inconvenienced if you really are GLY.

If you are not the few GLY, then shame on you for trying to block science with lies.

And for the Sophies, that think AOrange, a war material, or DDT, a European invention, has any similarity to this you are wrong and under educated on subject.

 

[st0wandgrow]

Doer, Trousers, Canabineer. Let me ask you a question:

What is your fear here? Let's assume that the feds acquiesce to the demands of people, and force companies to label GMO products. Let's further assume that due to this labeling mandate, people refuse to buy these products and companies like Monsanto go out of business. What is the downside? Will farming cease to exist? Will we no longer have soy, corn, wheat, etc?

 

[Trousers]

Trousers, you just don't get it, or you're being intentionally obtuse.

You do not get it and you are being intentionally illogical.
You do not understand the can or worms you would open by forcing products to be labeled as having GMO. Every thing would have to be labeled and not just for warnings. I am sorry you can not wrap your head around this concept.

Labels don't=health risks. They can, but not always.

When the majority of the public are misinformed about GMO, forcing companies to label GMO is the same thing as a warning label. It is very easy to avoid GMO vegetables, fruits and grains if you want to.

You are trying your damnedest to frame this a certain way,

No, I am making light of your illogical opinion. You are not arguing logically, So I do not really know how to counter except to make fun of you.

and in the process ignoring simple logic.

That is part of your problem, you do not understand what you are talking about.
if you were some how able to persuade the government to force labeling of GMO products, how would you write the new rule?
What is the reason behind it?

If your reason is that is because GMO may be potentially hazardous to the environment, then you are going to have to label other foods that are bad for the environment.

Besides being a bad idea, it is impractical, unless you can clarify your stance.

Food manufacturers are required to list ingredients of their products on labels.

GMO is not an ingredient.

Most of those ingredients are perfectly safe, but it's a requirement none the less.

There is no requirement to source where the seeds come from or what the genetic make up is.

I don't view GMO products/ingredients any differently.

that is what you claim.

It wouldn't require a special label, or a warning tag ..... just full disclosure that the soy contained in this product is derived from gmo crops.

To do this a rule would have to be written. Could you tell me how this would be worded?

You act as though people wanting to know what's in their food is a ridiculous proposition.

No, that is just you talking out of your ass again.
I do not want vegetables, frutis and grains to be labeled for something that the general public would view as a hazard, when there is no hazard.

I also would not like all the unnecessary labeling that such a rule would require.

If I decide that red dye #5 is bad for me and my family, shouldn't I have the right to know what products contain it? Even if my fear is unfounded?

Red dye is not the same as fruit, vegetables and grains. There is a specific rule that says it must be included in the ingredients. I think you have a lot of unfounded fears.

I have a healthy distrust of Corporate America,

Says the guy who is typing on a machine made by a corporation, sitting in clothes probably purchased from a corporation that were made by a corporation...

Do you distrust 501(c)(3) corporations?

and our government which is in bed with them.

Good for you. This is irrelevant.
Did you look at the 600 studies?

I don't care what studies are trotted out by either group.

You do not care that there is not one study that shows GMO fruits, vegetables and grains are bad, while there are 600 studies that say GMO crops are perfectly safe?

That is your hot mess.

You talk about limiting information to the general public, yet you do not care about the best evidence that is available.
You are a hypocrite.

People should have a right to know exactly what they are eating.

They have the choice to buy organic if they wish to avoid GMO crops.

For you to wish for anything less than that is mind boggling.

Your mind is easily boggled, go take a nap.


You want people to have a tiny bit of bad information and you do not care about the best information that is available.


It is really hard to argue with someone that is so illogical.


Could you rewrite the labeling procedure?
Can't wait to see it.


Here is the FDA guidelines on food labeling:
http://www.fda.gov/Food/GuidanceRegulation/GuidanceDocumentsRegulatoryInformation/LabelingNutrition/ucm2006828.htm

I have many issues related to it, but they involve facts, not junk science based fear.

 

[Trousers]

Doer, Trousers, Canabineer. Let me ask you a question:

What is your fear here?

I fear labeling foods based on fear based junk science. I fear people like you and your willingness to ignore the best evidence available instead of bullshit lies.

I fear you and the fact that you are allowed to vote.

Let's assume that the feds acquiesce to the demands of people, and force companies to label GMO products. Let's further assume that due to this labeling mandate, people refuse to buy these products and companies like Monsanto go out of business. What is the downside? Will farming cease to exist? Will we no longer have soy, corn, wheat, etc?

That is a lot of assuming. Rewrite the food labeling rules that the FDA has come up with and I will let you know what I think.
It is cute how you still cling to the notion about Monsanto having the GMO market to themselves.

Is forcing a corporation out of business because of lies really fair? Is that how you operate? Using lies and deception to get what you want? People say that evil corporations do that.

You can talk all you want about how evil monsanto is, but using evil to destroy them is evil.

 

[st0wandgrow]

I fear labeling foods based on fear based junk science. I fear people like you and your willingness to ignore the best evidence available instead of bullshit lies.

I fear you and the fact that you are allowed to vote.




That is a lot of assuming. Rewrite the food labeling rules that the FDA has come up with and I will let you know what I think.
It is cute how you still cling to the notion about Monsanto having the GMO market to themselves.

Is forcing a corporation out of business because of lies really fair? Is that how you operate? Using lies and deception to get what you want? People say that evil corporations do that.

You can talk all you want about how evil monsanto is, but using evil to destroy them is evil.

"I fear labeling foods based on fear based junk science. I fear people like you and your willingness to ignore the best evidence available instead of bullshit lies."

So, you have nothing. No rational reason to take the position that you have. You just like to hear yourself blather.

I'll tell you what I fear. A world full of farmers that have abandoned sustainable practices for the easy approach of planting magic seeds and spraying the fuck out of them with harmful chemicals thereby killing the fertility of the soil and contaminating water supplies .... and all of the ramifications that come with that. I'm sure you dump all sorts of shit on your marijuana plants too. Check out the One Straw Revolution pdf I posted a few pages back. You might learn something.

"I fear you and the fact that you are allowed to vote."

Yes, we know. You're the only one with a clue from your endless hours of bickering on a weed forum.

"It is cute how you still cling to the notion about Monsanto having the GMO market to themselves."

I didn't say that. I said "companies like Monsanto". Learn to read. If you weren't so busy running your mouth your reading comprehension might be a bit better.

"Is forcing a corporation out of business because of lies really fair? Is that how you operate? Using lies and deception to get what you want? People say that evil corporations do that."

What lies? If a product is genetically modified, is labeling it as such a lie? Again, I'm not suggesting that GMO's are unsafe. People are free to come to their own conclusion on that, and Monsanto et al are free to market their product as safe, backed up what ever data they can provide. What's the rub?

Once again, you bring little to the discussion. You've repeated the same nonsense a dozen times, and all you've accomplished is clarifying that your are an opinionated half-wit. I bet you have the same stunned look on your face as that kid in your avatar.

 

[Doer]

Doer, Trousers, Canabineer. Let me ask you a question:

What is your fear here? Let's assume that the feds acquiesce to the demands of people, and force companies to label GMO products. Let's further assume that due to this labeling mandate, people refuse to buy these products and companies like Monsanto go out of business. What is the downside? Will farming cease to exist? Will we no longer have soy, corn, wheat, etc?

It seems a reasonable question. But, it isn't. It assumes again you have anything like enough Citizens to force the fed's acquiesce to the demands of people.

That is pure sophistry. The demands of the people in these United States blocked it, blocked you, and blocked all labeling pleas, etc.

OTOH, let's say you did have enough people convinced, even in the lack of evidence and by fear, it would mean the end of GMO in self rule. The Luddites blocked progress with fear.

OTOF, let's say some real science did emerge. Well then, WE the Peps will stop GMO in this country like we did DDT and CFC and any other bit of alphabet soup in the list.

 

[st0wandgrow]

It seems a reasonable question. But, it isn't. It assumes again you have anything like enough Citizens to force the fed's acquiesce to the demands of people.

That is pure sophistry. The demands of the people in these United States blocked it, blocked you, and blocked all labeling pleas, etc.

OTOH, let's say you did have enough people convinced, even in the lack of evidence and by fear, it would mean the end of GMO in self rule. The Luddites blocked progress with fear.

OTOF, let's say some real science did emerge. Well then, WE the Peps will stop GMO in this country like we did DDT and CFC and any other bit of alphabet soup in the list.

Fair enough. I appreciate the response, but I guess what I was getting at is what do you feel the potential negatives of not having GMO products on our shelves would be? Do you have a position on that, or are you neutral?

Are there any substantiated down sides to GMO's going the way of the dinosaur?

 

[Antidisestablishmentarian]

Increased pesticide and herbicide use. Less food. More expensive food. More deaths due to hunger in other countries.

 

[DNAprotection]

(IMO) For the industry in general 'labeling' merely serves as a diversionary negotiations/debate tool (diverting from discussions on patenting life etc and the possible repercussions of messing with equations when you dont know all the numbers etc(genetic sequencing and its domino fall out)) and ultimately serves as a delaying tactic...by the time the 'labeling debate' is through we will have become far to dependent on genetically engineered crops to afford any discussion pertaining to the more critically relevant issues at stake...(imo)

 

[ChesusRice]

(IMO) For the industry in general 'labeling' merely serves as a diversionary negotiations/debate tool (diverting from discussions on patenting life etc and the possible repercussions of messing with equations when you dont know all the numbers etc(genetic sequencing and its domino fall out)) and ultimately serves as a delaying tactic...by the time the 'labeling debate' is through we will have become far to dependent on genetically engineered crops to afford any discussion pertaining to the more critically relevant issues at stake...(imo)

Which is what?
Because nothing you say is relevant or critical
Sell your snake oil someplace else

 

[DNAprotection]

lol...looked in a mirror lately sweathog?

 

[ChesusRice]

 

[Trousers]

So, you have nothing. No rational reason to take the position that you have. You just like to hear yourself blather.

You are being illogical and as noted before, using sophistry.
You are not attacking my ideas or the reality of the situation.

You admitted to not caring about the best information available, but you want people to be given a tiny bit of bad information?
I offer links and explanations and you say I have nothing.

Have you read the labeling guidelines yet?
How would you write the new GMO rule?

I'll tell you what I fear. A world full of farmers that have abandoned sustainable practices for the easy approach of planting magic seeds and spraying the fuck out of them with harmful chemicals thereby killing the fertility of the soil and contaminating water supplies .... and all of the ramifications that come with that.

This is not really on topic. Sustainable practices were widely abandoned long before monsanto existed. You are just rambling now.

I'm sure you dump all sorts of shit on your marijuana plants too.

You must enjoy being wrong, you are very good at it. I grow soil organic and only feed with homemade teas, brah.

Check out the One Straw Revolution pdf I posted a few pages back. You might learn something.

I have forgotten more about farming than you will ever know. What is your point?

Yes, we know. You're the only one with a clue from your endless hours of bickering on a weed forum.

Yawn, personal attacks. Is that the best you can do?

I didn't say that. I said "companies like Monsanto". Learn to read. If you weren't so busy running your mouth your reading comprehension might be a bit better.

I think you can do better than that. I can.

What lies?

Really? They are everywhere.

How about GMO causes cancer?
http://www.motherearthnews.com/natural-health/gmo-safety-zmgz13amzsto.aspx#axzz2dCoZYWCp

You can go to the Natural News if you want to read a bunch of lies.
There are lies like this everywhere. Most people, you included, do not really understand what GMO actually means. Most people think that GMO vegetables, fruits and grains are bad for you based on propaganda and lies.

Labeling foods GMO would be a negative warning label, based on propaganda, lies and misinformation.

If a product is genetically modified, is labeling it as such a lie?

It implies a hazard where none exists. We've been through this.

Again, I'm not suggesting that GMO's are unsafe.

Then why do they need to be labeled?
There are foods that are unsafe and not labeled. Why not worry about those foods?
We've been through this.

People are free to come to their own conclusion on that,

The general public is dangerously misinformed. Mob rule should not prevail over reason.
You still have not come up with a practical way to insert the rule in the FDA labeling regulations.

and Monsanto et al are free to market their product as safe, backed up what ever data they can provide. What's the rub?

We've been through this.

Once again, you bring little to the discussion.

You bring sophistry. you change the subject and go off on tangents. You ignore the best available information.

You've repeated the same nonsense a dozen times, and all you've accomplished is clarifying that your are an opinionated half-wit. I bet you have the same stunned look on your face as that kid in your avatar.

You act like a child and you argue like one.

 

[Samwell Seed Well]

soph·ist·ry
ˈsäfəstrē/
noun
noun: sophistry
1.
the use of fallacious arguments, esp. with the intention of deceiving.


Products that contain GM foods shouldnt be labeled as such, labels only purpose is to infer warning


some labels on packaging are their as a warning( like: this product was processed in a factory that also process peanuts beware of possible cross contamination)

so that means all labels are a warning to infer possible harm or risk

Informal fallacy^

 

[ChesusRice]

Trousers
Just ended the thread

 

[Doer]

Fair enough. I appreciate the response, but I guess what I was getting at is what do you feel the potential negatives of not having GMO products on our shelves would be? Do you have a position on that, or are you neutral?

Are there any substantiated down sides to GMO's going the way of the dinosaur?

As far as I and many have looked, and I am a professional reader of peer review, there is no established downside, at all. And that is all the way back to the dinosaurs in fact.

We know now, from blood extracted from insects in amber, virus was busy with GM since then and presumably before.

So, the negative is not slightly lower yield, per se. If the US planting season was shut down by Court injunction based on fear alone, 85% of the corn crop would not be planted and a similar amount of soya, cotton, wheat, etc would not be grown. 85%.

So, that had to be written into the Farm Bill, sadly to protect the farmers. Yet, hippy lawyers cynically made $$ millions opposing it as the Monsanto Protection Act. The Farmer's Protection and WE were not fooled.

It does not make it any less shameful or make Sophia, over there, any less culpable in attempting to rip off the American Farmer.

 

[Samwell Seed Well]

soph·ist·ry
ˈsäfəstrē/
noun
noun: sophistry
1.
the use of fallacious arguments, esp. with the intention of deceiving.


Products that contain GM foods shouldnt be labeled as such, labels only purpose is to infer warning


some labels on packaging are their as a warning( like: this product was processed in a factory that also process peanuts beware of possible cross contamination)

so that means all labels are a warning to infer possible harm or risk

Informal fallacy^

Trousers
Just ended the thread

huh self proclaimed as usual

 

[ChesusRice]

huh self proclaimed as usual

 

[Samwell Seed Well]

soph·ist·ry
ˈsäfəstrē/
noun
noun: sophistry
1.
the use of fallacious arguments, esp. with the intention of deceiving.


Products that contain GM foods shouldnt be labeled as such, labels only purpose is to infer warning


some labels on packaging are their as a warning( like: this product was processed in a factory that also process peanuts beware of possible cross contamination)

so that means all labels are a warning to infer possible harm or risk

Informal fallacy^

yall can keep mis using all teh words you like . .and try to dis credit without substance all you like

i have no doubt GMO will be a label i could care less if they stop GMing food . . . .just like i quit eating at fast food places a long time ago . . i dont boycott them and i dont tell you to . . . .but if they tried to package Mc D's in my local deli as ready made deli food . . .id def have something to say about it . .so cry all you want my moral objective is sound . . yall got nothing when it comes to reasons . . just excuses baseless personal attacks . . .as usual ...if you cant come up with a idea or point attack those who oppose you with slang and deceptive wording . . . like sophistry that keeps being tossed around by mini me and the parrot

to funny you dont even have a grasp of English language you use . . .