4x Thai, AK47, Strawberry Cough, Silver Haze - 8 weeks VEG!

Jester88 said:

kill-a-might

kills any bugs ive had lol.. pretty toxic stuff ya cant use it during flower really and i like to spray it off once infestation is gone

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I would to if I had too use that shit.

'Camphor' is the word we're lookin for here. It's an insect repellent, and it 'can' be natural. But that's the smell of mothballs. I wouldn't fucking use anything that smelt like that unless it is a last resort, but I'm sure it fucking works, and if it saves a crop, then it had to be done. Other than that,
Can you use to much neem? I'm sure you can. At least your thinning out the bottoms Tron.
Watering is a art I believe. Not that it's introverted and fucked up like most artists, but like you got to go by feel sometimes, like 'growinman' is talking about. There are so many variables concerning watering with a natural soil grow that the hydro guys are happy to avoid.
For soil you need to have the time to catch a plant in it's 'droopy thirst', or learn how to avoid such situations is better. You need to be able to lift a pot and know when it's going to need a drink. These are all good points.
It isn't difficult with the right amount of practice.
If you want to grow natural, you got to be natural, and available, to get the shit right.
Weight of pot, droop cycles, are all indicators that go with growing in a container full of soil.
It's an 'organic' talent that is best learnt through discovery, which may involve failure at times, but we're all growing buds, and the rewards are worth it.

Mammath said:

I would to if I had too use that shit.

'Camphor' is the word we're lookin for here. It's an insect repellent, and it 'can' be natural. But that's the smell of mothballs. I wouldn't fucking use anything that smelt like that unless it is a last resort, but I'm sure it fucking works, and if it saves a crop, then it had to be done. Other than that,
Can you use to much neem? I'm sure you can. At least your thinning out the bottoms Ton.
Watering is a art I believe. Not that it's introverted and fucked up like most artists, but like you got to go by feel sometimes, like 'growinman' is talking about. There are so many variables concerning watering with a natural soil grow that the hydro guys are happy to avoid.
For soil you need to have the time to catch a plant in it's 'droopy thirst', or learn how to avoid such situations is better. You need to be able to lift a pot and know when it's going to need a drink. These are all good points.
It isn't difficult with the right amount of practice.
If you want to grow natural, you got to be natural, and available, to get the shit right.
Weight of pot, droop cycles, are all indicators that go with growing in a container full of soil.
It's an 'organic' talent that is best learnt through discovery, which may involve failure at times, but we're all growing buds, and the rewards are worth it.

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They've never been to dry, and not overwatered I think. Even when they are flushed, they come back around in like 3 hours and they look their most healthy.

One thing of note. I have all my plants in Black Gold Organic - OMRI listed except one plant. It is in Black Gold with the red label and the "ancecote" delivery system or whatever. That plant is in the largest pot and it looks the healthiest out of all the rest. She was the smallest some time ago but has now just passed the largest to claim that titler as her own. Maybe my soil has something to do with it, and goes along with my macro nute suspicion. The one in fertilized soil is doing the best.

I tend to use the "weight" check for my plants also. I need to know get a better idea of what they weigh when they are dry tho I think. But I've been pretty good at doing as you said. Catching them when they have a watering symptom and fixing them. One thing I have never done since they have been in the 5 gallon pots, is water until I see runoff. I just flushed them a week ago, at the start of flowering. But other than the flushes. I never have run off. Should I start doing this?

I'm thinking that I have a deficiency. Maybe magnesium or magnese/zinc. My symptoms could fit either one. Today was the first day it was so pronnounced tho, like it just hit much harder. Which made me think, to much neem? But I only applied it once so far, and it was alot - enough to get it all, like advised, but its something to consider.

The hesi product I'm using is the 1 part coco mix. That could have something to do with it also.

And lastly, I do not ph my soil. I kow this is crucial, but the ph probe thing I got is almost impossible to read. It never changes. So either my soil is always perfect, or my tester is a pos.

i go by feel too. especially outdoors

also when i use kill a might i dont hit the plants hard. umm but in all honesty (neem) as long as ya dont overkill the plants in it they should be fine. the shit im usings way more toxic but im only using a little and outdoors just saying that it works if ya left with no other option but i seriously wouldnt use it in flower.

Other than the fact I need to see some pics, your doing a hell of a job there.
I know you got your shit together and you have a passion for the smoke.
It's easy to critique from afar.
I really want to see some damn Thai weed. You've set the babies up nicely.
Moving on,
Run off is a good thing, certainly when flushing, but only you know what your methods are and you work with it.
Run off = less build up of salts, but if you flush frequently, that doesn't matter.
Stick with what's working for you.
I don't think you have a watering prob', nor do I think you may have a deficiency.
What you got is mites, and you've had to kill them as best you can, naturally, with the neem.
I'm sure they'll recover. Plants that is.
Lets see some pics of the damage when you get a chance.
Lastly, PH is important, but the 'happy ph window' is so much more forgiving in soil.
They'll come good.

I absolutely love how short and shruby your plants are! They look amazing!! I'm definitely going to try that with our next grow!! It would sooo help maximize the light from the CFL.

Mammath said:

Other than the fact I need to see some pics, your doing a hell of a job there.
I know you got your shit together and you have a passion for the smoke.
It's easy to critique from afar.
I really want to see some damn Thai weed. You've set the babies up nicely.
Moving on,
Run off is a good thing, certainly when flushing, but only you know what your methods are and you work with it.
Run off = less build up of salts, but if you flush frequently, that doesn't matter.
Stick with what's working for you.
I don't think you have a watering prob', nor do I think you may have a deficiency.
What you got is mites, and you've had to kill them as best you can, naturally, with the neem.
I'm sure they'll recover. Plants that is.
Lets see some pics of the damage when you get a chance.
Lastly, PH is important, but the 'happy ph window' is so much more forgiving in soil.
They'll come good.

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Wow, I really didn't realize he had had mites.......thought it was gnats.....'cause the GoGNATS is great for getting them out.....and the smell was only there a day or two; no taste/smell in the buds.....I am not into smoking nasty bud either.

Mites??? kill a mite?? AVID or Floramite..........cant be beaten, imo, if your infested as I once was.....cant use it on a budding plant, so you have to work it up the chain starting with your rooted clones, sterilizing everything as you go....pain in the ass. Prevention is the best measure. Neem is a great control, as are most of the other products like organicide, permithrins(sp), ed rosenthal's sh*t--- I spent literally 100's and 100's and hours and hours and all I did was 'control' and stressed the plants. Yeah, AVID is a nuke, chem, not good for you shit......is why you start with the rooted clones in another area (finish your flowering , then sterilize, repaint, whatever it takes.......)then bring in your mite-free clones and go for it.......chem free from there(as soon as you get the treated leaf off down the road......)

Sorry guys.......smoked too much again...haha.......

And the grow is looking great Tronica!!

growinman said:

Wow, I really didn't realize he had had mites.......thought it was gnats.....'cause the GoGNATS is great for getting them out.....and the smell was only there a day or two; no taste/smell in the buds.....I am not into smoking nasty bud either.

Mites??? kill a mite?? AVID or Floramite..........cant be beaten, imo,

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Kill-A-Might is some pretty hardcore shit 2 ive found gets rid of everything thats y i said itd prolly work im the same i like shit thats guaranteed to kill the infestation

growinman said:

Wow, I really didn't realize he had had mites.......thought it was gnats.....'cause the GoGNATS is great for getting them out.....and the smell was only there a day or two; no taste/smell in the buds.....I am not into smoking nasty bud either.

Mites??? kill a mite?? AVID or Floramite..........cant be beaten, imo, if your infested as I once was.....cant use it on a budding plant, so you have to work it up the chain starting with your rooted clones, sterilizing everything as you go....pain in the ass. Prevention is the best measure. Neem is a great control, as are most of the other products like organicide, permithrins(sp), ed rosenthal's sh*t--- I spent literally 100's and 100's and hours and hours and all I did was 'control' and stressed the plants. Yeah, AVID is a nuke, chem, not good for you shit......is why you start with the rooted clones in another area (finish your flowering , then sterilize, repaint, whatever it takes.......)then bring in your mite-free clones and go for it.......chem free from there(as soon as you get the treated leaf off down the road......)

Sorry guys.......smoked too much again...haha.......

And the grow is looking great Tronica!!

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Yeh, the Avid and Floramite is what I was thinking. The mites have not really done any damage tho. I caught them early and since I hit them with Neem I have not seen any live mites. Only found a few dead ones and a few eggs.

My "new growth" - the lower part of the plant is dying very fast. Like the leaves almost "fall off" when you just shake the plant a little. There is more wilted leaves than I've ever seen on them before. It's was another small handful (20 or so leaves) from each of the thai plants today. Only the bottom leaves are falling off.

Now the upper leaves have their issue as well. They are curling just slightly, but not from a burn (heat or nute) and they are turning a light shade of green down the middle of the spines on each blade. They are also a little softer on this area, and "wrinkly".
Some other leafs are showing a few brownish spots on them.

I'm very convinced I have a deficiency of some kind. My gf is taking some pics of leaves I'm about to upload.

As far as it goes, I transplanted an AK clone today and bought some new kinds of water.

I was doing some reading on Seltzer water. It contains co2 and can be used as a foliar spray from the underside of your leaves. So I did some of that when I turned the lights on this evening. I also had someone else recommend Sparkling Water. I found a few bottles, one had 40mg sodium in it, and the other had 10mg. Club Soda will do what Seltzer water will do also, but has sodium and that can clog the stomata. It has 40mg also. Now the Sparkling Water I got says right on the bottle "co2 enriched" and it was an expensive bottle of stuff. It has some sodium but very little. I'm going to use that one just one plant and give it water spray downs every 3 days, while the others will get Seltzer and get water spray downs every week.

I don't think it's something that many growers use, but it's something I can do cheaply.

Hopefully getting a few 10.0 ubv repti-glows soon as well.

Ok, so the first leaf is one that did have mite damage on it. This is not typical of my leafs that look like this, and there are not many. Most do not have any mite damage. What were trying to identify is the brown spots.

The second could have been a better leaf showing the damage, but it works. There are some that have that light green discoloration alot more and have a really wrinkly texture.

And the third is a shitty pic from the HPS, but it kind of shows some dmg on the ak from this new problem.

......honestly cant say I've ever seen this.....I 'd be guessing..:heat? +....? That's not one of those lower leafs, is it?(2nd pic). The lower ones I 'd think may be a combo of things. What have you sprayed, etc....... How late in flower....those edges look dark towards the outside?----would be phosphorus def left from veg.......

Check this out: http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=11688 stitches guide--good read for the basics or where to start on a lot of these things

.......and I bet you still have a mite or two...............just saying keep your eyes open.......as I am sure you do

growinman said:

......honestly cant say I've ever seen this.....I 'd be guessing..:heat? +....? That's not one of those lower leafs, is it?(2nd pic). The lower ones I 'd think may be a combo of things. What have you sprayed, etc....... How late in flower....those edges look dark towards the outside?----would be phosphorus def left from veg.......

Check this out: http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=11688 stitches guide--good read for the basics or where to start on a lot of these things

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I have a good peice of literature called "Marijuana Garden Saver" problem is my def looks and sounds like it could be Phos, Mag, MG/Zinc.

I will persure the info in that link tho, thanks.

And I have only sprayed Neem Oil as of yet. My temps are around 79-80, but I don't think they are heat burns or your standard nute burn.

Thanks for the input.

Haha, thats great. Many of the pics and info in that thread are taken directy from my book.

I'm starting to lean towards Magnese Def. I'm thinking some epsom salt in a foliar spray maybe?

Anyone have any suggestions?

Would it be safe to say thats a better (faster acting) solution than getting a micro nutrient to water with?

Tronica said:

I have a good peice of literature called "Marijuana Garden Saver" problem is my def looks and sounds like it could be Phos, Mag, MG/Zinc.

I will persure the info in that link tho, thanks.

And I have only sprayed Neem Oil as of yet. My temps are around 79-80, but I don't think they are heat burns or your standard nute burn.

Thanks for the input.

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was just catching up.....

thats what i was thinking when looking at the picws so im thinking maybe were right. for the mag deficiency just give em some epsom salts

I was just doing some research on this grow and discovered that you were 'given the mites.' On some plants?
Fuck me, never, under any circumstances, accept such contaminated gifts. Never.
Spider mite is an absolute fucker, it's one of the few mortal enemies to MJ, other than 'too much care'.
Fuck I'm disappointed.
Anyway,
Spray the ES, or better still get some into your next watering, it won't hurt.
A few leaves means 'jack shit' but it won't hurt.
As for helpful advice, look into 'Canna Terra' nutes. I use Canna Substra and it is the shit. The 'terra' has got to be good for a soil grow.
All the best on the recovery

Yeh, the mites suck, but I will get rid of them. I'm confident. For now it's just - finish this crop and pay bills!
I will spray them with F3 again in 3 days and keep up a 7 day spray schedule until the Ak/Cough are 4 weeks in, and on the others for 6 weeks. This could kill the mites altogether, but thats wishful thinking. What it should do tho is keep them from really doing anything. My last spray killed all the adults, the next will get eggs that hatch and the next after that will get more and more.

The plants might not like it, but they'll endure I think.

I will get some Floramite or Avid and be rid of them for good in the future.

I had gotten rid of them for awhile after I got my clones, I mean those things did not have any mites on them after the first day. I dunked them in Garden Safe Fungicide3 (has a miticide in it) Sprayed them with Neem, and wiped down every single leaf by hand on them when they came. What probably happened was a mite go into the carpet and stayed dormant for awhile, like a full month and then they popped back up.

I made the mistake of not spraying preventative sprays after I got rid of them. What I'll have to do now is just keep them from getting any kind of stronger foothold in my garden while these finish and I'll keep my other plants vegging for slightly longer. That way when these are harvested, my others will only be a few weeks into flower and I can dunk them in Flora or Avid, spray down my entire garden, and go from there.

Those products KILL mites, but they are pretty rough on the plants. It will be worth it tho because after that I feel confident I will never get mites again just thro preventative methods.

As far as nutes go, I'm going to switch to AN's connosuier line on my next grow. With Big Bud, Diamond Nectar, Voodoo Juice, Tarantula, KoolBloom, and BMO's super plant tonic ass my additives. No Carbo Load because I'm going to stick with molasses. Tho next run I will make my ownworm casting / guano / molasses tea with a bubbler tea maker.

I'm sold on AN nutes. I haev a buddy who ran some AN nutes against GH's series and the difference was intense. As much so as the "nutrient challenge" on youtube made it look. I would have already bought everything, and sold my 360 to do it, but I'm waiting for them to release the PH perfect nutrients first. Self adjusting ph even in soil.

One thing I'm thinking. Since I've been in the same 5 gallon buckets, and same soil for like 2 months on each plant, and each has had like 5 flushes. That increases the chances of some micro nutes not being available in the soil anymore and would validate the reason why the only plant in newer soil (which has only 2 flushes thro it) is the only plant not really showing symptoms. So if my Epsom bath doesn't do the trick, I may try some kind of transplant. Tho into what size pot I have no idea.... maybe the giant rubbermaids?

Hopefully that won't be neccessary. Tomorrow I will go buy my epsom salt and give them a spray down when the lights go off.

Many thanks for all the advice guys, really, thanks a ton for taking the time to follow my grow. I appreciate all the input. Books can only teach me so much, without you guys and your first hand experience I would be pulling teeth!

hey man sweet growing! cant wait to see how that strawberry cough turns out, reckon you should get some more pictures of the bud and grim the dog

Yay for pictures.

Right out of the cab before lights on so theyre kind of droppy. My lights off temp has been about 66-67. Humidity is getting as high as 95%. Hopefully warmer weather will get here before the buds get big enough to worry about that. But yeh, the leaves are not all perky becasue of it. But they're really happy about that watering they got the other day. Every plant grew about 4 inches in the last 2 days and they've been reaching for that light. Which I'm still keeping about 6-8" away. I had to raise my lights today. And I sprayed all the undersides with leaves with selzter water right after I took the pics and before putting them in the closet.

I am saying - fuck the yeast/sugar co2. The stuff is just a pain in the ass. I might try and get a co2 bucket if I get enough cash in time.

I'm going to try and pull 1.5 lbs off this harvest. What do you guys think? I vegged for a long time and have 1k watts. Anyways, I'm figuring if I can get like 10-15% from co2, it'll justify the purchase of one of those buckets.

My clones are doing good. I think I might lose one of the strawberries in rooters. It has some brown growth shit on it. Could be nothing, could be a bacteria or a fungi, pythelium or something? Isn't that the common root fungi? Whatever. Not trippin' I'll look it up later. The 2 ak clones that got the neem are a little burnt, but they'll prolly root too.

Tronica said:

I have a good peice of literature called "Marijuana Garden Saver" problem is my def looks and sounds like it could be Phos, Mag, MG/Zinc.

I will persure the info in that link tho, thanks.

And I have only sprayed Neem Oil as of yet. My temps are around 79-80, but I don't think they are heat burns or your standard nute burn.

Thanks for the input.

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If you are using unfiltered tap water I can almost assure you with 100% certainty that you are experiencing a Magnesium deficiency.

You were right on the epsom salt, but if you are using tap water, you're having a lock-out of Mg because of high levels of calcium in the water.

Start with 1 teaspoon epsom salt per gallon of water per feeding. If that doesn't work, try just a little bit more until you find a happy medium.

diggitydank420 said:

If you are using unfiltered tap water I can almost assure you with 100% certainty that you are experiencing a Magnesium deficiency.

You were right on the epsom salt, but if you are using tap water, you're having a lock-out of Mg because of high levels of calcium in the water.

Start with 1 teaspoon epsom salt per gallon of water per feeding. If that doesn't work, try just a little bit more until you find a happy medium.

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I was using unfiltered tap water. It is low ppm tap, but tap nonetheless.

I didn't get around to getting the epsom today but they seem to be better since I watered with Hessi and mollasses the other day anyways.

I will remember to get some tomorrow so I can foliar with it and water with it the day after.

Thanks for the confirmation.

I have not sprayed with epsom salt just yet. I actually forgot to get it today, pretty odd for me. But they seem to be doing a little better since the last watering with Hessi and mollasses.