Fresh 2 De@th
Well-Known Member
trying to understand this, and basically what i've come to if you're buds dry too quick you've basically missed the chance to cure them, am i right?
A perfect cure every time
- Thread starter SimonD
- Start date
guy incognito
Well-Known Member
Hygrometers do measure relative humidity, not absolute humidity.
Absolute humidity is the mass of water vapor compared to the mass of air, and it remains constant in a closed sealed environment (not accounting for things like plant respiration, humidifiers, dehumidifiers, AC, etc). If you seal a jar the mass of water vapor inside is going to stay the same, the water can not go anywhere. When the temp drops in my grow room the absolute humidity stays the same, but the relative humidity changes as a function of the temperature. This is the same reason we get condensation outside as dew. As the temperature drops the relative humidity increases, until the air is saturated and dew starts forming.
Where this was going was to demonstrate the difference between absolute and relative humidity giving you a real world example of another sealed and contained area besides a jar.
Fresh 2 De@th
Well-Known Member
hmm, you talk as if this is fact. do you have any proof other than what you suspect? there are some people that would beg to differ, me being one of them, but if the're is any facts to what you say i would accept or receive it much better than what someone believes.
guy incognito
Well-Known Member
At 70*F and 50% relative humidity there is approximately 0.008 lbs water vapor per pound of dry air (This is a measure of absolute humidity). If you heat that up to 85*F it will still have 0.008 lbs of water per lb of dry air, that can't change as no water vapor can enter or exit, and neither can any dry air molecules, but the relative humidity will only be about 30%. Follow the red lines i've placed on the psychrometric chart below.
If you follow the horizontal red line to the left, past the 70* mark, you can see you will eventually hit the saturation curve (ie relative humidity = 100%) at about 50*F. So if it was 70*F and 50% humidity outside, and the temperature dropped to below 50*F you will start getting dew condensing because the air will be saturated with water, it cannot physically hold anymore so it's condensing out.
I deal with relative and absolute humidity every day in my profession, I understand how it works. A 15*F swing can, and will effect relative humidity.
I have not done this method, and I do not know what role semi dry marijuana in a jar will have on the relative humidity inside the jar. I just want to clear up some apparent misconceptions on what hygrometers measure, and the difference between absolute and relative humidity relative to temperature.
If you follow the horizontal red line to the left, past the 70* mark, you can see you will eventually hit the saturation curve (ie relative humidity = 100%) at about 50*F. So if it was 70*F and 50% humidity outside, and the temperature dropped to below 50*F you will start getting dew condensing because the air will be saturated with water, it cannot physically hold anymore so it's condensing out.
I deal with relative and absolute humidity every day in my profession, I understand how it works. A 15*F swing can, and will effect relative humidity.
I have not done this method, and I do not know what role semi dry marijuana in a jar will have on the relative humidity inside the jar. I just want to clear up some apparent misconceptions on what hygrometers measure, and the difference between absolute and relative humidity relative to temperature.
SimonD
Well-Known Member
As I've said twice before, there's not enough air inside a sealed curing container to make a meaningful difference in the readings. It's a lot smaller than your sealed growroom.
The absolute humidity in your growroom can't stay the same due to transpiration. It's a fact, not a guess. We've been here, as well.
To be honest, we're only concerned with what happens inside the jar and are happy to leave the meteorologic discussions to other forums. Thank you for the explanation; I'm sure that some found it useful. Now let's move on.
Simon
mantiszn
Well-Known Member
do you know what IMO means?
obviously not .. or you wouldn't have made this statement.
you can beg to differ all you like, believe what you want and dry your buds as quickly as you can..
if you want proof look for it, I'm not your assistant..
personally I make decisions based on my experiences..
obviously not .. or you wouldn't have made this statement.
you can beg to differ all you like, believe what you want and dry your buds as quickly as you can..
if you want proof look for it, I'm not your assistant..
personally I make decisions based on my experiences..
guy incognito
Well-Known Member
You can say it as many times as you like but the chemistry applies regardless of volume. Change the temperature and you change the relative humidity. I suspect that since most of the volume inside the jar is marijuana (and not air) that it would have a dampening effect on the humidity swings (ie RH increases and the weed will absorb more moisture making the RH of the air lower, and when RH decreases the mj will release more moisture making the RH higher).
It also can't stay the same because of the dehumidifier and air conditioner. My point wasn't that the grow room is a static environment, my point is that when temp goes down, relative humidity increases, and vice versa. You can notice this in your grow room with a rapid change in temperature (up or down) despite transpiration.
Agreed, but I believe the meteorological discussions is applicable, not only to this specific case but to growing in general. I haven't got my hygrometers and tried this method yet, i'm just trying to anticipate potential problems based on my knowledge of how humidity works. Most people do not get the education to understand what absolute and relative humidity are and how they are affected by temperature unless they get a technical degree in the sciences at university. Even among the college educated I find most of them do not have a fundamental understanding of the science. I also see examples on this forum of people that do not understand how it works. I would hate to be checking my jars at 70* and see 55% humidity, only to have it shoot down to 30% and kill my cure when my grow room heats up, then have it jump back up to 55% when I check it the next day at 70*F. Also vice versa (seeing acceptable RH, then having the RH be too high during lights off, only to return to an acceptable RH the next time I check it). Neither situation would be good.
I hope that some people do find the information useful.
Does anyone ever notice a change in RH (in your jar) with a temperature swing? Do you always check it at the same time of day (and thus same temp in grow room)?
SimonD
Well-Known Member
Forgive me for not explaining that most of the volume in a sealed container is taken up by the bud and its associated moisture. Seems pretty obvious to folks who harvest and cure weed, and it's, well, kinda the crux of the entire process. Please stop trolling this thread. We're not here to debate non-applicable constraints with someone with zero experience, we're not here to play games with the contents of your growroom, and we're not about to take anyone seriously who had to start a thread asking about controlling condensing water vapor in his own garden. Doing "this for a living" apparently didn't help. It's time for you to go back to Toke n Talk..
...my point is that when temp goes down, relative humidity increases, and vice versa...
I'll inform the press.
Simon
...my point is that when temp goes down, relative humidity increases, and vice versa...
I'll inform the press.
Simon
guy incognito
Well-Known Member
EDIT: I reread this and seems like I am coming off as a dick, which is not my intent. I appreciate the information you bring to RIU, and I just want to understand exactly what is happening during the dry/cure beyond simply following a set of instructions. So thank you for taking the time to post this information for everyone including myself. I know a lot of things, but I also know that I don't know everything and still have a ton to learn. With that being said I have left the rest of this post uneditted. [/EDIT]
I'm not trolling this thread. I asked a question directly related to the process you are promoting. I was not satisfied with your response because you don't understand the difference between absolute and relative humidty, and you apparently don't even know what a hygrometer measures. You may be right about the stability of the RH in a closed jar, but for completely wrong reasons. Sorry if I don't just blindly take the advice of people actively demonstrating their ignorance.
I'm not sure what your point about my condensation thread is. If you read it it clearly shows I understand the physical properties that are happening, I wanted to see what other members solutions were so I could choose the most economical without compromising my security or quality.
My intent was never to troll or to be a dick. I have been doing almost exactly this method of curing for years, but without the use of hygrometers. I like to understand what is going on in my grow on a fundamental level, during all stages.
If anyone is interested the following links provide some information on the humidity exchange with absorbent materials. The first one is about wood and seems directly applicable to this discussion, and the 2nd one is the index which has tons of information relating to environmental control, much of which is very technical and more information than needed for this discussion, but is interesting none the less.
http://www.conservationphysics.org/rhbuff/buffer1.php
http://www.conservationphysics.org/index.php
GrowBrooklyn
Well-Known Member
Why on earth would you keep your jars in your grow room? The idea is to keep them in a cool, dark, dry place, like a closet or the kitchen pantry.
ASMALLVOICE
Well-Known Member
A psychrometric chart and a full understanding of enthalpy is needed to debate the who, what, where and when of the physics of humidity.
It is pretty much an exact science at this point. So the temp down, humidity up, is only part of the equation, there are several other factors that determine what will bring about a rise or fall in humidity levels, not always temperature related.
Way more than is needed for curing buds, but I am stoned to the bone and just had to chime in that factoid.
Love this thread by the way.
Peace
Asmallvoice
It is pretty much an exact science at this point. So the temp down, humidity up, is only part of the equation, there are several other factors that determine what will bring about a rise or fall in humidity levels, not always temperature related.
Way more than is needed for curing buds, but I am stoned to the bone and just had to chime in that factoid.
Love this thread by the way.
Peace
Asmallvoice
Dank Raptor
Active Member
perfect cure takes experience. nothin else. Science debate all you like its just funny if you read the last couple pages. Do you guys talk like that in real life?
ASMALLVOICE
Well-Known Member
I agree, but to answer your question, yea, I do. I am an environmental control technician. HVAC automation is how I make a living. Been at it for over 20 years, yea, I am just 2 days younger than dirt...lol
Peace
Asmallvoice
PS: I dig that avatar.
Fresh 2 De@th
Well-Known Member
listen lame, i didn't ask for your opinion and could care less for it, i was and i'm still looking for facts. don't know how you would answer a question that didn't request for your silly opinion; totally defeat the purpose for me even asking,stupid.
guy incognito
Well-Known Member
For a variety of reasons: family, friends, smell control, climate control. I can't be having a kid find a pantry full of weed. I can't be having anybody find anything or smell anything. I also can't live like a hermit and not allow people that frown on marijuana use into my house, because they include some friends and family. The environment is also controlled in that room. I know what the temp and humidity are going to be at all times. The temperature isn't much higher than the rest of the house, and they are not stored under the lights or anything. I think it is the best place to store it.
I was oversimplifying it to demonstrate the effect temperature has on RH. Ultimately simon was right about the relative humidity staying pretty constant despite temperature swings because the buffering effect of the marijuana.
Experience is invaluable, but science helps us understand why things happen, and helps us do it better. I talk like that in real life.
mantiszn
Well-Known Member
Actually you did ask dumbass.. and you didn't mention the word science fact or evidence when asking originally which is why my opinion was given.
If you don't want someone's opinion then don't come onto a public forum asking fucking ridiculous questions everyone already knows the answer to because they could be bothered reading first.
This site needs a fucking moron filter. Oh wait it has one +ignore
If you don't want someone's opinion then don't come onto a public forum asking fucking ridiculous questions everyone already knows the answer to because they could be bothered reading first.
This site needs a fucking moron filter. Oh wait it has one +ignore
Fresh 2 De@th
Well-Known Member
haha, you're too funny lame. if you notice that question denoted for an answer of facts and not fiction or what you believe in, you dick in a butt.
if you check my response back to your initial reply to my rhetorical question, you can easily come to the conclusion that you and your silly reasoning wasn't required or needed, so stay in your lane lame, and keep passing out false/bogus info of what you believe in in the help me threads with the rest of the noobs.
one thing you are right about though, RIU definitely needs to start screening or red flagging some of these members, mainly starting with lames like yourself, for perpetuating all this bogus info floating here. if and when they do, you can kiss your membership goodbye, loser.
kryptoniteglo
Well-Known Member
Science, schmience. All I wanted to know when I opened this thread was how not to fuck up my cure.
And now I know. A Perfect Cure gives outstanding instructions to give a first-time harvester a perfect cure. I'm in my second week of curing, and my jars are showing low 60s on one plant and just registered 67% on another (funny how different plants cure differently!), so I've opened the jars on the 67% girl and will close them up later.
I'm SO happy they're not drying too fast! Thank you SimonD!
And now I know. A Perfect Cure gives outstanding instructions to give a first-time harvester a perfect cure. I'm in my second week of curing, and my jars are showing low 60s on one plant and just registered 67% on another (funny how different plants cure differently!), so I've opened the jars on the 67% girl and will close them up later.
I'm SO happy they're not drying too fast! Thank you SimonD!