CLF growing question

OhSooGood5 · Apr 15, 2011

mazand1982 said:
dude, dont go cfl for veg when u have a 600 watt HID system, if anything use T5 tubes but cfls u have to keep them right on the plants like 4 inches away anywhere u want any considerable growth, believe me...plus for 3-6 plants ur gonna need like 30 bulbs, have u looked into just getting a conversion metal halide bulb that you can use in the hps ballast???..thats how i veg and they kick ass...u dont wanna pay for two separete set ups...

How many watt bulb do you think id need for a MH bulb during vegging stage? Id much rather do what youre saying and not have 2 different set ups but wont using CFLs be more cost officiant rather than running an MH bulb for 18hrs a day? Also.. how much would a MH converter even cost?

Gastanker · Apr 15, 2011

mazand1982 said:
dude, dont go cfl for veg when u have a 600 watt HID system, if anything use T5 tubes but cfls u have to keep them right on the plants like 4 inches away anywhere u want any considerable growth, believe me...plus for 3-6 plants ur gonna need like 30 bulbs, have u looked into just getting a conversion metal halide bulb that you can use in the hps ballast???..thats how i veg and they kick ass...u dont wanna pay for two separete set ups...

I have a 600w, 1000w, and CFLs and I am going to have to disagree.

That 6 bulb bathroom vanity fixture above cost me $3.50 and my bulbs cost between $0.25 and $1.25 each. For 3 fixtures and 18 bulbs that's around $30 - that's considerable cheaper than a 400w MH bulb and a ton cheaper than a 600w conversion bulb and it will actually do a much better job at vegging. Additionally you can control exactly how many bulbs you want to run for how many plants you are vegging which can cut down on energy expenditures like crazy (remember that there is a big difference in power usage between 18/6 and 12/12).

And people keep in mind that a CFL is a T5. It's a T5 in a coil that is self ballasted. Everything other than the shape and the price is the same.

OhSooGood5 · Apr 15, 2011

Gastanker said:
I have a 600w, 1000w, and CFLs and I am going to have to disagree.

That 6 bulb bathroom vanity fixture above cost me $3.50 and my bulbs cost between $0.25 and $1.25 each. For 3 fixtures and 18 bulbs that's around $30 - that's considerable cheaper than a 400w MH bulb and a ton cheaper than a 600w conversion bulb and it will actually do a much better job at vegging. Additionally you can control exactly how many bulbs you want to run for how many plants you are vegging which can cut down on energy expenditures like crazy (remember that there is a big difference in power usage between 18/6 and 12/12).

So are you thinking stick with CFLs during the veg stage? I agree thinking that it will be much cheaper..

Thanks!

mazand1982 · Apr 15, 2011

Gastanker said:
I have a 600w, 1000w, and CFLs and I am going to have to disagree.

That 6 bulb bathroom vanity fixture above cost me $3.50 and my bulbs cost between $0.25 and $1.25 each. For 3 fixtures and 18 bulbs that's around $30 - that's considerable cheaper than a 400w MH bulb and a ton cheaper than a 600w conversion bulb and it will actually do a much better job at vegging. Additionally you can control exactly how many bulbs you want to run for how many plants you are vegging which can cut down on energy expenditures like crazy (remember that there is a big difference in power usage between 18/6 and 12/12).

i dunno man, i can only say what works for me specifically...ive researched this topic immensely and cfls put out an average of 1,600 lumens on one of those 23-27 watt bulbs that ive seen in all the pics in this thread...and they lose lumen output DRASTICALLY every inch u get farther from the plant, i personally run just a 400 watt hps system, i purchased a metal halide conversion bulb from HTGsupply.com, u dont need to do anything except unscrew your HPS bulb and screw in the MH conversion bulb, its called a MH conversion bulb cause it works in the hps ballast, my bulb was like 35 bux from them and its puts out 38,000 lumens,lol, do u know how many CFL bulbs that is???...look into it atleast, im sure a 600 watt mh conversion bulb cant be more than 40-50 bux max...CFLs are weak man, not to mention i ran the 400 watt mh conv bulb 24 hours a day during my veg and the bill barely went up...

OhSooGood5 · Apr 15, 2011

mazand1982 said:
i dunno man, i can only say what works for me specifically...ive researched this topic immensely and cfls put out an average of 1,600 lumens on one of those 23-27 watt bulbs that ive seen in all the pics in this thread...and they lose lumen output DRASTICALLY every inch u get farther from the plant, i personally run just a 400 watt hps system, i purchased a metal halide conversion bulb from HTGsupply.com, u dont need to do anything except unscrew your HPS bulb and screw in the MH conversion bulb, its called a MH conversion bulb cause it works in the hps ballast, my bulb was like 35 bux from them and its puts out 38,000 lumens,lol, do u know how many CFL bulbs that is???...look into it atleast, im sure a 600 watt mh conversion bulb cant be more than 40-50 bux max...CFLs are weak man, not to mention i ran the 400 watt mh conv bulb 24 hours a day during my veg and the bill barely went up...

Yea I'll definitely look into the MH conversion bulb.. Was actually just looking on htgsupply and saw a couple different ones.. If Im running a 600w hps would I need to run a 600w MH?

Rj41 · Apr 15, 2011

OhSooGood5 said:
Cool thanks bro!

If you DO use cfl's, there's no need to spend the money on the numbers of lights and fixtures that is being suggested. You don't need a HUGE amount of light during veg or for the size grow you're planning.
Hell, I don't even have those numbers in my 12/12 room and I have fantastic harvests!!lol!

TigerClock · Apr 15, 2011

Gastanker said:
You need around 1 15w bulb per cubic foot of canopy for slow vegging and 1 23w per cubic foot of canopy for good growth. If you are just vegging then that should be 16 bulbs. If you veg for longer you should add more to make up for vertical growth.

3 of these would do you fine without need for Y splitters.

$10 light fixture including bulbs.

i need one of those where can i get that? Clean up these hanging cords.

Gastanker · Apr 15, 2011

mazand1982 said:
i dunno man, i can only say what works for me specifically...ive researched this topic immensely and cfls put out an average of 1,600 lumens on one of those 23-27 watt bulbs that ive seen in all the pics in this thread...and they lose lumen output DRASTICALLY every inch u get farther from the plant, i personally run just a 400 watt hps system, i purchased a metal halide conversion bulb from HTGsupply.com, u dont need to do anything except unscrew your HPS bulb and screw in the MH conversion bulb, its called a MH conversion bulb cause it works in the hps ballast, my bulb was like 35 bux from them and its puts out 38,000 lumens,lol, do u know how many CFL bulbs that is???...look into it atleast, im sure a 600 watt mh conversion bulb cant be more than 40-50 bux max...CFLs are weak man, not to mention i ran the 400 watt mh conv bulb 24 hours a day during my veg and the bill barely went up...

So a 23w CFL puts out 1600 lumen at 1'. At 4" that's nearly double. That 3' vanity fixture holds 6 bulbs each around 5" apart. So a plant directly under (4" away) from one bulb is getting around 3200 from the bulb directly above it and over 1600x2 from the two bulbs to each side. If you have multiple fixture next to each other the plans receives another 1600x2 from the fixtures on either side. Lux per sq ft will be over 5k which is what is recommended for flowering.

Those 3 fixtures (18 bulbs) draw 414w and cover a minimum of 3x1.5 and maximum of 3x3 while maintaining at least a 4k coverage of the entire canopy. 38,000 lumen would be putting out 4222 lumen per sq ft covering a 3x3 area.

mazand1982 · Apr 15, 2011

OhSooGood5 said:
Yea I'll definitely look into the MH conversion bulb.. Was actually just looking on htgsupply and saw a couple different ones.. If Im running a 600w hps would I need to run a 600w MH?

yes, definitely...the 600 watt metal halide conversion bulb will only work in a 600 watt hps ballast... dont do cfl veg dude, i did and i swear halfway through veg they got some heighth and i noticed the cfl light wasnt penetrating the canopy worth dick, i got the MH conversion bulb in the mail from them and i just screwed it in the hps set up the same day and they fuckin exploded, crazy new, green healthy growth, ...plus it was such a gift to just screw the hps bulb back in and turn on the timer for flower time...i have just a small cabinet growin right now but its very healthy

this is the type of foliage growth u can expect vegging with a mh conv bulb, full and green, cfl will produce wispy airy growth my man...IMO

mazand1982 · Apr 15, 2011

Gastanker said:
So a 23w CFL puts out 1600 lumen at 1'. At 4" that's nearly double. That 3' vanity fixture holds 6 bulbs each around 5" apart. So a plant directly under (4" away) from one bulb is getting around 3200 from the bulb directly above it and over 1600x2 from the two bulbs to each side. If you have multiple fixture next to each other the plans receives another 1600x2 from the fixtures on either side. Lux per sq ft will be over 5k which is what is recommended for flowering.

Those 3 fixtures (18 bulbs) draw 414w and cover a minimum of 3x1.5 and maximum of 3x3 while maintaining at least a 4k coverage of the entire canopy. 38,000 lumen would be putting out 4222 lumen per sq ft covering a 3x3 area.

i beg to differ my friend...a cfl bulb DOESNT put out 1600 lumen output @ 1 foot, its puts out 1600 lumen total, right at the surface, it loses lumen output AS SOON as it leaves the glass tube....its all really a difference of opinion i guess, what u do for ur set up must be the bomb cuz ur pretty adament about it, thats all good.... i just know for a fact CFLs have terrible canopy penetration, when i had my 12 cfl bulbs in my cabinet it was a bright happy light, when the MH bulb went in there, it looked like fucking WW3 was going on in there, i loved it

OhSooGood5 · Apr 15, 2011

mazand1982 said:
i beg to differ my friend...a cfl bulb DOESNT put out 1600 lumen output @ 1 foot, its puts out 1600 lumen total, right at the surface, it loses lumen output AS SOON as it leaves the glass tube....its all really a difference of opinion i guess, what u do for ur set up must be the bomb cuz ur pretty adament about it, thats all good.... i just know for a fact CFLs have terrible canopy penetration, when i had my 12 cfl bulbs in my cabinet it was a bright happy light, when the MH bulb went in there, it looked like fucking WW3 was going on in there, i loved it

LOL I definitely want WW3 goin down with my plants haha.. Does it cost a lot more though using a 600w mh bulb compared to just using CFLs?

Gastanker · Apr 15, 2011

Hell, spend the bucks and do both. Start with a couple CFLs and then throw them under a MH when they are taller. Would still save money with the power savings even if the initial costs were higher. 4 CFLs will get 4 plants 6" tall in ~ 2 weeks. At that point throw em under your MH for a couple.

mazand1982 · Apr 15, 2011

OhSooGood5 said:
LOL I definitely want WW3 goin down with my plants haha.. Does it cost a lot more though using a 600w mh bulb compared to just using CFLs?

its very easy to calculate the power usage, locate ur last utility bill, see how much u are charged per kilowatt hour, a kilowatt hour is the price ur charged for using 1000 watts per every hour, then calculate a 600 watt light bulb and factor in a little for the ballast usage, its barely fuckin anything, and if ur only vegging 18/6 or 20/4 u save even more. i vegged 24/0 on my last run and the WHOLE entire month was so cheap i cant even remember, look into it..i think i get charged 15 cents a kilowatt hour, so whats that, 7 cents an hour, i dont care how much cfls cost, 7 cents an hour aint shit for the growth i seen with mine

mazand1982 · Apr 15, 2011

Gastanker said:
Hell, spend the bucks and do both. Start with a couple CFLs and then throw them under a MH when they are taller. Would still save money with the power savings even if the initial costs were higher. 4 CFLs will get 4 plants 6" tall in ~ 2 weeks. At that point throw em under your MH for a couple.

gastanker is right about this 100%...cfl will definitely get u through early growth, for me the big difference was when the leaves got bigger,and fuller...i actually still root the clones i buy with my old cfl set up,lol....

OhSooGood5 · Apr 15, 2011

mazand1982 said:
its very easy to calculate the power usage, locate ur last utility bill, see how much u are charged per kilowatt hour, a kilowatt hour is the price ur charged for using 1000 watts per every hour, then calculate a 600 watt light bulb and factor in a little for the ballast usage, its barely fuckin anything, and if ur only vegging 18/6 or 20/4 u save even more. i vegged 24/0 on my last run and the WHOLE entire month was so cheap i cant even remember, look into it..i think i get charged 15 cents a kilowatt hour, so whats that, 7 cents an hour, i dont care how much cfls cost, 7 cents an hour aint shit for the growth i seen with mine

Lol yea bro I'll definitely have to check out how much its gonna cost.. Sounds pretty easy to do and if its going to be hella cheap I wouldn't mind spending $50-60 on a MH bulb if it would pay off

KuLong · Apr 15, 2011

OhSooGood5 said:
You said "Exactly like that. Use T5's." .......

So why would you say use t5s? lol Id rather use cfls since I dont know much about t5s...

Are you looking for a fight? Jesus man, put down the crack pipe and smoke some MJ.

I said "use T5's" as an alternate to lets say, T8's...

My suggestion is not cryptic nor am I a T5 salesman.

OhSooGood5 · Apr 15, 2011

KuLong said:
Are you looking for a fight? Jesus man, put down the crack pipe and smoke some MJ.

I said "use T5's" as an alternate to lets say, T8's...

My suggestion is not cryptic nor am I a T5 salesman.

Lol bro relax... If you keep coming back here youre obviously looking to try to start something.. I started the thread so Im obviously going to keep checking back here.. You on the other hand dont have any other real reason to come back here other than just trying to start something so take it easy, damn. Quit making something a bigger deal than it is please. I'm just here looking for help, not looking to be on here arguing with somebody wasting my time. Ok, thanks.

Gastanker · Apr 15, 2011

mazand1982 said:
i beg to differ my friend...a cfl bulb DOESNT put out 1600 lumen output @ 1 foot, its puts out 1600 lumen total, right at the surface, it loses lumen output AS SOON as it leaves the glass tube....its all really a difference of opinion i guess, what u do for ur set up must be the bomb cuz ur pretty adament about it, thats all good.... i just know for a fact CFLs have terrible canopy penetration, when i had my 12 cfl bulbs in my cabinet it was a bright happy light, when the MH bulb went in there, it looked like fucking WW3 was going on in there, i loved it

The lumen ratings provided by bulb manufacturers are taken at 1' from the bulb. Are you saying that the light starts scattering right at 12" according to the inverse square law but not before it?

OhSooGood5 · Apr 15, 2011

KuLong said:
Quoted for future reference.

Annnnnd youre back.. Can this just end? People don't want to be on here reading stupid arguments.. They come to get help or help others.

Travisheals · Apr 15, 2011

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CLF growing question

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