Colorado Med Growers, Unite

Danny,

I think the point he's making is that anyone that has more then 20 plants isn't just growing for personal use, no matter what they might claim. There are plenty of people out there that are growing more then they need for personal use because they want to sell it to the dispensaries, but those people need to admit they are growing for more then personal use and get themselves the proper documentation for the number of plants they are growing. From the states perspective a lot of these growers are acting like small businesses without bothering to get a business license or pay taxes on their profits, and they have every right to nail them for it. Sure, it's a pain to get all the legal stuff taken care of, but that's part of the cost of having it legal in the first place. It may go against the grain for a lot of long time growers and dealers, but you've now become respectable businessmen and have to learn a whole new set of rules.

EdGreyfox said:

Danny,

I think the point he's making is that anyone that has more then 20 plants isn't just growing for personal use, no matter what they might claim. There are plenty of people out there that are growing more then they need for personal use because they want to sell it to the dispensaries, but those people need to admit they are growing for more then personal use and get themselves the proper documentation for the number of plants they are growing. From the states perspective a lot of these growers are acting like small businesses without bothering to get a business license or pay taxes on their profits, and they have every right to nail them for it. Sure, it's a pain to get all the legal stuff taken care of, but that's part of the cost of having it legal in the first place. It may go against the grain for a lot of long time growers and dealers, but you've now become respectable businessmen and have to learn a whole new set of rules.

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I could have easliy gotten a Dr's recommendation for up to 40 plants, personally I stuck with 20 to try to stay "under the radar" of the cowboy cops who harrass growers because they don't like the law.

As far as I udnerstand it there is no business license if you're not a dispensory, and there is no growers license. I wish there was, I'd go get one.

Taxes have to be paid, period. If you grow & you don't pay taxes you're asking for a stay in the fed pen. See, if you don't claim the income that's tax fraud which is a fed offense, and if you're growing or own a dispensory and you get busted on a fed rap, then the feds look through everything your doing, see the plants & meds and attatch fed drug charges. Kinda like the seatbelt law, they can't pull you over for it, but if they get you on something else then they nail you for that too.

If I'm wrong about a growers or business license please someone let me know. But that's the way I understand it.

Danny,

If your selling a product thats intended for resale at the retail level then you really should have a business license, and you need to be filing sales taxes for the city,county, and state every month even if all your sales are tax exempt. The state isn't going to care about the guy that sells an ounce here or there and doesn't make much of a profit, but the guys that are selling large amounts to the dispensaries are going to start being regulated sooner or later. Not to mention the fact that getting a business license and keeping proper accounting records lets you turn all your equipment costs and grow expenses into write off's from your income for tax purposes.

Like I said before, now that the business is legal people are going to have to get used to a whole new way of doing things, including dealing with all the red tape every other type of business has to put up with. Little things like workers compensation insurance, liability insurance, paying social security and medicare taxes, complying with OSHA standards, and a host of other little costs and expenses. For example, do you have a burglar alarm for your commercial grow area? And if so, did you remember to pay the extra annual fee to the police to have them actually respond if it goes off? Are you keeping track of all your revenues and expenses using the proper accounting methods? If not the IRS is going to enjoy auditing you. I've talked to a lot of people who are growing commercially in the last few months, and most of them aren't even thinking about this kind of stuff.

As for the 40 plant limit, I suppose it's possible if all you use is edibles, but it's still enough to raise some eyebrows. Most people are going to assume with that many plants that you have to have excess you're selling someplace. Like yourself I'm able to get a much higher plant count then I have currently, and i agree that anything over 20 is just going to make you a target. I'm still deciding exactly how many I'm going to need to have growing in the long term, and I'm thinking 16-20 is just about right if I want to set up a rotation of plants to run from seedling to harvest so that I'm harvesting 4-5 plants each month.

BTW, if any of you are really looking at doing this commercially and need some help with the accounting let me know. I make my living as a cost accountant, so I'm very good at that side of things. I avoid income tax related work like the plague though, so I can't give definite answers about them. That's what CPA's are for.

So if nothing was written on your paper work it means 6 plants total?

As for the 40 plant limit, I suppose it's possible if all you use is edibles, but it's still enough to raise some eyebrows. Most people are going to assume with that many plants that you have to have excess you're selling someplace. Like yourself I'm able to get a much higher plant count then I have currently, and i agree that anything over 20 is just going to make you a target. I'm still deciding exactly how many I'm going to need to have growing in the long term, and I'm thinking 16-20 is just about right if I want to set up a rotation of plants to run from seedling to harvest so that I'm harvesting 4-5 plants each month.

EdGreyFox,

That is a pretty good game plan. My useage is close to the same numbers. Are you planning on producing your own seed?
I am ready to begin, but not in a hurry. I am still clearing out the spare room!
I believe I smoke an ounce a week of schwag= 4 oz per month. My occasional outdoor grow yield about 2 oz per plant, average.
Four plants per month harvested. I was thinking more about growing more plants, but the rotation method is better. That would equal 48-60 plants harvested per year.
You figure you need to constantly have 16 to 20 plants to fill that schedule? Some in veg and some in flower - that means my grow space will be too small. I bought a 2 x 4 grow tent for veg, and a 4 x 4 grow tent for bloom.

What do you think?

MileHIGHclub101 said:

I think the only reason it would go to state is if you were up to something way outta line... but the limit is set by the standards the courts put out yes it does state legally 6 is the amount of plants you can have, but people have gone to court for more and anything over 20 plants and they start to want to see some other id's for caregivers. So the standard i'm seeing from everyone is 20 is what they still can deem medically sound for one person...now if you are an individual growing your own medicine for yourself and only yourself and you need more than 20 plants...your fuckin the system...lets be honest...your being a greedy son of bitch trying to do something more than medicine for yourself and deserve to be put in court....it's the fuckin main reason we still get so much resistance from the legality because people are taking advantage of this great opportunity...and can't just play by the rules.

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You are an MMJ elitist. MMJ is window dressing. Cannabis should be LEGAL and any adult should be allowed to grow as many plants as he or she wants. NOBODY deserves to be in the court system for cannabis!

THseaman said:

You are an MMJ elitist. MMJ is window dressing. Cannabis should be LEGAL and any adult should be allowed to grow as many plants as he or she wants. NOBODY deserves to be in the court system for cannabis!

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Just because it SHOULD be does not mean that it is and the many that are opperating outside the rules is what is causing the lawmakers to keep looking at it (MJ)

If every one was not so damn greedy we would be crusin, The Ammendment is about Medical MJ nothing else

Looking for ways around the laws/rules will simply tighten things up and make it worse for everyone

I disagree with your assumption that people who need more than 6 plants are greedy. It takes at least 16 to get a perpetual grow going for my own personal needs.

And, if you are only growing your 6 plants you shouldn't be paranoid about any restrictions. That right will never go away in CO.

THseaman said:

I disagree with your assumption that people who need more than 6 plants are greedy. It takes at least 16 to get a perpetual grow going for my own personal needs.

And, if you are only growing your 6 plants you shouldn't be paranoid about any restrictions. That right will never go away in CO.

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I'm only growin one

Not just talking about the 6 plant limit, the disp owners, the doctors, it's all just gotten crazy and out of hand

it's the reason that they are looking at limiting the # of patients (not sayin it will happen) but if it does all of the disp close as soon as it goes into effect, they can't stay open with only 5 patients each

and it is the rush for green $$$ that is causing them to escalate the regulations, that is a fact!

Yes, that is a fact. The powers that be cant stand to see the wrong people making money! Even if it is stimulating the economy through the roof. And also, I don't think dispensaries should have ANY patients or grow ANY plants. But they should be allowed to possess, buy and sell a reasonable amount of meds/edibles/clones, as determined by a committee of law makers, growers and patients, to any licensed patient/caregiver. That would eliminate a lot of the current problems imo.

Arvada,

It all depends on yields and grow times. I'm trying to set things up so that if everything goes normally I'll always have enough to meet my and one other persons needs, since I'm doing the growing for another MMJ patient that doesn't have the space (I provide space and equipment, they provide help with the growing and harvesting). I was told to expect a yield of 3-4 oz per plant out of the strain i've just started (Opium), and assuming I only get 2 oz that will still give me 8oz harvested per month (like you i go through about an oz/wk). If things go really well on any particular grow I'll have some excess i can trade for other strains, but what I'm really trying to do is have enough redundancy so that if I have a couple plants die it won't mean the harvest is too small to support our needs for the month. Eventually i want to mix up my strains so that each month I'm harvesting four different types, but once again making sure the yields meet our minimum needs is going to come first.

Riddle,

Have to agree with you. If people would just follow the rules and not go out of their way to give the government excuses to come up with new regulations everything would go a lot smoother. There are too many new growers and dispensaries with nothing but dollar signs in their eyes and no common sense, and if they don't get their act together and learn to treat this like a legitimate business (i.e. you play by the governments rules) we're going to see more and more calls to regulate the business and cut down on the number of growers/providers.

EdGreyfox said:

Riddle,

Have to agree with you. If people would just follow the rules and not go out of their way to give the government excuses to come up with new regulations everything would go a lot smoother. There are too many new growers and dispensaries with nothing but dollar signs in their eyes and no common sense, and if they don't get their act together and learn to treat this like a legitimate business (i.e. you play by the governments rules) we're going to see more and more calls to regulate the business and cut down on the number of growers/providers.

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Yet you want to grow 16-20 plants w/2 licenses? WTF? You just contradicted yourself.

Th.

Like I already said, I think 20 plants is about the top number you can grow and claim it is only for personal use(unless you only use edibles), and that's assuming you're doing a perpetual grow with plants in different development stages so that you can harvest every month The current laws allow you to get a much higher plant count with a doctors recommendation, and I have that recommendation. I'm actually following all the rules and making sure that i have all the right documentation before I start doing things. My concern is that there are too many growers that aren't following the rules, and that they are going to end up messing it up for all the rest of us that do.

I hope I am posting this question in the right spot.. if not I'm sorry... I live in Colorado and have all licensing I need.. there is just one worry... Children on premises
I have been looking up laws on caregivers... without much luck on my specific question. I can't seem to find anywhere and I have spent about 12 hours (total) searching.....
What I am looking for is to see what laws they have for being a parent and having plants on premises. Plants are NOT accessible to the children and they are completely unaware of use (since I only use edibles and they have no idea the "room" exists. But I can't have it backfiring on me and risk losing my children. I would like to be able to print out the laws and post next to the licenses.
Any help on this subject would be greatly appreciated.
and again if this is posted in the wrong section I apologize again.
Thanks

EdGreyfox said:

Arvada,

It all depends on yields and grow times. I'm trying to set things up so that if everything goes normally I'll always have enough to meet my and one other persons needs, since I'm doing the growing for another MMJ patient that doesn't have the space (I provide space and equipment, they provide help with the growing and harvesting). I was told to expect a yield of 3-4 oz per plant out of the strain i've just started (Opium), and assuming I only get 2 oz that will still give me 8oz harvested per month (like you i go through about an oz/wk). If things go really well on any particular grow I'll have some excess i can trade for other strains, but what I'm really trying to do is have enough redundancy so that if I have a couple plants die it won't mean the harvest is too small to support our needs for the month. Eventually i want to mix up my strains so that each month I'm harvesting four different types, but once again making sure the yields meet our minimum needs is going to come first.

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EdGreyfox,

Thanks for the input. It seems as though I underestimated the capacity of my grow tents. That's OK, right now I am collecting materials and knowledge before I begin the indoor grow.

I am appreciative of the fact that I can smoke and grow in my house without worrying about the law. The annual permit is worth it. When I receive my card, I'll look into getting my limit changed from 6 to 20 plants.

Every two or three years, I get a bug and do an outdoor grow. I have bought cheap soil, cheap nutrients, and use the sun for light.
I treat those plants like a red headed stepchild, cause the grow is just for fun.

With an ongoing electric bill for indoor growing, I want to do the best I can for the
production of my supply.

I'm in my 60's and on S/S, and it will be interesting to experience the different strains available . I have smoked mex schwag for 40 years!

I thought this was Colorado Med Growers UNITE?
The main problem is that Cannabis, in all forms is still illegal on the Federal level. However, united the masses can persuade positive change. Stop bickering ladies!
As for grow maximums, those are the rules. Go "buy" patients to up your allotments.
Playing by the rules means finding loop holes and exploiting them. Corporate America does this well, and so can you.

Loose lips sink ships - The first rule of fight club is.....The second rule of fight club is....Get the picture?

have euphoria clones in arvada, 15 a piece.

theherbalistspecialist said:

I thought this was Colorado Med Growers UNITE?
The main problem is that Cannabis, in all forms is still illegal on the Federal level. However, united the masses can persuade positive change. Stop bickering ladies!
As for grow maximums, those are the rules. Go "buy" patients to up your allotments.
Playing by the rules means finding loop holes and exploiting them. Corporate America does this well, and so can you.

Loose lips sink ships - The first rule of fight club is.....The second rule of fight club is....Get the picture?

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http://www.denverpost.com/ci_14208901?source=rss

Speaking of Federal law, this article from the Denver Post is about Feds and Colo

Someone posted earlier their doctor wrote something out to increase their plant total from 6 to 20.
The reason was use for edibles. I believe they quoted an increase of your State MMR fee is $110, making it $200 annually.

Is this info correct? And are you holding the docs reccom paper only, or does the State acknowledge in writing your change of limits?