Diablo OG In Dual Monster Plant System

323cheezy

323cheezy

Well-Known Member
no offense taken brother...much respect .....
Ive heard that from a guy who claimed hed been growing for 10yrs....
but he was an outdoor grower.... n said outies were better than innies...
So i didnt see him as a reliable source...met him at the club.
Its mght be true ...but i wouldnt say that high temps will cause airy buds...
Ive been growing for 3 yrs already ......
And ive had some realy dense buds in supper high temps...
I can say tht sometimes genetics will play a major role in density of buds...amongst other things....
Airy buds i will attribute also to beasters(plants that are 4+ feet tall), overcrowding, and not enff light or some kinda feeding problem(plant digestion..ie metabolism)...

Maybe you had a bad run it happens .... maybe it was a lil too hot in there....
I just let my plant grow in the high 60's to low 80's... its seems to work.... and trust this aint no cron..lol
 
lordjin

lordjin

Well-Known Member
mr.smileyface said:
Ok sorry to fill your thread. This is how i look at it. You can get away with it being hott in the first month. But look when the plants finish. In sept/oct. the colder end of the season. Pretty much just try to mimiq the greatoutdoors to get the most qaulity.
One of my friends even starts his light cycle out with a MH bulb on a track to mimiq a sunrise. then relays turn each set of hps lights on.
That way there is no surge/spike.
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that actually makes a lot of sense. I'll keep in mind a cooler finish period for the future. Thanks!
 
lordjin

lordjin

Well-Known Member
323cheezy said:
Just to chime in on the topics of temps.....
Obviously you dont want temps to high or low depending on the strain...
You want to maintian growth and not put you ladies in survival mode....

Ive grown in cold temps and hotter temps....
And i notice that plants will grow faster in high temps...
This is a basic concept in science .....(chemisty)
Its elementry , chemical reactions happen faster in hotter temps....
This theory applies to almost everything.....

For instance:
If u open a can of soda when its hot and leave it out you will notice the carbonation will exit faster...
But if the can is cold and opened...it will take much longer for the carbon to dissapate....
Same thing with people ...youll notice that taller / bigger people are in tropical enviroments...
Have u ever been with a south american chick.... they just grow amazingly thick in all the right places..lol

Ive heard its good too have colder temps at the end of flowering...
So that the nugs will rock up......
But this advice was given to me from someone that isnt as skilled to me..

All in all , i think that cold temps will help bag appeal to some degree..
But plant will grow faster in high 70's to mid 80's...
I always keep mine at around 60-80 degrees.....

I chopped down some louie this morning just a lil....

Click to expand...

Hey, hey it's Bill Nye, the Science Guy! Lol!

that was great dude and makes absolute sense and is consistent with the universe around us. Yes, of course, heat is a pure energy source... a catalyst and accelerator for all chemical/biological reactions. Bravo.:clap:

EDIT:
By the way, I'll be needing one or two of those nugs for scientific examination.
 
dsmoke1

dsmoke1

Active Member
323cheezy said:
Just to chime in on the topics of temps.....
Obviously you dont want temps to high or low depending on the strain...
You want to maintian growth and not put you ladies in survival mode....

Ive grown in cold temps and hotter temps....
And i notice that plants will grow faster in high temps...
This is a basic concept in science .....(chemisty)
Its elementry , chemical reactions happen faster in hotter temps....
This theory applies to almost everything.....

For instance:
If u open a can of soda when its hot and leave it out you will notice the carbonation will exit faster...
But if the can is cold and opened...it will take much longer for the carbon to dissapate....
Same thing with people ...youll notice that taller / bigger people are in tropical enviroments...
Have u ever been with a south american chick.... they just grow amazingly thick in all the right places..lol

Ive heard its good too have colder temps at the end of flowering...
So that the nugs will rock up......
But this advice was given to me from someone that isnt as skilled to me..

All in all , i think that cold temps will help bag appeal to some degree..
But plant will grow faster in high 70's to mid 80's...
I always keep mine at around 60-80 degrees.....

I chopped down some louie this morning just a lil....
Click to expand...
It is not necessary to outright drop the tents near the end of flower, but a cooling on daily average temps will help simulate impending doom. This WILL help harden the buds, and WILL help pack on tons of resin. The reason your plants are still growing fast and getting fat in warmer temperatures, is because they are still in optimal summer growing conditions. This leads to more leaf/stem/root productin and less calyx/resin production. The ideal method is to get your buds big and fat for the initial 80% of flower, and get them potent for the final 20%. This way, you do not sacrifice potency for weight. I can provide a lot more insight on the subject, but that would require a large understanding of breeding, or a preface on my part for that matter. In lamens, the more a plant puts in to overall size and growth production, the less it will put in to trichome and calyx formation. A lot of Sativas will get very very leafy late in to flower if you do not control the Temp/Night Temp/RH/Root Temps. If you ease them down the path to winter, they will put more effort in to their flower production. At this point, the plant should cease rapid vertical growth, and calyxes should start compounding on top of each other in rapid succession. Fan leaf production will stop, and the plant will start drawing essential sugars and foods from them to supplement the bud and resin production. A complete flush is usually not necessary, considering you've TLC'd your plant. Once again, easing it towards death, you slow the supply of food, instead of immediately cutting it off. This, once again, will force the fan leaves to stop producing and begin feeding your plant. If you can dial in every single aspect of your environment and feeding regimen, you will have the stickiest nugs you could ever imagine. They may be 75% the size of your previous harvests while wet, but they will weigh much more with a lower water content. In return, your plants lose less weight while drying, and they weighed a TON in the first place.


Just my two cents.
 
lordjin

lordjin

Well-Known Member
dsmoke1 said:
It is not necessary to outright drop the tents near the end of flower, but a cooling on daily average temps will help simulate impending doom. This WILL help harden the buds, and WILL help pack on tons of resin. The reason your plants are still growing fast and getting fat in warmer temperatures, is because they are still in optimal summer growing conditions. This leads to more leaf/stem/root productin and less calyx/resin production. The ideal method is to get your buds big and fat for the initial 80% of flower, and get them potent for the final 20%. This way, you do not sacrifice potency for weight. I can provide a lot more insight on the subject, but that would require a large understanding of breeding, or a preface on my part for that matter. In lamens, the more a plant puts in to overall size and growth production, the less it will put in to trichome and calyx formation. A lot of Sativas will get very very leafy late in to flower if you do not control the Temp/Night Temp/RH/Root Temps. If you ease them down the path to winter, they will put more effort in to their flower production. At this point, the plant should cease rapid vertical growth, and calyxes should start compounding on top of each other in rapid succession. Fan leaf production will stop, and the plant will start drawing essential sugars and foods from them to supplement the bud and resin production. A complete flush is usually not necessary, considering you've TLC'd your plant. Once again, easing it towards death, you slow the supply of food, instead of immediately cutting it off. This, once again, will force the fan leaves to stop producing and begin feeding your plant. If you can dial in every single aspect of your environment and feeding regimen, you will have the stickiest nugs you could ever imagine. They may be 75% the size of your previous harvests while wet, but they will weigh much more with a lower water content. In return, your plants lose less weight while drying, and they weighed a TON in the first place.


Just my two cents.
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I like that. I was thinking myself that I would let them drink the ppm down to a lower level before introducing the flush...

Also, I'll try to cool the box temp for the flush period prior to death... Lol.
 
dsmoke1

dsmoke1

Active Member
lordjin said:
I like that. I was thinking myself that I would let them drink the ppm down to a lower level before introducing the flush...

Also, I'll try to cool the box temp for the flush period prior to death... Lol.
Click to expand...
Yeah, letting the PPM drop naturally, while giving it a bit of resistance (adding 50ppm food every 200point drop), is giving people great results.

Quoted from homebrewer, when asked about light nutrient solution as opposed to a complete flush:

Common sense prompted me to stop flushing years ago. I don't flush my garden veggies and none of the produce that you buy from the store is flushed either. Why flush cannabis? Uncle Ben has a theory that flushing was invented by the dutch to atone for the sins of over-feeding and I tend agree with that.

In addition to common sense, plants still have nutritional needs in the last weeks of their life. Flushing deprives them of what they need most so if you flush, I can promise you're hurting your yields and the overall quality and potency of your product.

Illumination has an excellent post about the science behind flushing and why flushing simply doesn't do anything, found here: ( https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/393940-smoke-n-grow-nutes-versus-44.html#post5323080 <-Click
Click to expand...

And also, read the post he was talking about. Very informative: https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/393940-smoke-n-grow-nutes-versus-44.html#post5323080
 
lordjin

lordjin

Well-Known Member
Okay, Duders. I have to say that I've found the back and forth between different users regarding different subjects the best part of maintaining a journal. Reading not only what you have to say to me, but what you say to each other has been very stimulating to my already stimulated brain.

So regarding box air temp. With all this talk on the matter in the past few days, I did take it upon myself to turn the dial up a notch on the mounted ac. The compressor now cycles like this: When it hits 78.8f - 80f on the part of the canopy directly under the HID, the compressor kicks in and slowly cools it to 68f. It then climbs steadily back up to 78.8f - 80f and the cycle repeats itself.

You see the curling and dried leaves and may be thinking it's excessive heat, but it's really caused by the air exchange required to manage the heat. If you ever try running a 1000w hid in a 4x2 metal enclosure, you'll quickly see that it gets almost hot enough to cook your Thanksgiving turkey in there. Without the intense heat management of the ac in conjunction with the air suction running over the bulb constantly, there would be no way this could work. Nothing would survive without this... it would be just way too hot.

So with this intense level of heat management, I have a careful eye on what the environment is in there 24/7 both in terms of heat and relative humidity. I never let the temps (or any other factor) skyrocket outside the desired range of the plants. The leaf curling you see is caused mainly by the intense movement and drying of the air by the ac, not the actual air temp itself.
 
lordjin

lordjin

Well-Known Member
dsmoke1 said:
Yeah, letting the PPM drop naturally, while giving it a bit of resistance (adding 50ppm food every 200point drop), is giving people great results.

Quoted from homebrewer, when asked about light nutrient solution as opposed to a complete flush:




And also, read the post he was talking about. Very informative: https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/393940-smoke-n-grow-nutes-versus-44.html#post5323080
Click to expand...
Okay, you're twisting my melon, man. Flushing is wrong? WTF? scratching head (and balls).
 
dsmoke1

dsmoke1

Active Member
lordjin said:
The leaf curling you see is caused mainly by the intense movement and drying of the air by the ac, not the actual air temp itself.
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Which is totally fine. Keeping a relatively low humidity (intese movement and drying of the air :)) is ideal through flower production. Nothing like losing your crop to mold, mildew, and pests. Air exchange and humidity control are so important in terms of harvesting a clean product, and curled up leaves are just something that comes with the controls needed to grow indoors under a super-fucking-hot light.
 
lordjin

lordjin

Well-Known Member
dsmoke1 said:
Which is totally fine. Keeping a relatively low humidity (intese movement and drying of the air :)) is ideal through flower production. Nothing like losing your crop to mold, mildew, and pests. Air exchange and humidity control are so important in terms of harvesting a clean product, and curled up leaves are just something that comes with the controls needed to grow indoors under a super-fucking-hot light.
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DING DING DING. Winna, winna, chicken dinnah.

I may have ugly leaves, but it's better than mold. Lol.
 
dsmoke1

dsmoke1

Active Member
lordjin said:
Okay, you're twisting my melon, man. Flushing is wrong? WTF? scratching head (and balls).
Click to expand...
Haha. Am I? I'm not saying flushing is wrong. I'm saying that for the delicious healthy plant that has been nurtured it's whole life, it's useless, and I believe, highly damaging to final yields and potency. Once again, I believe that flushing is an old tradition that has gotten way out of hand. We're not loading warehouses up with tubs of chemicals here. If that was the case, then flush flush flush. Do whatever you can to remove systemic chemicals from the plant, and save your giant shitty crop. When you have two DANK plants in a cab, who are healthy as shit, a flush does nothing but completely cut off the food supply. This, in turn, causes the plant to starve and cannibalize itself and fade quickly. You do want the plant to begin this process at the end of the life cycle, but as with everything else you've done to the plant, you ease in to it. So, the idea is, you feed a light nutrient solution and dial down the PPM until the plant is ready to go. This is a 1-2 week process depending on your strain, but instead of the plant seizing and going in to shock, it continues to pump out flowers. Also, another benefit being, the plant still knows it is dying. The food supply being slowly cut off will do the same thing as flushing without completely shocking your plant. It will still stop root/stem/leaf production and work on calyx/trichomes. It just wont be freak out and rapidly cannibalize itself, which is a what a normal flush in Hydro will force it to do. Remember, you're not in soil :) A plant needs to FEED until it dies! It is still living when you pluck the flowers (Hence the drying/curing process) - Ever seen people pluck a green tomato and set it in the window sill? It still continues to cannibalize itself and ripen. The question is: Do you want to shock a plant in to ripening? Or do you want to nurture it into ripening?
 
lordjin

lordjin

Well-Known Member
dsmoke1 said:
Haha. Am I? I'm not saying flushing is wrong. I'm saying that for the delicious healthy plant that has been nurtured it's whole life, it's useless, and I believe, highly damaging to final yields and potency. Once again, I believe that flushing is an old tradition that has gotten way out of hand. We're not loading warehouses up with tubs of chemicals here. If that was the case, then flush flush flush. Do whatever you can to remove systemic chemicals from the plant, and save your giant shitty crop. When you have two DANK plants in a cab, who are healthy as shit, a flush does nothing but completely cut off the food supply. This, in turn, causes the plant to starve and cannibalize itself and fade quickly. You do want the plant to begin this process at the end of the life cycle, but as with everything else you've done to the plant, you ease in to it. So, the idea is, you feed a light nutrient solution and dial down the PPM until the plant is ready to go. This is a 1-2 week process depending on your strain, but instead of the plant seizing and going in to shock, it continues to pump out flowers. Also, another benefit being, the plant still knows it is dying. The food supply being slowly cut off will do the same thing as flushing without completely shocking your plant. It will still stop root/stem/leaf production and work on calyx/trichomes. It just wont be freak out and rapidly cannibalize itself, which is a what a normal flush in Hydro will force it to do. Remember, you're not in soil :) A plant needs to FEED until it dies! It is still living when you pluck the flowers (Hence the drying/curing process) - Ever seen people pluck a green tomato and set it in the window sill? It still continues to cannibalize itself and ripen. The question is: Do you want to shock a plant in to ripening? Or do you want to nurture it into ripening?
Click to expand...
Nice, bro. I'm gonna go with that. It makes so much more sense than an abrupt flush. Instead of my usual shocker regimen, I'm gonna do this based upon what you said: Instead of replacing the Koolbloom infused water outright, I'll pump it out partially and let the auto top dilute it down... slowly repeating the process through the course of the last week. This would be much more consistent with your 'easing into it.'
 
dsmoke1

dsmoke1

Active Member
lordjin said:
Nice, bro. I'm gonna go with that. It makes so much more sense than an abrupt flush. Instead of my usual shocker regimen, I'm gonna do this based upon what you said: Instead of replacing the Koolbloom infused water outright, I'll pump it out partially and let the auto top dilute it down... slowly repeating the process through the course of the last week. This would be much more consistent with your 'easing into it.'
Click to expand...
Watch. You should still see a nice fade when you start diluting the solution, but it will be more gradual and the plant will regain it's vibrancy and turgor until the end. Koolbloom is a very basic supplement as well, and should be perfect for the light solution needed to "nurture-flush" your plants. A basic ripe/bloom fertilizer at 1/4 strength will continue to supplement the plants death very well too. As well, you'll find that for the last few days of the plants life, you're working with basically water anyways. The goal is to ease your way there. Requires a bit of calculating and extra work, but you've been growing these things for so long, you'll know when you've done it right.

I bet you end up with the plumpest, happiest flowers. Easing in to a flush and jumping in to one are effectively the same thing. One is a whole lot more confusing to the plant. The other is much more nurturing. As I said before, the goal is to promote catabolism near the end of your plants life, so "flushing" is necessary. I just think it's gone about ALL wrong. There's no reason to wait until the last minute and then shock a plant in to dying. Ease in to it, and thank me later :)
 
lordjin

lordjin

Well-Known Member
dsmoke1 said:
Watch. You should still see a nice fade when you start diluting the solution, but it will be more gradual and the plant will regain it's vibrancy and turgor until the end. Koolbloom is a very basic supplement as well, and should be perfect for the light solution needed to "nurture-flush" your plants. A basic ripe/bloom fertilizer at 1/4 strength will continue to supplement the plants death very well too. As well, you'll find that for the last few days of the plants life, you're working with basically water anyways. The goal is to ease your way there. Requires a bit of calculating and extra work, but you've been growing these things for so long, you'll know when you've done it right.

I bet you end up with the plumpest, happiest flowers. Easing in to a flush and jumping in to one are effectively the same thing. One is a whole lot more confusing to the plant. The other is much more nurturing. As I said before, the goal is to promote catabolism near the end of your plants life, so "flushing" is necessary. I just think it's gone about ALL wrong. There's no reason to wait until the last minute and then shock a plant in to dying. Ease in to it, and thank me later :)
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Ah, you see? This is exactly why I started a journal here. Gaining knowledge. Props.
 
lordjin

lordjin

Well-Known Member
So I got up on a chair all high (in more ways than one :-D) to get you some pulled-back aerial shots. As you can see, it's getting even uglier, more gnarly, thicker by the day. Explosive.








I love OG's because they're easy to trim come harvest time. Look how easy these look to trim.
 
sleezy1

sleezy1

Well-Known Member
lordjin said:
So I got up on a chair all high (in more ways than one :-D) to get you some pulled-back aerial shots. As you can see, it's getting even uglier, more gnarly, thicker by the day. Explosive.








I love OG's because they're easy to trim come harvest time. Look how easy these look to trim.
Click to expand...
EXPLOSION! you definitely win! Way fatter than my buds! I think your going to yield about a pound.
 
lordjin

lordjin

Well-Known Member
sleezy1 said:
EXPLOSION! you definitely win! Way fatter than my buds! I think your going to yield about a pound.
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It's not about winning or losing, but more about the sweetness of medicating on bud you nurtured with your own hands. In that sense we all win.

Thanks. Hey, I'm actually high on a free joint. Anyways, yeah, I have high hopes for yield. The dry leaves pushing against each other are pretty much all that's keeping them upright at this point. Pretty heavy.
 
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