Do most plants carry the intersex gene?

tstick

Well-Known Member
I was thinking about the Chemdog story...Guy selling some exceptionally good weed at a Grateful Dead concert....Someone saved a few seeds that came in the bag and grew them out....the rest is history....something like that.

Anyway...It got me thinking about where those seeds came from. Were they seeds that came from a pollination involving a separate male plant? Or, were those seeds, likely produced from a 'nanner of the female plant, itself? And, IF it was a 'nanner that "fathered" the Chemdog, then wouldn't that tendency be carried on in any hybrid that would subsequently be made using the original Chemdog bag seed?

And, to take it another step backwards....How many of the old, original, landrace strains were likely to display tendencies for true hermaphrodites and/or intersex traits? When did growers start figuring out to select for cultivars that were less likely to produce 'nanners or throw up a bunch of mixed male and female flowers? And, by all rights, don't ALL seeds, regardless of breeders, carry these genetic predispositions to one degree or another?

Just to add another talking point...a more personal one...

In my latest grow, I decided to grow a couple of bag seeds that I got from a jar of recreational weed. Well, no surprise, when the plants started to show preflowers, there were some pistols AND "balls" showing up. But, instead of throwing them out, as I have done in the past, I let them grow alongside the other plants -keeping a close eye on those male preflowers. As the plants grew, they were smaller...more sluggish... "raggy" looking. And it became obvious that these bag seed plants were building flowers that contained about 50/50 percent male and female flower parts, I decided to move them into a separate area with my orchids. I decided to observe and study the process of how these intersex, bag seed plants grew -just for the heck of it!

About a month into flower, the bag seed plants began to stink...and I mean like real, real stinky, skunky, dank, delicious marijuana! At the same time, the flowers were full of balls AND pistols...but the pistol development started to exceed the ball development. After a few more weeks the trichomes on the bag seed plants had developed and the heads are huge and milky! I decided to chop most of the plants and froze the buds with the idea of making some fresh frozen bubble hash. At the same time, I left a few buds on the original plants to see if I can re-veg them.

I mean...I wouldn't have expected to get anything from this type of plant, but it's looking like they might end up producing some exceptional trichomes -albeit not in any kind of high-yielding way....but, still..

Also, interestingly, even though the plants produced all kinds of balls that opened to expose the inner 'nanner clusters.....none of them opened and dropped any pollen! Weird, huh?
 

SFnone

Well-Known Member
Dog bud supposedly originated on the West Coast. Then made it's way to Colorado, then Massachusetts. If it was from the Cali/Oregon boarder like people say, there's a good chance it was grown outdoors originally, which would probably mean there was a rogue male that made the seeds found by Chemdog. If it was indoor from the start, then it was likely an unplanned hermie that made the seeds.

As for how people learned to select females over hermaphrodites, that's pretty easy to figure out... females are more appealing to the eyes and don't give off pollen. Pretty easy to tell which makes a better smoke. True story, when I first started growing I was 16, and I didn't know anything. The first time I saw male flowers, I thought they were seeds, until they opened up and spilled pollen, then I figured it out. But I still smoked them! Bad idea. The pollen just gave me a head ache and cough. From then on I knew, male flowers aren't something to smoke. People have been growing weed for centuries... I'm sure they figured it out long ago.
 

tstick

Well-Known Member
Dog bud supposedly originated on the West Coast. Then made it's way to Colorado, then Massachusetts. If it was from the Cali/Oregon boarder like people say, there's a good chance it was grown outdoors originally, which would probably mean there was a rogue male that made the seeds found by Chemdog. If it was indoor from the start, then it was likely an unplanned hermie that made the seeds.

As for how people learned to select females over hermaphrodites, that's pretty easy to figure out... females are more appealing to the eyes and don't give off pollen. Pretty easy to tell which makes a better smoke. True story, when I first started growing I was 16, and I didn't know anything. The first time I saw male flowers, I thought they were seeds, until they opened up and spilled pollen, then I figured it out. But I still smoked them! Bad idea. The pollen just gave me a head ache and cough. From then on I knew, male flowers aren't something to smoke. People have been growing weed for centuries... I'm sure they figured it out long ago.
I probably wasn't as clear as I should have been... Are there any "true" females? Or, are ALL females, carriers of the potential to throw pollen? Some might be less prone to do it...Or, when they do, it's only a few 'nanners in late flower....But, again, are there any truly all-female marijuana plants? That should have been the way I asked my question. My Apologies.
 

amneziaHaze

Well-Known Member
no you get get female flower on a male. allsoo when you want female to turn make you use silver but if you want make to turn female you can use another cemical its really toxic and its hard to dose it but there is some youtube videos of people doing it and making females from males
 

tstick

Well-Known Member
no you get get female flower on a male. allsoo when you want female to turn make you use silver but if you want make to turn female you can use another cemical its really toxic and its hard to dose it but there is some youtube videos of people doing it and making females from males
That was going to be my next question! :)
 

xtsho

Well-Known Member
no you get get female flower on a male. allsoo when you want female to turn make you use silver but if you want make to turn female you can use another cemical its really toxic and its hard to dose it but there is some youtube videos of people doing it and making females from males
It's called Ethephon and people have been doing it before those youtube videos existed. It's used in the agriculture industry on both food and landscape plants and is no more toxic than some of the preservatives used in processed foods.
 

Bongoloid

Well-Known Member
I was thinking about the Chemdog story...Guy selling some exceptionally good weed at a Grateful Dead concert....Someone saved a few seeds that came in the bag and grew them out....the rest is history....something like that.

Anyway...It got me thinking about where those seeds came from. Were they seeds that came from a pollination involving a separate male plant? Or, were those seeds, likely produced from a 'nanner of the female plant, itself? And, IF it was a 'nanner that "fathered" the Chemdog, then wouldn't that tendency be carried on in any hybrid that would subsequently be made using the original Chemdog bag seed?

And, to take it another step backwards....How many of the old, original, landrace strains were likely to display tendencies for true hermaphrodites and/or intersex traits? When did growers start figuring out to select for cultivars that were less likely to produce 'nanners or throw up a bunch of mixed male and female flowers? And, by all rights, don't ALL seeds, regardless of breeders, carry these genetic predispositions to one degree or another?

Just to add another talking point...a more personal one...

In my latest grow, I decided to grow a couple of bag seeds that I got from a jar of recreational weed. Well, no surprise, when the plants started to show preflowers, there were some pistols AND "balls" showing up. But, instead of throwing them out, as I have done in the past, I let them grow alongside the other plants -keeping a close eye on those male preflowers. As the plants grew, they were smaller...more sluggish... "raggy" looking. And it became obvious that these bag seed plants were building flowers that contained about 50/50 percent male and female flower parts, I decided to move them into a separate area with my orchids. I decided to observe and study the process of how these intersex, bag seed plants grew -just for the heck of it!

About a month into flower, the bag seed plants began to stink...and I mean like real, real stinky, skunky, dank, delicious marijuana! At the same time, the flowers were full of balls AND pistols...but the pistol development started to exceed the ball development. After a few more weeks the trichomes on the bag seed plants had developed and the heads are huge and milky! I decided to chop most of the plants and froze the buds with the idea of making some fresh frozen bubble hash. At the same time, I left a few buds on the original plants to see if I can re-veg them.

I mean...I wouldn't have expected to get anything from this type of plant, but it's looking like they might end up producing some exceptional trichomes -albeit not in any kind of high-yielding way....but, still..

Also, interestingly, even though the plants produced all kinds of balls that opened to expose the inner 'nanner clusters.....none of them opened and dropped any pollen! Weird, huh?
Do most plants carry the intersex gene?. No,cannabis is dioecious,intersex is mutant but people have used them to breed that's why you see it so much now.
 

conor c

Well-Known Member
Most lines carry it id say not all strains do however there are a few that are firmly sexually stable and wont herm on you the uk cheese cut is a prime example if that herms it aint the real thing there are others im sure but you get the idea
That was going to be my next question! :)
Yes herms exist in both sexes in cannabis id say the female kinds slightly more common but with some lines its the opposite and you may struggle to find a true male
 

conor c

Well-Known Member
Do most plants carry the intersex gene?. No,cannabis is dioecious,intersex is mutant but people have used them to breed that's why you see it so much now.
True but it is present in alot of landrace type stuff and always has been but i agree 0 tolerance is the only way in breeding with this in mind and you gotta stress test both parents to be sure and kill anything that aint firm males or females imo
 

Bongoloid

Well-Known Member
True but it is present in alot of landrace type stuff and always has been but i agree 0 tolerance is the only way in breeding with this in mind and you gotta stress test both parents to be sure and kill anything that aint firm males or females imo
And hermans are also frequent in some hemp
 

conor c

Well-Known Member
And hermans are also frequent in some hemp
Yes but hemp is more supposed to be that way vs drug type cannabis some hemp is multi use crops ie seed fiber oil sure Himalayan strains can be all that plus charas types but id say there one of the exceptions to the norm
 

xtsho

Well-Known Member

Bongoloid

Well-Known Member
Yes but hemp is more supposed to be that way vs drug type cannabis some hemp is multi use crops ie seed fiber oil sure Himalayan strains can be all that plus charas types but id say there one of the exceptions to the norm
Yes I refer to drug strains with hemp pollen interacting prehaps causing this but I am aware of some Thai etc with hermy traits,it seems a lot of autos are going hermy too.
 

tstick

Well-Known Member
If all modern recreational genetics trace back to things like bag seed from Mexico, Thailand, Columbia, Africa, etc.. can we ever know if what we have started with, is truly "pure" dioecious genetics? Or, could it have been that all our starting landrace stock might have contained a propensity for producing male, sexual traits to one degree or another and now we've carried it on to this point through hybridization?

IF we knew at the start, that we had a 100% female marijuana plant, then would that plant be able to completely avoid the ability to produce 'nanners under, say a stressful environment? Or, would a pure female marijuana plant remain truly female and unable to produce any male traits -such as pollen via a 'nanner, regardless of environmental conditions?
 

Mason Jar 92705

Well-Known Member
The dominant state of cannabis is hemp/hermaphroditism. Any/most plants have the possibility of throwing nanners/herm etc. If we left it outside and didn’t mess with it, it would revert back to hemp in a few hundred years. That’s why, indoors, you always kill the first male to show sex. The only reason cannabis has drug traits, is because of man.
 

tstick

Well-Known Member
The dominant state of cannabis is hemp/hermaphroditism. Any/most plants have the possibility of throwing nanners/herm etc. If we left it outside and didn’t mess with it, it would revert back to hemp in a few hundred years. That’s why, indoors, you always kill the first male to show sex. The only reason cannabis has drug traits, is because of man.
Okay. So, there is really no way to guarantee a 100% female plant, regardless, because of the underlying hemp gene that produces hermaphrodites is always somewhere in the mix. And that means it is not abnormal for any female plant to throw 'nanners...It's just that some will throw fewer than others....correct? In other words, even with all the modern hybridization that's been going on, there are no 100% female-only plants, that are absolutely not capable of producing seed.....?

I'm really curious to know because I have grown bag seed many times. Sometimes, I've gotten clear-cut herms. Other times, I only got a few 'nanners in late flower. I've also grown seed that came from very reputable breeders and had those plants show some male traits, too. In my experience, it's a roll of the dice no matter what your seed source might be, that you will get some cross that will show male traits to one degree or another.
 

rasna

Well-Known Member
The dominant state of cannabis is hemp/hermaphroditism. Any/most plants have the possibility of throwing nanners/herm etc. If we left it outside and didn’t mess with it, it would revert back to hemp in a few hundred years. That’s why, indoors, you always kill the first male to show sex. The only reason cannabis has drug traits, is because of man.
no. It is not so. Read "Cannabis, complete guides" by Ernest Small or the book by Clarke and Merlin.
 
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