Droopy leaves after first feeding

Aqua Man said:

Ok can you give me all the info like temp humidity and all that.

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2x2x5 tent
135watt vivosun led 20” away from canopy.
24w t-5 fluorescent side lighting
Temp. Lowest 69 at night, highest 80 during day
Day range is 75-80
Humidity is 40-50%
50/50 FFOF and FFHF
Tap water ppm 175/ ph 6-6.3
Did I miss anything.. that’s all I can think of right now.

GanjaGreg. said:

2x2x5 tent
135watt vivosun led 20” away from canopy.
24w t-5 fluorescent side lighting
Temp. Lowest 69 at night, highest 80 during day
Day range is 75-80
Humidity is 40-50%
50/50 FFOF and FFHF
Tap water ppm 175/ ph 6-6.3
Did I miss anything.. that’s all I can think of right now.

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Hey man I'm impressed. Thats pretty good work ya did.

If you can get humidity to 60-65% you will see a bit better growth at this stage. Also will slow the nutrient uptake and stress on a tiny root system a bit so that will help reduce the symptoms of over feeding. This is a good thing at this stage.

Do you have a thermometer you can stick in the soil to get an idea of root zone temps? I don't see any signs of cool roots but hey let's just make sure.

Now you need to have a bit of air flow around the leaves. Most people put the fans blowing down on the top of the leaves. Well leaves breath on the underside so that's where you need to get some air movement... Just movement not making them dance all over. This will improve respiration greatly and ensure its getting optimal CO2, that will make a bigger difference than you think in growth. Again just movement no hurricanes. This goes hand in hand with humidity and temps so you can keep the stomata as wide open and as long as possible.

Now next thing is watering... so many grower over water and over feed causing huge stunting. Here is how it works. It's not actually to much water it's lack of oxygen. Overwatering symptoms are almost always watering to often not by giving to much water. So when you water water the media thoroughly but then the most important is to let it dry out well before watering again. If you fail to do this it can lead to uneven soil moisture and issues later in the grow. A good practice is to scratch up the top of the soil before watering each time, that will prevent the soil from channeling.

I think you light is about as close as you want it if it's a full spectrum I can give you an app to aid you. It's not ideal but it's free and better than nothing.

Let start there and see how it goes.

I'm not typically a soil grower but have a bit of experience so if any of you soil guys see something wrong please feel free to explain where I went wrong.

HashBucket said:

Something else you might want to consier.
I had a similar problem; couldn't figure out what the heck.

The room was getting too cold at night.
Check your room temp after the lights have been out for a few hours.

Just an idea.

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PS: I found that changing the ambient temp during lights out wasn't easy, so, I put a clone temp heating pad under the tray I kept clones in. Kept the roots nice and toasty.

With that tap water you should not need to ph your nutrients the soil will buffer the ph for you. It's been amended to do so. This may be a convtrersial opinion but we can also discuss this is people feel like.

If you have another container fill it with the same soil and lift it.Then after watering the plant lift that pot. That will give you a good idea when to water. You can even weigh both then write it down the difference is 100% when the pot weighs about 30% it's probably time to water. Now this is just a rough guide. If you see leaves drooping and the pot is light it's time to water and the plants should within hours perk back up You will get a feel for it but underwatering is much easier to correct than over watering.

Also water with tepid water never cold or hot

Aqua Man said:

Hey man I'm impressed. Thats pretty good work ya did.

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Thanks man, I’ve put in ridiculous hours of research these last couple months, I hope it pays off.

Aqua Man said:

Do you have a thermometer you can stick in the soil to get an idea of root zone temps? I don't see any signs of cool roots but hey let's just make sure.

Now you need to have a bit of air flow around the leaves. Most people put the fans blowing down on the top of the leaves. Well leaves breath on the underside so that's where you need to get some air movement... Just movement not making them dance all over. This will improve respiration greatly and ensure its getting optimal CO2, that will make a bigger difference than you think in growth. Again just movement no hurricanes. This goes hand in hand with humidity and temps so you can keep the stomata as wide open and as long as possible.

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So I have a thermometer sitting atop the soil.. is that sufficient? Or does it have to be IN the soil?

As far as air flow.. I had a small clip fan in the tent until yesterday.. I removed it because I have a dyson fan+ air filter oscillating in front of my tent.. and that thing puts out hella air.

This is today since midnight

So you can get a visual of my set up

GanjaGreg. said:

View attachment 4434169View attachment 4434170 This is today since midnight

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As long as your getting air flow to the underside of the leaves. Can you bring your temps up a bit more. Don't worry to much about the soil temp unless ita on a concrete floor or something. Just if you had a thermometer you could push into the soil it could give some insight.

You light may be a bit close. I would back it up to 24". The goal is to get leaf temps to about 74-78f. So if you can get air temps of 80f that should put you about right under that light.

Aqua Man said:

You light may be a bit close. I would back it up to 24". The goal is to get leaf temps to about 74-78f. So if you can get air temps of 80f that should put you about right under that light.

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I pulled the light back a bit.
What app were you talking about? I saw a few lux meters for iOS but I watched a video from migro and they said the lux meters don’t work on the blurples because a lot of the light is out side the range of the lux meter.

ps. I did install an app and saw something like 2000 lux in the center and around 950 on the outsides of the canopy. I didn’t test the t5 light just the led.

GanjaGreg. said:

I pulled the light back a bit.
What app were you talking about? I saw a few lux meters for iOS but I watched a video from migro and they said the lux meters don’t work on the blurples because a lot of the light is out side the range of the lux meter.

ps. I did install an app and saw something like 2000 lux in the center and around 950 on the outsides of the canopy. I didn’t test the t5 light just the led.

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Yeah he is right don't use a lux app on blurples. You should be good at 24"

GanjaGreg. said:

I pulled the light back a bit.
What app were you talking about? I saw a few lux meters for iOS but I watched a video from migro and they said the lux meters don’t work on the blurples because a lot of the light is out side the range of the lux meter.

ps. I did install an app and saw something like 2000 lux in the center and around 950 on the outsides of the canopy. I didn’t test the t5 light just the led.

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@Renfro So I think part of my problem is that I’m giving to much water per watering... it’s taking like 7days for these 6” pots to dry out.. I was taught to water til 20% runoff. Now I’m seeing that I somehow skipped the line that said that was only for when feeding with nutes.
ive been watering each plant with 150ml per watering.. I’m going to try 100ml maybe even 75 next watering.

That would be for coco not soil unless you are trying to flush. It's not uncommon to take 7-10 days depending on pot size at this age

Aqua Man said:

That would be for coco not soil unless you are trying to flush. It's not uncommon to take 7-10 days depending on pot size at this age

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GanjaGreg. said:

@Renfro So I think part of my problem is that I’m giving to much water per watering... it’s taking like 7days for these 6” pots to dry out.. I was taught to water til 20% runoff. Now I’m seeing that I somehow skipped the line that said that was only for when feeding with nutes.

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If using organic soil (meaning no bottle feed) then runoff just washes out the limited supply of nutrients in the soil. The runoff is for bottle fed plants where you don't want salts to accumulate in the soil.

Another note, if running organic soil, like TLO, and using RO water, you may need to use a little calmag since the water has no calcium or magnesium.

Renfro said:

If using organic soil (meaning no bottle feed) then runoff just washes out the limited supply of nutrients in the soil. The runoff is for bottle fed plants where you don't want salts to accumulate in the soil.

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I agree 100% just find 20% kinda high for soil. 5% maybe 10% but again that depends I guess on if you are feed water water, fees water feed etc..

Aqua Man said:

I agree 100% just find 20% kinda high for soil. 5% maybe 10% but again that depends I guess on if you are feed water water, fees water feed etc..

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Yeah I just feed, feed, feed.

Renfro said:

Yeah I just feed, feed, feed.

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So your growing in coco?

GanjaGreg. said:

So your growing in coco?

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Done it both.

These clones are vegging in a peat based mix, Berger BM6. They havent had plain water in their life. Feed at 1100 PPM with minimal runoff since i have no drainaige collection on them as babies.