Lights to avoid

UnEmploymentDude

Well-Known Member
Ehh I'm bored, just got back from the discount store. I had to pick up an extension cord for my flowering.. thing. Saw a 32 watt CFL and thought, damn for a dollar?!

Came home tried out the CFL, its fucking purple. The damn thing is giving out fucking purple light. The fuck?!

Note to all: Do not go to a discount store and buy a CFL made by "Sun lighting" Because I dont think the sun gives out purple light. And I doubt its giving out 120 watts of light either.

EDIT: Ok, I just googled "purple lighting growing" and got results saying that purple lighting is somehow good for plant growth?! GUWHA??!?!?!??!?!?!
 

recvryjst42day

Well-Known Member
purple is a mix of red and blue, might have some effect, did you check the charts on response of photosynthesis, i'll go try to find it. I remember reading about LED company's trying to push it for grow lights, i think as a supplement though, not as JUST the purp light....
 
L

lynchburgball

Guest
i'd add 15 halogen bulbs. they rule.

just kidding. don't do that.
 

babygro

Well-Known Member
EDIT: Ok, I just googled "purple lighting growing" and got results saying that purple lighting is somehow good for plant growth?! GUWHA??!?!?!??!?!?!
Well, what I can't really comment on is your light - I'd need to see a spectograph of its output to say whether it is a plant useful PURple light.

The PURple lights designed for plant growth do output an enhanced blue and red spectrum and a reduced yellow/green spectrum - that's why to human eyes these lights look Purple - it's the mix of the high outputs of red and blue. The human eye is most sensitive to the 500-600 nm light spectrum range, with the peak at about 550. This is the nm range that contains the most yellow and green light, and the light spectrum range that plants simply do not use for either photosynthesis or chlorophyll synthesis which takes place entirely in the 400-500 blue nm range and 600-700 red/orange nm range. This is also why plants leaves look green to us, because all colours the human eye sees is reflected light and as plants do not absorb any green spectrum light - but reflect it - that's why it appears green to us. I have seen some research done that suggests plants are sensitive to yellow light, but there's no evidence that they actually use it for any plant important functions.

Because PURple lights output enhanced blue and red spectrum light, which is the light spectrum plants mostly use, and reduced green/yellow, their PAR rating (Photosynthetic Active Radiation) which is the light plants actually use (ie mostly the blue and red spectrums) is high - somewhere around 80% PAR output, not a 100% because it still contains some yellow/green light.

This also explains why HID lights, which output HUGE amounts of that yellow/green light that plants simply do not use, have such HUGE lumen ratings. Lumens is a light measurement, that measures light the human eye sees (not the light that plants see) - which is light in that yellow/green spectrum.

This is the reason that HID lights (MH or HPS) are extremely expensive to run in terms of their lumen per PAR watts as opposed to their lumen per watts ratings. A HPS or MH will output something like 20-40% PAR, so whilst it may have very high lumen outputs, the actual plant useable light is only between 20-40% of that total lumen rating. So for a 250w HPS outputting say 25,000 lumens, only about 5,000 - 10,000 of those lumens are in the plant useable light spectrum. Compare that to a 200w PURple CFL, which outputs 13,700 lumens of which 80% will be in the plant useable light spectrum. So 13,700 x 80% = 10,950, roughtly the same as the higher level of the 250w HPS.

The major difference of course is the cost to operate. A 200w PURple CFL draws 161w, a 250w Magnetic HPS will draw 300 watts and a digital one about 260-70.

Not hard to see then that you're paying upwards of double the running cost of the 250w HPS compared to the PURple CFL for the same plant useable light.

Don't take my word for this. See for yourself at nlite - Flourescent CFL and take a look particularly at the spectographs of the PURple light and the 6,400k Daylight and see the differences in red, blue and yellow/green outputs.
 

FilthyFletch

Mr I Can Do That For Half
Rule number 1 if you absolutly must do a cfl grow which is a real wast of time do not buld any cfl under a true 150 watt bulb not equal to 150 watt but a 150 watt bulb.These will be long u shaped not spiral and will be about 10 inches long
 

videoman40

Well-Known Member
CFL's actually, even in vegging, take longer to mature than hid lighting.
If you look at babygro's growlog, you'll see where it took 2 months to reach 11", so what you thought you saved in electricity, you actually spent, because it took you 3 times the norm to get there.

I dont know about you, but I get 11" in under 3 weeks, not 8 weeks.
Peace

Rule of all Rules, CLF is only used to light up your house and save energy. Not for growing.
 

GoodFriend

Lumberjack
Why's that? Because you say so? :roll:
duh bg!


lol

no, but one does also have to remember, the low watt cfls (42w and less) are only putting out like 3000 lumens or less... and more of them just increases the coverage of the 3000 lumens, it doesn't make the total lumens increase also...

so if you do use cfls, you'll get a lot more decent results with one big one (like 85w or higher) than a bunch of small ones

...i'm fairly certain that's all correct... lol, bg can you back that up or tell me where i'm wrong? thanks
 

babygro

Well-Known Member
If you look at babygro's growlog, you'll see where it took 2 months to reach 11", so what you thought you saved in electricity, you actually spent, because it took you 3 times the norm to get there.
My plants were significantly taller than 11 inches at 8 weeks I'm afraid Videoman, have a look at the height they were at when I switched to flowering, which was just into the eigth week mark. 11 inches they were not, more like 18-20.

Also, even different pheno's within the same strain will grow at different heights and it also depends on the amount of Sativa to Indica in them. Would have thought you'd have known that really.

It's true you should get quicker growth with HID lights in veg, particularly HPS, but much of that 'assumed' greater veg growth is actually just a lot of stretching. The predominant blue light of daylight CFL's give you tighter internodes than HPS's, so the height differences can be quite misleading for those who don't understand all the issues.

Nevertheless, it's time for me to demonstrate Fluorescents superiority over HIDs and as soon as I'm ready to do so, I shall do exactly that.

Perhaps you'd like to take me on Videoman in a Fluorescent v HID grow face off, parameters yield per watt and yield per sq foot and yield per kw of electricity used? Want to put your money where your mouth is?
 

GoodFriend

Lumberjack
now THAT would be interesting

two best friends going at it!!!! =]

(i tease i tease)
though it would be a nice lil comp...
 

videoman40

Well-Known Member
Babygro, you like to assume alot. You do know what they say about assuming, right?

I've never experienced stretching from HID lighting, sorry. And I use a hps, not even mh. As a matter of fact, I'm usually impressed with how tight my plants grow.

The only thing I have noticed different is that the hps light gives a much darker green tint to the plant. Big deal.

I think stretching is due to more to poor genetics, than from using hid lighting, because as I already said, I've never experienced it. The only other reason I can see for stretching is if they take your advice and place there light 36" away from the tops of there plants. That'll induce stretching for sure.

Now you say your plants were more like 18-20? yet in your grow log, you state that at day 43, one week prior to flowering they were, and I quote you:
"The tallest is now about 11 or 12 inches high so I really need to switch to 12/12 asap really."

So far as a challenge, HID vs CFL, I'd be happy to help with this study, purely for educational purposes of course.
Peace

My plants were significantly taller than 11 inches at 8 weeks I'm afraid Videoman, have a look at the height they were at when I switched to flowering, which was just into the eigth week mark. 11 inches they were not, more like 18-20.

Also, even different pheno's within the same strain will grow at different heights and it also depends on the amount of Sativa to Indica in them. Would have thought you'd have known that really.

It's true you should get quicker growth with HID lights in veg, particularly HPS, but much of that 'assumed' greater veg growth is actually just a lot of stretching. The predominant blue light of daylight CFL's give you tighter internodes than HPS's, so the height differences can be quite misleading for those who don't understand all the issues.

Nevertheless, it's time for me to demonstrate Fluorescents superiority over HIDs and as soon as I'm ready to do so, I shall do exactly that.

Perhaps you'd like to take me on Videoman in a Fluorescent v HID grow face off, parameters yield per watt and yield per sq foot and yield per kw of electricity used? Want to put your money where your mouth is?
 

beenthere donethat

Well-Known Member
Vid...

I've asked for pics in his Kalikichara thread. After all of his spewing and continuous downgrading of others and their lights/appraches to growing...He needs to *seriously* document these grows via pics...not a thesis.

I've been PM'd by quite a few folks who are hesitant to post due to his condescending posts and authorative postion. NO ONE here grows as good as babygro (according to him)...yet...we see no finished grows or proof of the knowledge through mega yielding gardens...we only see words and downtalk about how crappy the majority of pot growers lights are. (the majority uses hps, sorry)

poundage babygro...we wanna see big bowls of buds...MORE than we grow from our crappy hps's... show us. I'll scrap all my hps's if you can show me a POUND of pot you grew with a CFL.

let's see it.
 

wafflehouselover

Well-Known Member
actually if you know how to use hps correctly then your plants won't stretch. HPS gives off different spectrum at a certain distance.

I grow like 1 ft in a wk using hps and the internode is about 1 inch apart, a lil bit longer then my MH grow.

so videoman +1 for
I think stretching is due to more to poor genetics, than from using hid lighting, because as I already said, I've never experienced it. The only other reason I can see for stretching is if they take your advice and place there light 36" away from the tops of there plants. That'll induce stretching for sure.



 

SportsterMoe

Active Member
Would someone please give us noobs an idea of what those mean?
HPS?
HID- This one is High Intensity Discharge...like a streetlight?
CFL- Compact Florescent? The ones with the ballast in the base
CLF?

I just want to know what light unit will be best for a small grow...???
 
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