national health care...how awesome!

beardo said:
You cant force me to buy healthcare insurance.
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You have a choice. You can get health insurance or pay a fine to compensate for uninsured ER usage. NP. No one is putting a gun to your head. You have a choice. Just because you don't like either option doesn't mean you have no choices.

What about all the uninsured people out there who just get all their health care from ER's for free? You don't think they should have to pay something to compensate for abusing the system? These people increase insurance prices for everyone else. How is that fair that they pay nothing and we pay for them? They should be fined imo.
 
Dan Kone said:
You have a choice. You can get health insurance or pay a fine to compensate for uninsured ER usage. NP. No one is putting a gun to your head. You have a choice. Just because you don't like either option doesn't mean you have no choices.

What about all the uninsured people out there who just get all their health care from ER's for free? You don't think they should have to pay something to compensate for abusing the system? These people increase insurance prices for everyone else. How is that fair that they pay nothing and we pay for them? They should be fined imo.
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Fuck handing out fines they can't afford Health insurance how the fuck are they gonna afford to pay fines LOL.......Maybe the ER should just refuse care? I mean its not as though there is some sort of oath that says Doctors must help those that are sick....Is there? LOL.......here is the deal with universal Health Care....It works....I can go to any hospital in Canada and receive care free for the most part....Even though our current band of miscreant politicians have been adding user fees and dropping services for the past 15 years it is still affordable....yes we pay a lot in taxes but its not as much as Americans pay for their own health insurance on a per ca-pita basis.
The people of the US really do want health care for everyone...It is the giant insurance corporations and all of their shareholders that want no part of it. Why? it is way more profitable to stay with the current system...just ask AHIP the biggest insurance lobbyist in DC.....Just so we are all clear here the Insurance industry spends 123 million a year give or take a few hundred in Washington DC to lobby the government against things like healthcare reform along with anything else that may have an effect on their profit margin. Another tidbit of information that may help some folks understand politics a little bit better......there are currently 40,000 lobbyists in DC....... LOL.....that is exactly 400 lobbyists for every senator in DC....Things a little clearer now? they should be.....:peace:
 
canuckgrow said:
...Even though our current band of miscreant politicians have been adding user fees and dropping services for the past 15 years it is still affordable....
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uh, i think thats our point. do you see a trend where this will be reversed? didnt think so. do you see a point where THEY will deny service altogether? you should.

your system, like every system like it, will implode. its happening in europe now. all the socialist systems are cracking at the seams and are starting to go more freemarket.

btw, most of your political class and elites come down here for major needs. that should tell you all you need to know.

our system needs fixes no doubt. tort reform, cross state insurance and other things. but it doesnt need a central govt fucking everything up.

also, in canada, you dont have to defend shit. we take care of that for you. you wouldnt be able to mount a legitimate army if you ever came under a real threat.
 
jeff f said:
uh, i think thats our point. do you see a trend where this will be reversed? didnt think so. do you see a point where THEY will deny service altogether? you should.

your system, like every system like it, will implode. its happening in europe now. all the socialist systems are cracking at the seams and are starting to go more freemarket.

btw, most of your political class and elites come down here for major needs. that should tell you all you need to know.

our system needs fixes no doubt. tort reform, cross state insurance and other things. but it doesnt need a central govt fucking everything up.

also, in canada, you dont have to defend shit. we take care of that for you. you wouldnt be able to mount a legitimate army if you ever came under a real threat.
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Spoken like someone who knows nothing about Canada......Its not the system that is broken or flawed it is the people that run it. Furthermore it is universal healthcare not socialism or even the dreaded communism....hey if you dig deep enough you could likely tie universal healthcare to terrorism.
About our Army....We could go back to the time during the American Revelation where you guys tried to invade us and our young Army chased you out....then again during the war of 1812.....Or lets skid ahead to WWII when we declared was on Nazi Germany in 1939 committed troops and equipment even though our own soil was never attacked.....When did the US declare war? oh yeah 1941 only after a direct attack on US soil........Want to discuss why the US stayed out of the war until then?

Defend us against what? Your statement says we don't have a real threat at present but you need to defend us against it? In what world does this make any sense?


If you want to have a pissing match about Canada Vs. USA at least try a little harder to come up with something that makes some sense.



I think it is in fact you who missed my point by a long shot......Our system is not perfect but it is better than yours......we live longer with a higher standard of living so I'm not sure why so many of you are so attached to the "American Way"
Not wanting to come off as a dick that hates the US.......But I do hate that sort of attitude about Canada especially when it is grossly uninformed.
 
canuckgrow said:
Its not the system that is broken or flawed it is the people that run it.
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do you realize how inane this sounds? you have a system that hands control of medical care over to government, blame the people in government for all that is wrong with it, and then try to claim that it isn't the system that's to blame. you've just blamed government and government is the system. you're sticking you head in the sand, all because of what you think you're getting for free. good luck with that.
 
My boss who is from canada says it is okay for doc visits and xrays and your normal medical needs.
But when it comes to serious stuff he and his parents and most of their friends have that stuff done in the states.
So your healthcare is not what you think it is.And like i said they live and are from canada.
So if thats not enough to convince me that i do not want the same care,I don't know what is.
 
All systems are run by people, that's why communism can't work. American style bureaucracy and budgeting retardation is why national healthcare is a poor idea here.
 
Dan Kone said:
You have a choice. You can get health insurance or pay a fine to compensate for uninsured ER usage. NP. No one is putting a gun to your head. You have a choice. Just because you don't like either option doesn't mean you have no choices.

What about all the uninsured people out there who just get all their health care from ER's for free? You don't think they should have to pay something to compensate for abusing the system? These people increase insurance prices for everyone else. How is that fair that they pay nothing and we pay for them? They should be fined imo.
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what if you don't pay your fine ...then what do you reccomend?
 
undertheice said:
do you realize how inane this sounds? you have a system that hands control of medical care over to government, blame the people in government for all that is wrong with it, and then try to claim that it isn't the system that's to blame. you've just blamed government and government is the system. you're sticking you head in the sand, all because of what you think you're getting for free. good luck with that.
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What part of the sentence are you having trouble understanding? I never once said I was getting anything for free in fact the opposite I've admitted that we pay for it through our taxes.......The people that run it and are responsible are the Healthcare CEO's that make 250,000-300,000 /year down to the uber lazy unionized Janitor and or other health care workers making too much for too little work......The system can be a lot better if it is run properly....like any system. If you can't understand the difference between a system and those who run it then I can't even begin to help you.
 
Mindmelted said:
My boss who is from canada says it is okay for doc visits and xrays and your normal medical needs.
But when it comes to serious stuff he and his parents and most of their friends have that stuff done in the states.
So your healthcare is not what you think it is.And like i said they live and are from canada.
So if thats not enough to convince me that i do not want the same care,I don't know what is.
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Thats funny I live here...Have all my life and I don't know anyone personally that has ever gone to the US for any treatment of any kind what so ever. Oh there was a government MP down east that had a procedure done in Virginia that he didn't feel like waiting for in Canada.......Sure there are some who want to skip the line ahead of everyone else and they can even afford to do it....more power to them.....I say it is way fewer than you suggest and I believe myself to be the more credible witness based on WHERE I LIVE.....So W/E toss your not even hearsay out somewhere else dude
 
MrDank007 said:
All systems are run by people, that's why communism can't work. American style bureaucracy and budgeting retardation is why national healthcare is a poor idea here.
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Well you do have a word in that sentence that does make sense to me "retardation"
 
canuckgrow said:
Well you do have a word in that sentence that does make sense to me "retardation"
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You just said it yourself ...CEOs, unions, janitors. Just wait till we get ahold of an opportunity to abuse, bloat and make something inefficient. It will be a malfunctioning, bankrupting clusterfuck.

The evidence is the current state of things and our other entitlement programs. You are attempting to delineate a system and the people who run it. But it is short sighted to factor out the inevitable human nature component. It is not in our nature for national healthcare to succeed here. Its proponents are dreaming.
 
Ha ha ha... i went to the doctors today, had xrays and my pregnant wife had all her checkups. Last month my son had his teeth checked, cleaned and 1 filling.... For all of that i paid nothing. So keep arguing the point, hell vote obama out, you were destined not to agree with each other..... obama was a fool for thinking you were ready for good healthcare.
 
Before government can guarantee a provision of a specific good or service to any one individual, thus creating a so called "positive right", it must first take by force the means of producing that very good or service from someone else.

But how can taking what belongs to another through legislative force (their time, their labor their money) be a right?

Is that not the very essence of slavery?

The truth is that the only rights actually guaranteed to Americans by the Constitution are those that protect freedom of action. They are “negative rights,” which do exactly the opposite of their positive counterparts. Rather than initiate and rely on the use of force to produce a specific reward or outcome, negative rights allow individuals to act or not act in the absence of coercion, so long as they do not hinder the freedom of others to do the same.

-excerpted from an essay by Josh Eboch
 
sputniknz said:
Ha ha ha... i went to the doctors today, had xrays and my pregnant wife had all her checkups. Last month my son had his teeth checked, cleaned and 1 filling.... For all of that i paid nothing. So keep arguing the point, hell vote obama out, you were destined not to agree with each other..... obama was a fool for thinking you were ready for good healthcare.
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For all that I paid nothing....? How WAS it paid for sputniknz, magic ?
 
Rob Roy said:
For all that I paid nothing....? How WAS it paid for sputniknz, magic ?
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of course it's magic. it's also magic that pays for the extensive government bureaucracy needed to oversee those magically appearing funds. like all magic, it's really a matter of misdirection. just don't tell that to the rubes.
 
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